# Crown tail to plakat transormation



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

So as some of you may know I put my Dwarf orange mexican crayfish in my 5g with my betta and cory's because I wanted one tank less to care about before the break. Everything seemed fine for the 5 days I had before I left for Germany for 2 weeks. When I got back I didn't recognize my Betta again. His fins were torn to shreds, and he now looks like an ugly plakat Betta (Not saying Plakats are ugly, my Betta just is right now). I imediatly removed the crayfish and now have them in there seperate 3g or so. 

My betta seems fine (appart from missing his fins). He is lazy like before and barely swims around. I know this can be a sign of illness but he did this since I got the corys as he is super fat from eating their food. He is eating, even though I need to put the food right infront of him, and I hope he survives.

Anyone reading this, please don't try it with your Betta. I'm just lucky I got back early enough to see my Betta alive.


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## ZebraDanio12 (Jun 17, 2011)

I just had a tragity with my sisters bettas. Nevertheless I learned a lesson too. Hope he makes a fast recovery.


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## Kirrie (Jan 18, 2013)

It sounds like that tank is overstocked. Corys do better with more room to forage for food. They also prefer to be in groups of their own kind. They don't normally shoal with other corys of different species.

I was having problems for the longest time preventing my brothers crowntail from eating the snails algae wafers. He was constantly getting bloated from eating everything. Eventually I decided to move the snail to one of my other tanks to avoid the problem completely. Do you fast your fish once a week? Feeding thawed, deshelled peas once a week will also help with bloating.

I think if you got a separate, larger tank for your corys you would solve multiple problems. Your 5 gallon wouldn't be overstocked, you could add corys so they had others of their own kind and could shoal together, and the betta wouldn't be able to stuff himself and get bloated.

When my veiltail shredded his fins, I was able to help him heal quickly by doing more frequent water changes, using Stress Coat Plus to condition his water because it contains aloe vera, and feeding him a higher protein diet. I fed him frozen blood worms and brine shrimp 3 times a week instead of one or 2. After only 2 weeks he looked just as he had before. This was after he ripped his fins into stringy pieces. Another experienced betta owner also uses a similar method to help her bettas recover from fin damage and other illnesses.


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## Kirrie (Jan 18, 2013)

Also, I was about to say something to defend plakats when you said "ugly plakat betta", but then I read what you wrote in parenthesis. Nice save  I love my little short finned guy. He's the most aggressive betta I've had but also one of my favorites beauty-wise.


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## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

I know Kirrie, I wanted to get 4 corys of the same species, but over the span of a couple of weeks I bought 3 different kinds, kinda sucks but they all school together. Kinda cute seeing them sit in a corner together. I will do more frequent water changes and I have freeze dried blood worms I can feed. I kinda fast them once a while, like when I forget to feed. This might happen up to 2 times a week, sometimes never. I won't be able to move the corys, but they seem fine.


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## Kirrie (Jan 18, 2013)

Make sure you soak the freeze dried ones in tank water so they don't make your betta bloat. If you can find them though, the frozen bloodworms and brine shrimp are much better to use. 

You should make fasting your betta a regular part of your routine, specially if he is constantly getting bloated.

When you get the chance, you should check your stocking in aqadvisor.com It will give you the stocking percentage of your tank. I spend most of my time on another aquarium forum and have yet to find a member there that would not recommend the site. I believe it's pretty reliable.


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## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

I have used aq advisor, but it is not all wisdom like you think. According to aq advisor my tank is about 300% stocked. But on aq advisor I can't put in the amount of plants I have, so it really isn't an accurate percentage. I have kept the tank like this for abut 6 months now (maybe more, really I lost track) and everything is fine with one 50% water change every 2 weeks.


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## Kirrie (Jan 18, 2013)

Im not saying that aqadvisor is 100% accurate about everything. I really don't pay any attention to the compatibility issues they list because they tend to be a little off sometimes, but I do believe their stocking percentage calculations are pretty reliable. Pretty much everyone on the other forum I use recommends staying below 80% stocked to provide room for error, your tank is over 300% stocked, so that is alarming to me.

Plants do help by removing some of the nitrates, but unless you have quick growing plants like anacharis, I don't think they would really impact the stocking percentage that much. Your stocking limit should be determined by the size of your tank because the bacteria grows in the filter, in the substrate, and on the glass. The more glass you have (bigger tank) the more bacteria that can be established to handle the waste produced by the fish. Plants help, but not enough that you could stuff a bunch of fish in a small tank and make it ok by adding a ton of plants. I'm not saying that's what you're doing. I just think your tank is a little overstocked, in my opinion. 

Also, some species of corys generally produce more waste than others. I think albinos are some of the messier ones because they get a little bigger than some of the others. It is not all about the bacteria though. Corys are also pretty active fish and should have more room to swim and forage. I wouldn't keep corys in anything under 10 gallons, but again I guess that is my opinion. 

I'm curious, do you test your water parameters? Doing a water change only every 2 weeks in an overstocked tank should be causing some water quality issues, even if they are just small ones. Your fish might not be showing the signs if the levels are low, but any ammonia or nitrites above 0 will cause issues over time.

The reason I believe your tank is overstocked is because I kept a betta with just 2 small otocinclus catfish in a 5 gallon for the longest time. Even with a cycled tank, one water change a week was not enough. I actually figured out that the tank was slightly overstocked and I had to do 2 water changes a week to keep the ammonia at 0ppm.


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## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

I don't do water tests, I bought a testkit once and it was wasted money (got a nutrafin mini master test kit), I used it once and it just takes too long, the readings also depend on how many secconds you shook the test tube, just not my thing. plus i watch my fish closely. No red gills, no fin damage (appart from now cause pf the damm crayfish). The corys are very active, the betta not so much, but that is his personality. I have to disagree with what you said about the plants, I have anubias and java fern in my tank, both attached to objects and not planted in the soil. This way the plants take the nutrients directly from the water, so they remove quiet the amount of waste. My tank is overstocked, but the fish can handle it. The water is always clear when I remove it (when I do a water change), I know i wont be able to read the levels like that, but again, fish seem happy. You're right, the corys could probably use a 10g or more, but I have nothing like that to offer (like I said before).


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## Kirrie (Jan 18, 2013)

The API Master Liquid kit is very reliable. It tells you exactly how long to shake the test tubes to get accurate results. Knowing your water parameters is not a waste of money in my opinion. Some people test their water weekly. I don't test as much as I should. I kind of test my water randomly or when I think there may be something wrong. 

Knowing your water parameters will help you set a water change schedule. Anytime your ammonia or nitrites go above 0, that is when you need to change the water. I doubt your tank goes two weeks without any rise in ammonia or nitrites being as overstocked as it is. Plants do help by absorbing nitrates, but nitrates are the least toxic of the three anyway. 

As I said, your fish might not be outwardly showing signs of being affected by the toxins if they are in small amounts. Fish can put up with bad conditions for quite a while. How else would people be able to keep a goldfish alive in a bowl for years at a time? Any goldfish living in a bowl would be constantly swimming in ammonia, yet they can seem fine to their owners and live for a year or more. Bettas and corys can take oxygen directly from the air so they can actually deal with bad conditions better than other fish, but that doesn't mean they should.

If you can't separate the corys and the betta, the only way I could see that stocking work would be at least 2 water changes a week using Prime as your water conditioner. Prime will detoxify ammonia and nitrites for either 24 or 48 hours between water changes.


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## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

That amount of testing is in no way necessary, and plants absorb amonia and nitrites as well. Nitrates are just the easiest to absorb for the plants. I think we are both just repeating what we have said all along. You have your view, I have mine and we will not agree and you will not get me to change my water change schedule as I think my fish are fine due to observations I have made. I would use my test kit to prove this to you but it is about 2 years old, might just get some cheaps test strips.


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## Kirrie (Jan 18, 2013)

If you are going to bother testing the water, the test strips aren't at all accurate so don't waste your money.

I do agree that regular testing like that is not necessary. I was just mentioning that I know people who do it. I only test when I see a change or am a little late doing a water change, just as a precaution. It's better to be safe than sorry.

But yes, we are just repeating the same things, so we can agree to disagree


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