# ICH! scaless fish and plants! ??'s



## greenween (Apr 8, 2006)

So, I know there is a LOT of info about ick and what to do about it, I think that we may have it but my dwarf puffer is so small, and scaleless. I want to do this right... It actually started with our betta, after cleaning, which is every two days, sometimes I would notice pieces of debris falling and getting stuck on him. I was sort of desensitized to the white spots because of how I actually saw the debris falling on him. Anyway... Upon getting my dwarf puffers, I've now lost two, and wonder if the maybe had ick, because the one that is left has the tiniest spots on two of his fins(one on each) The betta has two on his side(next to each other.)With the betta this has gone on for a few months. I just noticed them yesterday on the dwarf puffer. However the first one just died mysteriously, and the second one was missing a fin a couple of days after replacing the first. (just want to note, these are two separate tanks ) Anyway, I was hoping to get a couple more DP's and am unsure of when to do this. If I get them at the LPS where I got the first 3 then they will probably have it too. So should I get them first and treat the whole tank? Or treat the one that is in the tank before getting the other two and hope that the whole thing doesn't start again when I do. 
I have checked into a few products to treat it, but I am wondering what would be the safest for a scaleless DP and the plants in his tank, I've heard that salt is bad for the plants. Just wondering what some of you might reccomend. 
I've thought about trying Kordon Ick attack, or Mardel coppersafe in conjunction with Maracyn and Maracyn 2. Does anyone know if the 2antibiotics in Mardel biospheres antibacterial therapy are the same 2 in Maracyn and Maracyn 2. It would be less confusing and cheaper if it is. 
My other question is about the filter. I have a cartridge filter, so do they make them without the carbon or am I supposed to take it out and just not have the filter for a month while treating? 
I was hoping to go get the stuff today, thanks for reading!:mrgreen:


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## Puffer Pita (Jun 16, 2006)

Treating ich in puffers: http://www.thepufferforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9 You must treat the entire tank.

What size tank do you have them in? What are your water parameters?


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## greenween (Apr 8, 2006)

Right now I have only one in a 10 gal. Water peramiters seem normal, but I have been using the dredded strips and have been advised to get liquid tests, which I was going to do when I get the other stuff today:fish: 
I have a post on dwarf puffers forum with the actual peramiters and other details about my tank. (topic: Lets be friends) That is a great site, I'll check out the specified thread. Thanks!


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## Puffer Pita (Jun 16, 2006)

Ahh, okay, I'm on the DP website as well.  For a 10g tank, we recommend no more than 3 DPs and it must be very heavily planted/decorated with either real or fake plants. They show no preference to the type so whichever you want is going to be fine with them, so long as there are a LOT of them.

I'll go check out your post over there and see what's up.


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## violet (Mar 17, 2006)

If a spot has stayed in one place for a long time it is not ich. In the warm water dwrf puffers like, a spot may stick around a week or so but then will fall off. New ones may appear but in different spots. Generally there will be an increasing number of spots.

Ich can infest the gills which you are not going to be able to see but usually some spots would appear on the body as they multiply.

DPs need space to be able to get away from each other. That one was missing a fin is not good. Fins don't fall off. I don't keep them anymore but when I did I noticed the lowest fish in the pecking order would occasionally just fade away.

This is what I would do, and it's taking the patient route. Observe the remaining DP. If the spots disappear with new ones appearing in different places treat the fish and tank before getting any new ones. Once the problem is eliminated, get the additonal fish you want but quarrantine them in a bare tank.

One means of treatment is to remove the one fish and give it heat and salt and just leave the 10G empty for a few weeks wth the temp up a bit. Without a host the Ich will simply die and the tank will not have had the trauma of meds. You will still have to keep tossing in something to creat ammonia so it will remain cycled. But at least you won't have put meds in.

A bucket, heater, airpump and box filter could be used to do heat & salt. I confess I don't know how much salt a DW can take but heat should not be a big problem.


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