# Urgent help required.



## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

I know I'm not usually one to be in a dilemma, but I need your opinion.
I've just come back from work and noticed that my dogcatfish has been bitten in half, probably by my snakehead again (Due to the teeth marks). The worrying thing is he's still alive and swimming.
What should I do?


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## Lydia (Feb 6, 2005)

What is the scientific name? I can't find anything whatsoever about a dog catfish. Is the fish literally bitten in half?


BTW what happened to the fish that got swallowed a month or so ago? Did it survive?


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

A dog catfish is a kind of talking catfish, named because of the sound it makes. (deep growls/barks).
Yes, the sucking loach that got swollowd a couple fo months ago has all his fins grown back again.


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## Lydia (Feb 6, 2005)

did the catfish literally get bitten in half? or is part of his tail bitten off? what is the damage like?


I'm glad your loach is alright


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

His tail got bitten off. It looks quite bad. You can see half his spinal chord.


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## Lydia (Feb 6, 2005)

ouch. Maybe it would be best to just kill him. That seems like it may be too much damage to overcome. Is it still swimming well?


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## flynngriff (Jan 19, 2005)

I would recommend killing it... If the wound is that large its tail will likely never grow back, and while it might survive, it would never be able to swim properly. I think it's more humane to end it now. Sorry, man!

-Flynn


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

He can't swim well, he's been in the same place pumping his gills hard. 
What shall I do?


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## Lydia (Feb 6, 2005)

You should probably go ahead and kill him. I don't think it will be able to recover, and, while it may still hang on for a little longer, it probably won't live much longer anyways.


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

He's still alive hiding under a plant. I don't know what to do.


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## Chazwick (Aug 24, 2005)

I suggest you euthanase the fish - it'll be in pain, it's best you do so. In nature, it would've died, you'll just do what's best.


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

:shock: I haven't got the heart to do that, someone tell me what to do.


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## flynngriff (Jan 19, 2005)

I don't really think there are any other good options for you...

You could isolate it in a hospital tank, and hope it recovers, but you'd have to keep it pretty much isolated from any other aggressive fish for the rest of its life. I suspect it would simply suffer until it dies, but you never know.

I really would recommend that you euthanase it. I know it's hard to do, but what's more important? Your fish not suffering, or your own "not having the heart to do it"?

I'm really sorry, I know it's a hard thing to do, but you really should just get it over with.

-Flynn


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## Hamm35924 (Jun 13, 2005)

I would not be able to kill him either. And if he's still alive and kicking after that fight, then i think you should give him another chance. Put him in a hospital tank and see if he starts to heal, he'll probably never be the same, but you never know till you try right? if he gets better maybe you could put him in a more peacful commmunity tank if you have one?


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## Imbrium (Feb 7, 2005)

You need to put the poor thing out of it's misery. Part of being a good owner is being able to make the hard decisions. If you can't do it, get somebody else to do it for you. And if the snakehead keeps injuring other fish, don't keep other fish with it.


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## azn1stknightsou (Aug 25, 2005)

Isolate it and keep it for an extended period of time. If the fish does not show progress within that period of time (say 3 months) then I would put it out of its misery. Personally, I have very little experience, but this is only what I thought would be the most humane way. You give the fish a sure fire fighting chance and when you see that all hope is lost, then you end the pain.


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## Lydia (Feb 6, 2005)

I had a fish once that got attacked badly when I was gone and was missing its eyes and almost all of its fins. I couldn't kill it though! It was still swimming! So a guy I know flushed it. It was almost funny even though it was sad because the fish started swimming down the toilet hole before he flushed it. So I know what you mean CM. Maybe if you isolate it it will survive! But you would probably have to have a seperate tank for it for the rest of it's life. And it would probably be in pain for the rest of it's life. So I would just kill it.


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## LydiaGreen (Aug 5, 2005)

Euthanize the fish. I have a red cap who got stuck in one of those stupid artificial logs awhile ago. Bubbles lost the majority of the scales on one side and the same on the other plus a hunk of meat. ALOT of TLC isolated in a 20 gallon tank and he is showing some progress - he'll live and be able to function as a normal, healthy red cap with scars. It's been a LONG time, he's been treated with maracyn, fed blood worms and high-protein cichlid food to speed healing, twice weekly 50% water changes, filtration for 60 gallons is on this 20 gallon tank. He's healing, but it's SLOWLY despite all of my best efforts.

Your fish will NEVER have a normal life and the fact that you can see part of his spinal cord means he will be septic VERY SOON. Septic = one heckofalot of pain. Don't make the poor fish suffer, but don't flush him either. A HUMANE way to put down a fish is to put him in a ziploc bag or rubbermaid container with water out of it's own tank and put it in the freezer. As the water cools, the fish falls asleep and dies in his sleep when the water is cold enough. No pain, no trauma.


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## Jonno (May 22, 2005)

I suggest you put it out its misery if you move it to a hospital tank ur just going to make it be in more pain, but at the end of the day the choice is up to you!


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## Chazwick (Aug 24, 2005)

You DO NOT have a heart if you cannot put the animal out of it's misery! If it happened to say.. a dog, then you'd take it to the vets to be put down, you wouldn't stick the dog in a cage to see if it'd get better. Now - pull yourself together. As a fish owner, you took up the responsibility of looking after this fish.. and by putting it out of it's misery, and sending it free of PAIN, which it will be suffering severly, that is your duty. There's a few things you could do..
The first is flushing, this however, i don't agree with. It has been voted the number 1 least humane way to kill a fish.. the fish can survive and die painfully and slowly in the sewers on it's own, waiting to die.
The way i suggest is, getting a bowl, filling it with freezing cold water (if you have the time, stick in freezer for hour or so), scoop the fish out gently with a net, place it into the bowl (now out of the freezer.. lol), and slowly dip in.. the fish will die within 15seconds, and it has the same affect as sending a larger animal to sleep. This is the recommended way.
Some people prefer to take the fish out and whack it against a hard object, i personally wouldn't recommend this.. it's cruel, it's evil and it's even crueler that these so called fish owners, think it's funny.
Whatever you do, don't take the fish out and leave it out to die 'peacfully' from not being able to breath.. not as nice as it sounds. It's actually not peacful at all - the fish suffers stress.. and lots of other things. It's like a person being strangled basically.. not pleasent. Do the cold water technique.. and i'm hoping you had enough brains to:
A) Kill it by the time you read this.
B) Or at least have seperated it... Only unless you want nature to take it's course and for it to die.. or be killed, this of course will be making your water rotten, so all your other fish will die!


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

You wouldn't put a human out of it's misery if it lost a leg would you?


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## Lydia (Feb 6, 2005)

no, but do they make fish tail prosthetics?


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## Chazwick (Aug 24, 2005)

Cichlid this is different from a human - this is a fish, and their bodies work differently from ours. Your fish is in deep pain and probably wanting to be put out of it.. Okay? It's your duty to help it.. are you going to be a selfish *?!& and leave it not being able to swim around properly! When a person loses a leg.. you can get prostectics.. wheelchairs, all sorts, it's not the same with fish. Now stop being so pathectic.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

Although I agree that the fish should either be put down or pulled out of the main tank, I do not agree with people calling cichlid man names or putting him down. A fish is like any other pet, I for one have a really hard time putting a fish down that I've owned for quite a while that was a part of the family, so I know how hard this is for cichlid man. IF you ignore this warning, and continue to call names, might I remind you of your user agreement? 
So please keep the criticism constructive.


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

Don't worry Chazwick, I see what you mean. Fishfirst thanks for reminding users of the forum rules, it's much apreciated. The reason why I don't want to kill this fish is because it's so big. 10 inches! Now "chilling him" or whacking him on the side of the table isn't really an option considering the size of the fish, and I haven't got any container big enough to but him in to "chill" him, also I don't think he will die from that in a hurry considering the size of the fish. I've enethatised many smaller fish before, but this ones so big, and considering he's a dog catfish, he's just like a dog to me, now you wouldn't throw a dog into freezing water would you?


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## Chazwick (Aug 24, 2005)

That's not the point, he is keeping a fish in pain alive, just because HE can't BEAR to put it to sleep, eh?!
Let me ask you fishfirst then - would you put a fish that had been bitten in HALF alive?! it's ludricous, i would've dealt with it a long time ago.. and i'm a huge animal lover.
i didn't literally call HIM a name, anyway - i told him to stop being pathectic, it's an action, not an insult. 
he asked what the best ways of putting a fish down were in a previous post, i told him the right ways then he went on to say that he is keeping the poor little thing alive, just to satisfy his needs for having a fish. Lovely.


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## Chazwick (Aug 24, 2005)

Just got your post cichlid and no, i'd put down the dog, and a dog and fish are different, get a dog and you'll know. You must have a big cooking bowl or pan that you can feel up with cold water and slip the fish into.. and yes it'll have the same effect, seeing as your fish is not cold bloodied and a tropical.
There's one more solution with bigger fish, which is decapitation, which you'd never see me doing.. nor you by the sounds. 
I'm sorry i'm being tough, but knowing you put your pet fish out of misery and a slow painful death is the reward. There's not much else you can do.


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

By the way, a catfish is coldblooded as with all fish (exept a few sharks).
This fish is so big it's not going to die easily. The best way to enethetise it would be to give it injection, but this is quite expensive.
I mean what I would of done is just leave it and see if it will recover, but this is too big of an injury to recover.


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## Chazwick (Aug 24, 2005)

Okay... get a large bowl or somesort (you must have something.. whether it's an empty plastic box.. anything!).. fill it with tap water and put clove oil in (lots) or alcohol.. this is the same effect as putting them to sleep as well, i know people who do this to their fish and they said it's a peaceful humane way of doing it.


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

What sort of alcohol? The drinking type or ethonol?


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

clove oil works well for fish euthanization.


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## Chazwick (Aug 24, 2005)

Alcohol as in vodka.. it has to be strong stuff... not any of those alco-pop things!


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## Hamm35924 (Jun 13, 2005)

Some new studys show that when you freeze a fish it does feel the pain of ice shards forming inside it. And flushing a fish just sends it down a pipe, so you don't really see what happens to it, but its just put in sewage and stuff. which cant be much fun either anyways. So i would say that this alchohol way is the best way anyways.


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## LydiaGreen (Aug 5, 2005)

Putting the fish (a cold-blooded creature) into a container of it's own water (out of it's tank which is NOT cold) and then into the freezer does not cause it to feel "ice shards forming in it". A cold-blooded creature goes into a state of hibernation as it cools. The fish will not freeze instantly when put into the freezer, it is a gradual cooling... by the time the fish starts to freeze, it will be in a state of hibernation and won't feel a thing. It is painless and stress-free for the fish. Pouring ice cold water on it would be a shock and therefore stressful. And I'd think there is an anesthetizing effect created by the alcohol so there is likely an initial shock (yeowch - I can't stand the breath of a drunk never mind trying to breathe alcohol) followed by a painfree death. At this point... it really doesn't matter what is done, just do something! If your description of seeing the spinal cord is true... there is NO hope of survival, just a long slow painful death. End it. Think of it this way... you aren't just putting the fish out of his misery, you are putting yourself out of his misery too. Why make yourself suffer watching his suffering? I feel for you. It hurts to lose a fish. They are pets. But, he doesn't deserve to suffer.


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## Cichlid Man (Jan 19, 2005)

*Shocking news.*

Well everyone, after a few days of not being able to swim properly, not eating, and severe open wounds, I can now confirm that my catfish, after a lot of stress and discomfort and floating to the top of the water and not looking like a whole fish, and dispite nearly being put to sleep has now pulled through, his rooting flesh gone and has been replaced by new flesh. Also he is beginning to swim a lot better now and dispite having a reduced chordral peduncal, is now starting to feed again off of the bottom.
I hope he grows most of his tail back but obviously he won't be able to swim as well as he used to, but at least he's not suffering anymore and is steadily climbing back on his fins again (well, not his tail fin).
I hope that you've all learnt a valuable lesson which will asist you for crisis type fishkeeping moments. God bless, (neptune).


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## flynngriff (Jan 19, 2005)

Wow... I have to say I'm surprised. I did not think he would have recovered even this much. It's a bit early to tell yet, so I hope his recovery continues.

-Flynn


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## Lydia (Feb 6, 2005)

Wow. Also a good lesson in mistaken judgement. I hope he heals well!


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## lagorda (Sep 9, 2005)

Flushing a LIVE fish down the toilet is not humane at all....don't do that! 

Give your fishy some time, see how he does. If he's to the point where he's not eating or swimming around, then consider euthansia. 
Its not an easy thing to do, and the most humane way to do it is to put him in a bag with his tank water, and put him in your freezer. After an hour, then you can flush him down the toilet if you want.


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## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

good to hear he's pulling through


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## Thunderkiss (Mar 19, 2005)

FinQuel, you can get it at doc foster and smith online. Safe easy and humane, for the emergencies.

Glad he's doing ok ...


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