# First Aquarium....



## Alyssa (Jul 8, 2009)

Hi! I am looking into purchasing a freshwater aquarium with community fish. 
I originally wanted a small tank with only guppies, but now am looking into a medium-large with some or all of the following. The question mark means I am not sure about them.
Guppies- 
Blue neon, red blonde?, and other "fancy" guppies
Tetras-
neon, glowlight
Red swordtail
Cory Cats ?
Panda? (any other interesting ones would be great)
Long-finned and/or normal zebra danios
Glofish (zebra danio with a "borrowed" gene-http://www.glofish.com/faq.asp#TheScienceofGloFish
Endlers Livebearer? more info please...?
Gourami
Honey?
Mollys
Dalmation?
Platys- Sunset?



I think these are all compatible, but would like to know more about them. I am thinking around: Guppies- start with 5, and watch them multiply?..
Tetra- 11
Swordtail- 3
Danio- 3 or 5 zebra, 6 glofish
cory- 1,2, or 3
E. Livebearer- 3 or 5
Gourami- 3?
molly-3
platys- 3

Also, I was thinking a 20-40 gallon. I will probably look for something on Craigslist, but do you know any kits or anything that are reasonably priced? Is this OK?
http://www.petco.com/product/11543/...=42959e41-6b87-11de-9c1b-000423bb4e79#details
Any other info is greatly appriciated- like breeds of Cories or any other recommended fish. What types of plants? Alive and fake? How many hides? What gravel? What food? A friend has this: http://www.aquatichouse.com/Maintenance_files/MagFloat.asp
It works well, is it OK for me?

Sorry, all I have had are Bettas and fair goldfish.
-Alyssa


----------



## Toshogu (Apr 24, 2009)

looks to me you're gonna want a 40gallon. If you go 20gal you're prolly gonna want to purchase 2. That way you can make one 20gal the show tank, and the other your sump. Stick the heater, emperor500, powerhead, and any other life support stuff down there, and run an overflow box into the sump intake so you can have a contineous siphon. But that's if you're gonna go 20gal with all that fish.


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

With that mix of fish, which will all get along fine by the way, you will soon find yourself up to your eyeballs in fry. You'll need more tanks, or at least a pretty big one for starters. Actually, for all of those fish you'll need a big one anyway, even without fry.


----------



## Tallonebball (Apr 6, 2009)

Yeah im with both on this one, you should def go with a 40, and if you could go bigger, then maybe go bigger into the 50's or 65's. I would also say to have about 5 or 6 cories as they like groups. And also along with them, you've got guppies, mollies, platys, and swordtails, all who have live young pretty frequently so be ready to fish some babies out lol.


----------



## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

Hi and welcome to FF!

You have 5 types of livebearers there, which is why they are saying you'll need more tanks for fry. I would choose 2 types and leave the others out. Your tank would quickly get overstocked with 5 types of livebearers. Swordtails look similar to Platies...they just have the sword. Endlers are really small, but pretty. Guppies are really nice. I would choose 2 types and stick with those. Then later on you'll need another tank for more livebearers!

In a 20-40 gallon tank I would stick with 1 gourami. Cories definitely need groups, so you'll want to have atleast 5 or 6.

If you get both Danios and Tetras, I would go with atleast 6 of each...and go with a 40g tank. In a 20g, you should choose between the 2 and only have 1 school.

Hope that helps!


----------



## StripesAndFins (Dec 31, 2008)

i agree with southern belle about keeping 1 gourami.

for the danios, get a school of 6-8 as they can be quite nippy when in small groups. Mine get a little nippy sometimes and they are in a school of 6. 

also if you want livebearers, stick with one or two types as they will multiply and quickly overload your tank with fry. 

and the cories like groups of 3+ (5 is better but most say 3 is minimum) my dentist had a tank with 1 cory in it and it stayed in the back right corner and occasionally went to the front of the tank to feed and look through the gravel.

i dont know much about the tetras so i would go with Belle here, but again i dont really know. if you want these fish i would say get a 40+ gallon tank

Hope this helps and good luck!


----------



## Tallonebball (Apr 6, 2009)

Actually glo-fish are a type of danio so they would probably group with any other type of danio so I don't really think there would be a big need to get two separate shoals because they will probably end up together. 
If you are doing honey gouramis then they will be fine together, but most other types wont be 
I also agree with picking on or two different live bearers, mollies, platys, and swords are all very similar so I would pick on of them and then choose between endlers or guppies


----------



## Alyssa (Jul 8, 2009)

Again, any starter kits would be great. Or links to tanks, filters, hoods, and other accessories would be helpful. 
I can't decide between guppies and E. Livebearers. So I was thinking 5 guppies- 3 Male 2 Female, and then 3 or 5 male Endlers. I read they can interbreed, would the male Endlers breed with the female guppies? Would the offspring be unable to reproduce? What would they look like? If I got one and not the other I would get 7: 4 female, 5 male. What do you think I should choose?
9 Neon tetra
3 Swordtails- 1 M 2 F? or should I go with 5? 
Danio- 3 LF zebra, 6 glofish (will these interbreed? what will be the result?)
Cory- 3 or 5 Are pandas the only option for my tank?
1 Gourami- Honey? Any other suggestions for gouramis? 

So 40 is still the smallest tank, right? Unless I do the two 20 gallons? 

I am so lost. But I think it will be worth it in the end. How long do I let the tank run before adding fish? Which should be introduced later since they do better in established tanks? What kind of live plants? Any live plants? How crowded should the tanks be with hides and stuff?


----------



## Albino_101 (Aug 14, 2008)

Let the tank run for about 2 weeks with the filters running, you don't need to turn on the light or heater yet. Petsmart and Petco usually have aquarium starter kits, with all those fish you could start with a 29 gallon but would need at least a 40 gallon later on.


----------



## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

I don't like the starter kits because usually the equipment in them isn't great and you have to upgrade it, so you might as well start from scratch. If you don't want live plants, you could get a tank and a hood combo and stand, then piece together the other equipment.

Aquaclear filters are really good. For a 20g the Aquaclear 50 is what you'd want and for a 40g, the Aquaclear 70 or 110.

Visitherm Stealth heaters are good. 5 watts per gallon is recommended, so for a 20g you'll want a 100w and for a 40g you'll want a 200w. It can't hurt to have one that is more though....more is better than less.  Some people recommend 2 heaters in case one dies, but I don't do that and (knock on wood) I've never had an issue.

As far as substrate goes, you can use any gravel or sand. I would choose something small, since food can get trapped in big river rock gravel and cause issues.

For the list of fish you want, a 40g or larger is definitely best. Its possible you could be fine with a 30g (36") but that is the very least I'd recommend. You will want to have extra tanks for raising fry if you plan on saving them. 

The Danios might school together, but just in case, I'd probably have 4 of the LF zebras and then 4-6 of the others. I would get 2 males and 4 female guppies or all males. The guppies and Endlers might interbreed. 

If you go with a 40g, there are alot of Cory options. See what your local fish stores carry before buying.

For a 40g you could do a Honey or Pearl gourami. Others are more aggressive. 

3 or 5 Swordtails would be fine.

You'll want to cycle the tank. That is about a 4 week process. Fishless is a good way to do it...you'll want some pure ammonia or you can use fish food or a raw shrimp. That will get some good bacteria growing in your tank. The Cories should probably be last, especially if you go with Pandas. The danios could probably go first, then Swords, then Tetras, Guppies, Gourami, and Cories. If you decide not to do a fishless cycle, definitely add fish a few at a time, starting with the longfin Danios.

2 weeks is not long enough for the tank to cycle and does nothing if you aren't adding an ammonia source (fish, food, ammonia....).

The type of Live Plants depends on your lighting. If you use lighting that comes with a tank, its usually pretty low, so you'll be stuck with Anubias species, Java fern, Java moss, Anacharis, and maybe Hornwort, to name a few.


----------



## betta0fish (Feb 16, 2009)

i agree with keeping only 2 types of livebearers. I started with 3 platies and now i have about 15


----------



## Toshogu (Apr 24, 2009)

Look at some of the USA aquapod tanks that are there, they are really for Saltwater, but make excelent freshwater tanks, because of the overkill filtration, they usually have a three stage wetdry sumpfilter built right into the back of the aquarium.


----------



## N0z (Jun 3, 2009)

i wouldnt get Gourami because they ate all my fish in my aquarium including guppies, neon, hill stream loach and a ruby shark.


----------



## Tallonebball (Apr 6, 2009)

Honey gouramis would never get big enough to eat a hillstream loach, ruby shark, or even a guppy so I don't know what type of gourami you had noz.... Giant perhaps? lol


----------



## COM (Mar 15, 2008)

I would recommend not getting any sort of a starter kit. This will give you a decent tank, a crappy filter that is too small, and junk lighting. Usually they will throw in some cheap food and some other useless stuff too to make it seem like a better value.

I would also suggest that you start with one or two species of fish and then very very slowly add the others. It is possible with modern products like Bio-Spira or Stability to put in a full load all at once, but for an absolute beginner this could prove disastrous as things can quickly go awry. I'd suggest starting with the guppies as they are extremely hardy.


----------



## Alyssa (Jul 8, 2009)

OK, thanks everyone!
I went to petco today to get some stuff for my other pets, and also looked at the kits and fish. You're right, the pre-made kits don't seem to have the best accessories, and also have some worthless food. I am getting my fish and tank setup from a freshwater fish store some relatives recommend, so hopefully they have or can order what I need, and maybe give me some discounts on the fish and accessories!
I am going to get guppies first, along with some LF danios. Next, the tetras and glofish. Then, the gourami and swordtails. Finally, the cory cats.


----------



## Alyssa (Jul 8, 2009)

Sorry for the double post, but the same relatives who I mentioned earlier are planning on getting a larger tank around December for their many discus fish and are willing to give me their 59 gallon. Also, I was hoping that if I provided enough protection and plants that a few of the baby swords and guppies might survive. So if I have a (almost) 60 gallon should I go with two gouramies? Or stick with one? I am going to the Ocean Floor tomorrow to check it out.


----------



## Toshogu (Apr 24, 2009)

lol sweet score on the 59gal. Get the 20gal tank then. That way when you inherit the 59gal you can turn it into a sump/refugium which will up your total gallonage to 80. You'll have a set up much like mine where all the filtration and equipment is hidden underneith in the 20gal.


----------



## Alyssa (Jul 8, 2009)

Haha, this might work out perfectly!- I have a 20 gallon long that has mice in it but I also have a bunch of smaller tanks I could put them in temporarily. I'll have to make sure it still holds water, but I've only had it for a month or so, it should be fine. I just hope they didn't chew the silicone off... but I do have silicone sealant, could I "patch" up holes with that? What should I clean the tank with? I mean just water or some special cleaner.

Thanks!


----------



## Alyssa (Jul 8, 2009)

They also have a 55 gallon that I think I am going to have instead, but I need to get a filter and everything, but it has a stand. 


I was wondering if I could get a pair of African Dwarf Frogs for my tank. I know they eat fry, but would a few survive with enough hiding places?


----------



## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

I think having a tank with a hang on back filter or a canister filter (or both for a 59g tank) is alot easier for a beginner, than a sump setup. Having to plumb everything and figure out how to go about making it work is a little overwhelming, so I suggest just doing the other types of filtration instead.

Awesome find on the 55g and 59g.  Save the 20L for a second tank. You'll be wanting one soon anyways. Or since the mice might have chewed the silicone, just buy a second tank whenever you're ready. I wouldn't try to patch holes. Silicone doesn't bond well to itself, so you'd have to take all the silicone off and then reseal it inside the tank...if it leaked. Too much work IMO for a $30 tank. 

You could have more than one Gourami, but it really depends on what type you get. If you want Honey or Pearl Gouramis, they are usually fine in a pair or a trio. Dwarf Gouramis tend to be more aggressive, so I'd either have 1 or 4. For Blue, 3-spot, or Gold Gouramis, I'd stick with just one. And while sometimes it works out to mix Gourami types, its safer to just stick with one type. 

African Dwarf Frogs might be ok. They tend to be hard to feed, especially when you have fast eaters, like Gouramis and Tetras. They usually only eat frozen foods too. I think it would be easier to keep them in a smaller tank so that feeding them wouldn't be a hassle.


----------



## Toshogu (Apr 24, 2009)

OH biggest thing I forgot to mention, buy a bottle of "Seachem Stability" and use as directed. Also make sure to stick in one or two fish to keep the Stability bugs fed and don't add more fish all at once, do it in two's and three's and give your Biofilter a day or two to catch up. Neon tetra's and the small fish you could prolly get away with adding like 10 all at once. But make sure to toss a bit of the Stability in too. Seachem Stability = instant Biofilter = happy safe fish.


----------

