# Planted Tank Advice



## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

I have decided that I want to make my new 38 gallon tank a planted one. But I have absolutely no experience with live plants. So I was wondering if you guys could give me some advice on how to go about doing it?


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

This sticky is a good place to start: http://www.fishforums.com/forum/aquatic-plants/18027-so-you-want-planted-tank.html.

You should decide how much work and money you want to put into the tank. You can have a nice planted tank with low light, but plant choices are more limited. Bump up to medium light and you have more plant choices...the plants grow a bit faster so you'll have to trim more...might need some fertilizers every so often..and the lighting is a bit more expensive for some tanks. High light is more work and more money, but you have the most plant choices and really fast growth. 

I think medium light is a good place to begin. With low light, you tend to get more algae IME because you have slow growing plants and depending on fish load might have more nutrients than the plants can take in.

For low light I'd suggest around 40 watts of light...medium you'll want around 80 watts. Either way, you'll need a fixture other than what came with the tank (if one did...). 

You can use regular gravel or a large grain sand for any planted tank...something with nutrients is a bit better, but more expensive.


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

Thanks a lot! 

EDIT: what ratio of pounds per gallon of gravel would you recommend for me?


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

I would use this substrate calculator to figure out how much you'll need to have about 2-3 inches in the tank. I like to have about 1.5 inches in the front, sloping to about 3-3.5 inches in the back. Thats just my preference though. I'd plug in 3" for substrate height in that calculator and see what it comes up with for your tank.


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## _Jay (Jul 3, 2009)

I like to keep a minimum of 3" in my tanks. IMO it may be worth your while to consider a premium plant friendly substrate like Seachem Fluorite. It may be a little more expensive, but the long term benefits are substantial.

I think you may need to think about a carbon source (CO2 or Seachem Excel) especially if you are going to use more than low light. 

Finally a good technique for new planted tank start ups is to cram the tank full of cheap weeds; Ludwiga , Hygrophyla difformis, etc. for the first month to be sure you establish a dominate plant mass and discourage algae.

This is a photo of a 20 gal high I started about two months ago, the plants have been replaced now with plants more to my liking. Yes those are windows, but the plant mass is dominate and the algae is subdued










Jay


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## _Jay (Jul 3, 2009)

I do not understand your rude hostility?
You are a moderator?

Jay


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

Pretty crazy huh, Jay. 

You can have co2, ferts and fish, plenty of people do it and their fish live many many years.....but that is not the point here.

You can have a low or medium light tank without co2. Excel is good though if you start seeing algae issues. Using Excel doesn't make the tank high tech and it won't kill your fish if you use it correctly.

I agree about packing in the plants. That's definitely a good idea for a new tank. And using fast growing plants is even better....stem plants take in more nutrients and will even take in ammonia in a cycling tank. Good for reducing nitrates once the tank is 
cycled too.

Going along with what Jay said above, Flourite is a good substrate. So is Eco Complete. You could always mix either with gravel and have some added nutrients.


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

Jay I do not think loha's reply was rude. He is obviously a "low tech" 
guy and it was an attempt at humor. He did put a "LOL" in there. Don't be so sensitive.


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## _Jay (Jul 3, 2009)

With 10 years experience hands on, and research I am, trust me, secure and not thin skinned.

The response was clearly rude and crude despite the lol! 

I also have a few low tech, no fuss, tanks that are doing very well. I was just posting my .$02 in the thread.

If this moderator can not tolerate that, I am confused as to why you call this a "forum"

Jay


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

i was not trying to be rude... just stating my point of view....
jay..think about it this way....
not counting plants ; what do you think the cost is to duplicate the exact set up that you posted... all new equipment..tank....stand...light....co2 set up....gravel....ferts and all the other little items that go into it and into maintaining it..
i ; and many others just do not have that kind of cash laying around for that..i never did have it...so i have had to live with what i could afford.. i just cannot justify spending $150-200 on a light fixture for a 20 gallon tank..i can light up an entire fishroom for that..
but i also am more into the real ways of existance.... how are things in nature?... how does God do it?
i always say.....i have never seen God go into the local fish store to buy ferts or fluorite....i have naver saeen a giant co2 tank next to a river or lake.

my opinion is that if one wants to have a tank with plants and has little or no experience ; they should start with the low tech approach...take some time to actually learn about what they are trying to do...

maybe i just lack the I.Q. to go with a high tech plant tank and therefore stay away from it.. but i am a true believer that the moe complicated and sophisticated something is ; the more likely there will be major problems with it..

like ron v said ; don't be so sensitive..there was no rudeness in my post..you only perceived it to be that way..


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## _Jay (Jul 3, 2009)

This thread started off...



> I have decided that I want to make my new 38 gallon tank a planted one


and folks were commenting on doing this, including me, which is how forums should work.



> well....you can spend about $600-$800 bucks on all the fancy crap for that super duper special don't put no fish in it buy more ferts every couple of weeks co2 suckin pretty plant tank.....remember..if it ain't high tech..it ain't right...lol
> ok...enough of my anti high tech planted tank rant..


This is a knee jerk, uninformed, and misleading attack. The light on this little tank cost $35 and the carbon source could easily be three doses of Excel a week, maybe $.25. I think the weeds cost about $10 bucks at my local petco. Falling far short of your outrageous estimate.

Jay


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

well jay...since you are so offended by my vicious attack i will delete my post for you...
hopefully that will sooth your delicate feelings..lol


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

wow.... i missed so much of this post. I check back a day later, and i have missed this entire conversation lol

Well, I am getting more excited everyday as I think about having a planted tank. It makes tanks look so much more real.


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## COM (Mar 15, 2008)

Deleting a post accomplishes nothing at all. It just ruins the debate in the forum, which drives people away. Coming at this a few days late, I have no idea what the issue was here.

Planted tanks can be done in a variety of different ways. You can spend a little money or a lot. You can have a high-tech setup or a simple one. There are lots of strong opinions on the topic. We all need to express our views in order to advance meaningful discourse. Don't be so sensitive.


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

Jay you have succeeded in ruining the thread. You have 10 posts and loha has 1500 and more importantly, loha has the respect of the regulars on this forum. You are not going to win this. Jay you obviously have knowledge that could be good for this forum. You could be a valuable member. Just cool it on this kind of thing and try to "fit in".


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

if something bothers u a little, sometimes it can be better to not share your feelings on the matter.


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

Good luck with your planted tank Pleco! Let us know your progress....and of course show us some pics!

Jay I hope you'll continue to share on the forum.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

ok...let me try to set the record straight and hopefully without creating more confusion..
first off..
jay..my original post was not directed at you or bell or any other high tech plant keeper..it was directed at high tech plant keeping in general..
sometimes we need to actually "read" and understand what the "original poster" said... jay..you only posted part of plecos statement....what you didn't put up was.... "i have absolutely no experience with live plants"....that is a very important part of the post.
i do not believe in someone fresh out of college jumping into the CEO position...in other words..if he has no experience; then it would be best for him to start with the easiest and least expensive way to go..that seems to make the most sense to me..
and i am the first person to admit that i don't like the high tech system because there is an inherent risk factor that is often ignored.or pooh-pooh'd as the old expression goes...i have a friend that decided to set up a large display tank with lots of beautiful live plants and discus....so he went all out..210 gallon tank with custom stand..entire substrate was fluorite..almost 500 pounds of it.he bought the best of everything..the co2 injection set up cost well over $300.. partly because he spent an extra back up co2 tank.. because of the size and length of the tank ; he had the injection system installed by a professional that special fitted the dispersal set up.. .once his tank was cycled and running well he started adding more fish...over $1200 worth of gorgeous discus..everything went well for about 4 or 5 months...he was on his second co2 tank..and was quite happy with the lush growth of plants....he went out of town for a weekend and came back to a tank full of dead fish.... seems that his $150 regulator set up malfunctioned and flooed the tank with co2..
i just do not think that a beginner should spend a lot of money on something that may not turn out like he wants or expects..there is no shame in starting at the bottom and working your way up..not all of us are wealthy enough to put a lot of money into a hobby....especially a 15 year old kid..
i am still pretty much a novice in this hobby..always learning..most of what i know is from hands on experience.... and that kind of limits a person ..i just never had the time to learn about everything there is to know about the hobby..my research facilities were my aquariums..i have even found a cave spawning tetra that i am going to try to breed if i ever get a tank set up for them..who wouldda thunk that there was a tetra that spawned just like a julidochromis...
THIS IS THE COOLEST HOBBY ON THE PLANET....make it fun..keep it fun..don't obsess...


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## BV77 (Jan 22, 2005)

High or low tech...cheap or expensive....it don't matter...it's about what works for you.
an algae free tank is a BALANCE of light , nutrients, and CO2....it is up to the fishkeeper to find the balance through trial and error.


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

Thanks for all your opinions.
And for the record, I am a girl lol

I probably wont do the entire tank live plants at the start. I will probably mix live with fake for the beginning. I am not expecting miracles as I am new at the plant keeping aspect of aquariums. And most likely I will be posting more questions as time progresses.

And yes, loha, being fifteen does mean that I don't have all this money at my fingertips. But I have a decent job that pays well, and I save for things that I love - my fish. So, I will take it slow and easy, and hopefully everything will turn out fine.

Thanks again for your help.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

geez.....i must be nuts....that was so long ; it 's like a manuscript...lol


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

lol

nah, you were just getting your point across.


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

Pleco, you hang in there. Take Loha and Jays suggestions and factor in your knowledge and I'm sure it will work for you. I'm glad to see young folks (boys and girls) take an interest in something besides video games and Paris Hilton. LOL... I've been doing this hobby for a long time and I've had very little success with plants. I've had some rare species of fish spawn in my tanks but no luck with plants and I have tried the CO2 thing. Its not easy. Thats why I hope Jay stays with us. I could use his advice too.


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## _Jay (Jul 3, 2009)

They say a picture is worth a thousand words...I should have cropped the CO2 tank out of the picture. The picture was to illustrate packing the tank with cheap weeds on start-up..a trick that saves tons of problems down the road in a planted tank.

I generally speak my mind but I regret that the thread went south. 

Sometimes a little head bumping is a good thing, I got to find out quickly how ya all interact, no blood no foul.

I look forward to contributing to the ongoing discussion of Carbon and plants and planted tanks.

Jay


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

Jay, I am going to start a new thread (so we don't completely clog Pleco's thread). I need some low light plants for a startup. I could use you help, please..


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