# New Aquarium Help Needed



## RFtech53 (Sep 30, 2015)

Hi all,

Forgive me is this first post sounds like it's from an idiot, but I'm simply looking for some input and I'll admit ... I'm pretty much a 62 year old aquarium newbie. 

My wife and I have both been aquarium owners in the past (before we got married), and up until a week ago, we had a 5 gallon aquarium in our family room which had done well for over a year. But our Neon Tetra's began forming white balls on them (way bigger than standard ick looks). I carefully added the proper dose of ick treatment. Within a couple of days, we lost the four tetras, and a beautiful Betta.

We decided that we still loved having fish, and never having had problems in the past, decided on a a bigger tank, so a friend of ours took our old tank, and we bought a 36 gallon bow front, some plants, and a few fish the wife wanted (2 forms of gourami's (bluish and golden), two angels, two cichlids, a dragon fish, and from our old tank, two Plecostomus'.

I have an API freshwater test kit which I've been every other day.

The water is 76°F. The pH is a tad high at 7.8. All other test chemicals are Zero to .25ppm

In the past three days, we lost both of the golden colored gourami's. We don't know why. However, one of the cichlid's is fairly aggressive, even against his partner. We're wondering if he got to them. All the other fish seems fine at this point. 

We've also noticed the water going from crystal clear, to cloudy, and back, several times over the past 1 1/2 weeks. 

I'm "assuming" the cloudiness is just the tank cycling. I've never had this large of a tank before so I'm a bit frustrated.

Does anyone here have any helpful ideas / thoughts for either why the two golden colored gourami's passed, or why the tank keeps going from clear to cloudy?

Oh ... we have about 2" of washed gravel in the bottom of the tank, and an over-the-rear-edge 50 gallon filter. There are three air stones in the tank also, running off a two output air pump which is supposed to handle a 50 gallon tank. And a fully submersible heater to handle a 100 gallon tank, and a floating thermometer.

The tank is 1 1/2 weeks old, and I plan to start doing a 10% - 15% water change weekly, starting this weekend. 

I hope I gave enough info to work on here. Thanks in advance.


----------



## e048 (Dec 23, 2010)

Unfortunately your tank is cycling

Add fish slowly and gradually 

Did you use any chemicals when you cleaned the tank?

Go for hardy fish (mollies, platies,maybe some hardy tetras or even cichlids) hope that helps


----------



## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

> two angels, two cichlids, a dragon fish, and from our old tank, two Plecostomus'.


 Don't add any more fish. Tell me more about the ones you have.

Go to bigger water changes. Replace the air-stones with sponge filters. 

3 things kill fish. 

1) Water quality issues such as ammonia or nitrite, common in new tanks. Suspect this when fish gasp at the surface, or have red gills, big fish die first, all the fish die or the water smells or tastes bad.

2) Disease. Common in fish fresh from stores and fish exposed to fish from a tank that had disease. Plecos could have carried columnaris from old tank. Look for fuzz, lethargy, scratching, not eating, spots.

3) Aggression. Territorial fish trying to drive fish out of "their" space and the loser having no where to go. Many cichlids are territorial all the time and most, including angels, are territorial when breeding. Look for nipped fins, missing scales, chasing, and fish hiding in corners.

Any of these or a combination could have killed your fish. Which cichlids? Which dragon fish? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragonfish 

A 36 gallon bowfront may seem large compared to a 5, but IMO, its about right for 2 full-grown angels and that's it.


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Definitely trying to cycle, hence the cloudiness.

I don't think I can really add much to what's already been said. Certain fish just don't get along with others, though. The "feelers" of gouramis are often tempting targets for other fish, so they often suffer if housed with aggressive fish.


----------



## Elliott225 (Jan 9, 2014)

Question about the filter. You state it's a 50g filter. What is the "gallons per hour" rate? You want to have a filter that will turn the water about 10X an hour. A filter which is rated at 360g per hour.


----------



## RFtech53 (Sep 30, 2015)

All,

I appreciate all the replies, and I guess I sound like the typical "no clue" fish owner. I do apologize for that. I'm at work right now so I really can't answer too many of the questions. And as my wife picked out the fish, I'm not sure either of us will be able to answer what breed of gourami's or dragon.

Yes, the Plecos were from the old small tank where our fish died off after we correctly dozed it with ick treatment. So the possibility that they brought over something nasty is there, even though they look fine. 

From what EMC7 said, we may have too many fish (once they grow up) for the tank.

One question after doing some research last night on this site. Does anyone see any harm in putting in Tetra SafeStart Plus for our freshwater tank, to help get the bacteria established quicker and speed up the cycling? 

As for the filter, it's the Aqueon QuietFlow 50 - 250 GPH - (Aquariums up to 50 Gallons)

The 36 gallon bow tank was new when we got it. All we did was wipe it out with a damp washcloth prior to setting it up.


----------



## e048 (Dec 23, 2010)

Don't add anymore fish


----------



## Elliott225 (Jan 9, 2014)

The filter is okay, but a little small. 

Bump up the temp some to about 78 degrees. Ick, if that what it really was, doesn't like the higher temps. Talking with a couple of LFS owners and a vet, Ick isn't seen that often, at least here.


----------



## RFtech53 (Sep 30, 2015)

This is our Dragonfish


----------



## RFtech53 (Sep 30, 2015)

I found some pics I'd put on Facebook, so I can somewhat answer your questions about our fish types. 

Here's our Cichlids in the first picture. Sorry about the separate posts. I'm still learning the ropes on the forum. I could have put all the pics in the post above. 

I've also attached a pic of the two golden colored Gourami's we lost during the first week. 

And we have two of these Blue Gourami's and two of these Angels which seem to be doing fine yet.

I don't have any pictures of the two Plecos. One is what my wife calls an Albino Pleco. The other is a dark colored Pleco.


----------



## RFtech53 (Sep 30, 2015)

emc7 said:


> Go to bigger water changes. Replace the air-stones with sponge filters.


Allowing the newbie to show through here ... what's the difference between an air-stone and a sponge filter?

Why does a person want one over the other?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## RFtech53 (Sep 30, 2015)

In case anyone needs to see the whole tank, to make your suggestions, here it is. This was just after filling it up ... hence the little bubbles on the front glass. Those are all gone now.

We have three air "devices" in the tank. There's a long airstone behind the coral decoration. 

There's a circular sir stone under the gravel in the front right area. 

And the volcano is also hooked up to the air pump.

The plants to the extreme left and right are living, as well as the small one in the front center. And the small moss ball in the center. 

The gravel depth is about 2", even though the blackish area at the bottom of the photo makes it look like more. 

You can see the heater in the back right corner, and the filter pump near the back left.


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

an airstone will just help to aerate the water..which is excellent..but a good sponge filter will help aerate and also provide some added filtration which is even better....i would add a large sponge filter.


----------



## big b (Aug 17, 2014)

Those cichlids are blood parrots. They can get top about 8 inches and are a bit aggressive. The gouramis are dwarf gouramis. You can't have more then 1 because almost every gourami is aggressive with other gouramis. It looks like the top blood parrot has ich on his fin. Also, I forgot to mention something. The reason the 2 gouramis dies could be 1 of 2 things mainly. The first thing is from fighting with the other gouramis. The 2 reason could be because of the dwarf gourami disease. The dwarf gourami have been bred to many times and now there immune system is weak and they now get a disease. Not all dwarf gouramis get the disease.
Feel free to correct me if I have given any info wrong.


----------



## big b (Aug 17, 2014)

I just noticed something else. The anubias plants you have, they are fully in the gravel. If you leave them all the way in the gravel then they will rot. You might wanna move them up so that the rhizome (It's like a big long root that the stems grow out of) is above the gravel.
I just remembered something else. That dragon fish you have, it's a dragon goby. It ill get to about 2 foot long I think and it belongs in brackish water. In case you didn't know, brackish water is a mixture of saltwater and freshwater.


----------



## RFtech53 (Sep 30, 2015)

evil wizard said:


> I just noticed something else. The anubias plants you have, they are fully in the gravel. If you leave them all the way in the gravel then they will rot. You might wanna move them up so that the rhizome (It's like a big long root that the stems grow out of) is above the gravel.
> I just remembered something else. That dragon fish you have, it's a dragon goby. It ill get to about 2 foot long I think and it belongs in brackish water. In case you didn't know, brackish water is a mixture of saltwater and freshwater.


Thanks Evil ... I/we had no idea. We "assumed" that all the roots we saw had to be fully immersed down in the gravel. Hence, we have more gravel than we probably need (to keep the plants well anchored).

As for the dragon ... it's a shame the pet shop owner (many types of pets but a huge assortment of fresh and salt water fish) didn't explain that to us. It came from their freshwater tanks.


----------



## Elliott225 (Jan 9, 2014)

The Blood Parrots can be bullies or be bullied. I have three and they were picked on by the Red Jewel cichlids. I moved the Blood Parrots to a 75g tank with a single Silver Dollar and they get along fine. Also, Blood Parrots have problems eating due to the fact they can't open their mouth very wide. Small pellets or flake foods. Mine are about the size of a coffee saucer.


----------



## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Its okay to add safestart. If you can speed up cycling, do it.


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Yes, SafeStart is great stuff. How did we ever get along without it?

The Dragon Goby is going to be tricky to feed. They normally eat by gulping huge mouthfuls of sand and sifting out any edible bits they find in it. In a tank they will often eat things like blackworms. It helps to plop them right down on their heads. Also, yes, they live in brackish and even fully salty water.

Anubias plants are pretty, aren't they? One good way to keep them alive is to tie them to a piece of driftwood with a rubber band or fishing line for awhile until their roots get a grip on it.

Gouramis... for a few years now the gouramis we've seen on the market have been in terrible shape, pretty much nationwide. There's a nasty bug floating around on the gourami farms, and yes, since they're so inbred for these wild colors, they are weak. Your best bet for gouramis is to get some from someone local who bred them.

That reminds me... Liz, how's it going with your Pearls?


----------



## big b (Aug 17, 2014)

TheOldSalt said:


> Anubias plants are pretty, aren't they?


Yep, that's why I have 3 different anubias and about 12 plants all together. Anubias Petite, Anubias Nana, and Anubias Frazeri.


----------



## RFtech53 (Sep 30, 2015)

Thanks all. 

I added the SafeStart last evening, though the wife picked up the bottle that only treats 30 gallons. 

The front of the bottle says up to 100 gallons, so she thought is would be enough. But the back stated to get a tank going, add the entire bottle up to 30 gallons. The 100 gallons would be a maintenance thing every time you clean the tank. Nice way to confuse people. Oh well. Better too little I think.

It does appear to be clearing up a bit tonight, so we'll see how it goes.


----------



## LizStreithorst (Aug 5, 2015)

TheOldSalt said:


> That reminds me... Liz, how's it going with your Pearls?


Sorry, TOS, I just saw this. The pearls are doing well. I just have to many millions of them? Want some? They are little guys but they'll grow.


----------



## big b (Aug 17, 2014)

I think this may turn into a journal. Anybody else think that?


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Actually, yes, I do want some.


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

me too please..


----------



## LizStreithorst (Aug 5, 2015)

I'll PM you gentlemen as soon as I get my eyes open. Coffee first...


----------



## big b (Aug 17, 2014)

If you don't have your eyes open then how are you typing?


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

wiz ; i know a lot of people that can type with their eyes closed..secretaries used to have to transfer information from one source onto paper..so they read from the source and typed the information onto the paper...they didn't have to see what they were typing , the knew where the proper keys were..
and many could type 80-100 words a minute..to get hired they often had to do a typing test..i believe that anything lower than 50 or 60 WPM and they wouldn't get the job.and they couldn't have any errors either.


----------



## LizStreithorst (Aug 5, 2015)

Well, I was never one of those people.


----------



## big b (Aug 17, 2014)

I can do about 120 words a minute, that is if you count the letter A as a word .


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

years ago secretaries had to take dictation..there were no computers..very often they had a "steno pad" to write down what their boss was saying..you can still buy steno pads but i am not sure there are very many stenographers that use them these days..they wrote in shorthand which i really doubt is taught these days...
folks had it tough back then..


----------



## LizStreithorst (Aug 5, 2015)

I remember those days. I was around back then. I knew girls who took secretarial courses in high school. Back then you could make a middle class living as a secretary. There would also be people who would come to your house and fix your washer or dryer or TV. They were affordable and they made a middle class living. Whatever changed to make it the way it is now, with few disgustingly rich , many disgracefully poor, and a shrinking middle is beyond me.


----------



## Elliott225 (Jan 9, 2014)

Surprising to me is that when you talk to a "real" media reporter, some still use short-hand. But finding a reporter is the hard part.


----------



## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

I've been employed to do 7200 keystrokes per hour. Back when you had to send in postcards to order stuff instead of entering the data yourself on the net.


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

I'll have you guys know that I can type at a mindbendingly blazing speed of 33 words per minute! ( and that's with only two fingers! ) Whoooo!!


----------

