# fish stressed from move



## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

I moved my fish from their 46 gallon to their new 75 gallon last night. Everything went pretty well but I can see that they are stressed this morning and one of my harlequin rasboras died during the night. Is there anything I can do to help them through this? I didn't know that they would be so stressed. It's the same kind of water that was in the other tank. I'm using my new Eheim canister filter in this tank but also have the old filter hanging on the front of this tank to help with the cycling. 
Any suggestions?
Thanks


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## funlad3 (Oct 9, 2010)

Did you cycle the 75? There may be higher levels of chemicals found during a cycle... Also, more hiding places make for less stress. Turning of the lights will have the same effect.


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## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

The new tank is across the room from the old one and I used gravel and some water from the old tank. Also I added the filter from the old tank so all the good bacteria is present and I tested the water and everything is great as usual. Same hiding places, drift wood and lots of live plants moved over too. Temperature is the same as the last tank too. Lights have been off since the move. 
I don't want to lose any of my fish!!


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## funlad3 (Oct 9, 2010)

I'd still recommend you do some water tests. Who knows how effective your anti-cycling activities were. They work great for some people and horribly for others. 

When moving fish to a new tank, some will add only three or four per week to avoid mini-cycles. 

Also, I would still dim the lights and add MORE hiding places. The more you have, the less likely they are to use them, as they'll feel more secure.

Good luck!


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

RAHT moved the entire old filter, should be a close to an 'instant' cycle as is possible. Must just be stress. Up aeration if you can, don't feed until they start 'looking' for food. Add hiding places/floating plants. They should perk up within a few days. If they don't, do a water change to dilute stress-released chemicals and check for anything that could be annoying them like a 'zapping' light or overheating heater.


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## Mr. fish (Mar 8, 2011)

Did you test for ammonia?

You could have very well caused an ammonia spike when transferring the old gravel to the new tank... Did you put the new gravel as the bottom layer then the old on top?

Also which did you do first? Water from old tank then gravel? Or other way around?


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## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

Things have gone from bad to worse. I have lost 7 of my 10 Harlequin Rasporas. The catfish look horrible and the gold barbs are at the bottom of the tank. Their fins look ragged. They looked perfect yesterday.
I have tested the new water and it was good. We are not having a spike in ammonia. The lights are off, I mentioned that in my last post. 
I added an airstone last night too and there are floating plants already because the rasboras like them.
I can try doing a water change. 
I had new water in the tank for a few days to get all the new equipment running. I added water from the old tank last night, then after removing all the live plants and fish I vaccumed the gravel and then added it to the new aquarium. I just mixed it in so it is mostly on top. 

It's like they were suddenly poisoned. I don't know where I went wrong. I'm very upset for losing my fish. I had a wonderful peaceful community.


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## funlad3 (Oct 9, 2010)

Dumb question, but was the tank rinsed? It's possible that at the store or factory, some idiot cleaned it with some glass cleaner. That could be bad... If you can't gain control of the problem and they all keep dying, I recommend putting them back in the original tank.

It will definitely stress them out, but if there's something wrong with the tank they're in now, that should help.

Of course, there may also be something in your water. It's finally warming up, so your water company may be putting a new chemical in the water to keep it clean.



I'd wait to see what some other members have to say before you do anything drastic though. This is just my advice.


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## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

It seems that there is something very wrong. I may not have rinsed the tank good enough? It's as if someone poured straight chlorine into the tank. They are all dying! I'm doing water changes!! This is horrible. I just wanted them to have a nice bigger home!!


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

It does sound like something toxic. Either in the tank (sometimes sealants aren't cured or there is cleaner residue) or in the new water. 
If water changes help, it was likely in the tank and more water changes will help more. 

If water changes don't help or make it worse, I'd get suspicious of your water supply. The first time my water company switched from chlorine to chloramine I lost a lot of fish before figuring it out. Go buy a new bottle of dechlor/water conditioner also (in case yours isn't working). Something you can safely double or triple dose (if you smell chlorine strongly on the tap, sometime the system has overdosed). Also check pH of tank, tap, and old water if you have it. High can be a new decor item or bleach residue, low can mean acid from the new tank's sealant, tap being far from 7 can be another water supply problem or indicate they changed water sources. There was one news report of a place that got the decimal point wrong on their NaOH addition. 

Did you smell any sulfur (rotten eggs?) when you moved substrate or decor? Sometimes 'anaerobic decay' in the substrate or in the middle of a driftwood piece can release hydrogen sulfide when disturbed.


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## Betta man (Mar 25, 2011)

try putting in salt. It's worth a try.


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## Mr. fish (Mar 8, 2011)

emc7 said:


> If water changes don't help or make it worse, I'd get suspicious of your water supply. The first time my water company switched from chlorine to chloramine I lost a lot of fish before figuring it out. Go buy a new bottle of dechlor/water conditioner also (in case yours isn't working).



This is exactly why I just declor anyways no matter what... May cost a bit more, but, knowing my fish are healthy is always a piece of mind.

Anyways back on subject... I'm with Funland, I think the tank wassnt fully rinsed out properly and some dumb shmuck cleaned it with a glass cleaner of some sort. That would kill your fish.

Thats sucks tho, you just wanted your fish to be happier in a bigger home and their life was lost in the process...


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## Betta man (Mar 25, 2011)

you could move them to a different aquarium if you have one.


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## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

Moved the surviving fish back to the 46 gallon. of course I just added water as fast as I could and dechlorinated or course and there is no gravel.. This is heartbreaking. I'm sure it must be some sort of chemical from the new tank/canister filter or heater. I have to go for an Easter dinner of all things now. I wish I could stay home. 
Thanks for all your help.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

This sucks, in all that advice about how to move them, none of said rinse everything until there are no strange odors and pH of the rinse water is the same as the tap water.

I once bought home a tank that must've been only about 3 days old. Put fish in and they acted strange, I finally realized the pH had dropped off due to acid from the new sealant. A little buffer, and all was well.


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## egoreise (Mar 16, 2011)

emc7, wasn't it you that advised me to rinse all my decor thoroughly, after I had the white gunk all over the bottom of a plant, and one of my cories had an ulcer?


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

yeah, fish stuff should be fish safe, but there isn't any fish FDA checking. If it saves them 2 cents not to rinse off the mold release on a plastic plant, you can bet "they" or at least some of "them" will skip that step. If I can smell something in air, I am sure fish will smell it in water. Even if it doesn't hurt them, I like my fish too much to want them annoyed by strong odors. Seems like soaking in a bucket of hot water does the trick most of the time.

I've read about pill recalls because of something stinky sprayed on wooden pallets to control pests that migrates right through cardboard boxes and plastic bottles to make ibuprofen taste bad. I've no reason to think similar stuff couldn't happen to pallets of 'aquarium decor' coming here in container ships or sitting in warehouses or even pallets of new aquaria.

Did the gunk come back?


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## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

Okay, I am the biggest baby. I've been crying most of the day while trying to save my fish. Some people wouldn't understand this at all, but I really loved them! My favorite part of my day is to watch them in the evening after the kids are in bed. Almost half of them died today..

The only thing new in the tank is the tank itself, some extra gravel, my new eheim canister and an external heater so it is something on one of them. I have had no fish die since throwing them back in the old tank with new water and their old filter. 

I tested the water in the new tank and then pH is lower than what my pH usually is. Could this be the cause? My fishes fins looked ragged after a short time in the new tank.
Tonight I am removing all the water and re-rinsing all the gravel. I do remember an odd smell about the gravel when I was rinsing it initially. 

Now, how do I rinse out a 75 gallon tank? Do I keep running clean water in and taking it out? Do I have to use de-chlorinated water to do this? Now that the filter has been running for 5 days or so, do I need to rinse it out?

Thank you all so much for your help.


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## egoreise (Mar 16, 2011)

I am so sorry for your loss, RAHT. I am one of those people that understands. I lost a dwarf gourami yesterday that I cried over, and I'd only purchased him two days before. But congratulations on saving the second half of your fish! 
I don't know for sure, but I would suggest rinsing everything super well in hot water... and I guess that means a slow process with such a big tank. And then redoing the whole cycle (giving you time to observe your fish closely in the smaller tank to see if any illness persists). Maybe before you put your beloved fish back in, you could get some feeder fish and stick them in the 75 gallon to see how well they do?


emc7, I am very happy to report that the gunk never came back. And the cory cat healed beautifully. In fact, he is desperately trying to breed.... I'm ready to set up a 20 gallon tank to see if I can make that happen.


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## Mr. fish (Mar 8, 2011)

When you say 'rinse' do you mean you rinsed with sink water?


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## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

I rinsed everything initially with tap water, is that what you mean Mr. Fish? But then of course I de-chlorinated the water that went in the tank. I used old tank water to prime the canister at the advise of my local pet store guy.

Would a drop in pH cause fish to have frayed fins and die? It was about 1.5 lower than what I've always seen before. Keeping in mind that my fish had perfect fins yesterday and ragged ones today, whatever is in the water has done this. 

raht


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

A sudden drop (like moving fish from one to the other) can kill and really low pH can erode fins. The lower the pH, the faster it does. If the -1.5 reading is after water changes, it could've been even lower when you first put the fish in. Or the low pH is an indication that some acid has contaminated the tank.


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## fishloverzj (May 3, 2010)

RAHT said:


> Okay, I am the biggest baby. I've been crying most of the day while trying to save my fish. Some people wouldn't understand this at all, but I really loved them! My favorite part of my day is to watch them in the evening after the kids are in bed. Almost half of them died today..
> 
> The only thing new in the tank is the tank itself, some extra gravel, my new eheim canister and an external heater so it is something on one of them. I have had no fish die since throwing them back in the old tank with new water and their old filter.
> 
> ...




I always rinse it out wiht tap water. I totally understand throwing yourself about the room like a three year old and sobbing hysterically. I do it on a monthly basis.


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## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

Thanks for the support fishloverzj!

I just checked my tap water pH and it is lower than normal. Very strange. Either way, I am starting the tedious process of re-rinsing everything. Ugg.

The drop in pH is from about 8.2 to about 7.2. So not as low as I thought. I don't know my tap water would be different.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

If you can move the tank, I'd suggest taking it outside and just running a hose into it an let it overflow and muddy up your yard. Maybe sprinkle baking soda on all the sealant and rinse it all off. Otherwise, I would prob. buy or borrow a python and fill the tank in place with hot water, let it sit overnight with the new filter running, empty, repeat. Check the pH of the tap and tank each time. Assuming your nasty is water soluble, each time you fill and remove 99.9% of the water, you dilute it by a factor of 1000. Twice would be ppm, three times should get it down to trace levels, even lower if you dry it the 3rd time (use a clean sponge, then towels). This should work unless something is continuing to release something toxic. Check the heater for cracks, as it likely has some sort of salty, oily heat transfer fluid that shouldn't ever contact tank water, but could if it gets damaged. 

Did you use anything new to fill the new tank? I head stories where a bucket was borrowed, used, and returned "clean", but not clean enough and fish died when a tank was topped off with a dirty bucket.

Is a brand new tank or new to you? I have heard of people using the wrong product to reseal a tank, and having it kill fish.


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## Mr. fish (Mar 8, 2011)

RAHT said:


> I rinsed everything initially with tap water, is that what you mean Mr. Fish?


I doubt this was your issue, but, for future reference you should never rinse anything that contains beneficial bacteria with 'tap water'. The chlorine will instantly kill your bacteria having you to start with the cycle process all over again. Same goes for your filter pads, always rinse in a bucket with tank water from your water changes.


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## funlad3 (Oct 9, 2010)

Just elaborating on the pH thing, a 1 or 1.5 drop is actually a 10-15 times magnification. The pH scale is strange that way. If they were put into a tank with a possible 20x difference, that's an obvious problem. 

I still don't think that's the entire problem though. I agree in that there's some contaminated piece of equipment... Check, and if you can't find a problem, recheck! Personally, I do think that it is the tank. Wash the inside of it with water, and wipe the outside edges of it down. It may be possible for some chemical compound to leach through the silicone...

Again, good luck and sorry for your losses. I too would be crying my eyes out. Fish are family too!:console:


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

If the tank was brand new and smelled like vinegar, that would be my best guess. If each time you fill it, the pH stays closer to the tap water, you may have it licked. 

Likely you will never know what did this. Only that you've solved it or you didn't.

I would only put in one fish next time you try it.

FL is right. Focus on the sealant. Glass is nice and inert and should clean up with one rinse, but sealant is a polymer that can absorb and release nasties. You could try rubbing with a paste of baking soda and water on a brush.


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## RAHT (Apr 4, 2011)

Mr. Fish, the only things I rinsed with tap water were the new equipment, rocks etc. I moved the old gravel and filter without rinsing them.

Everyone else, I am re-triple-rinsing the gravel and will focus on the sealant in the new aquarium. 
Thanks everyone!


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