# Stocking a new 20-gallon tank



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

Hi Everybody. So I need a little help. We have moved out 3 large (size of an orange) goldfish from a 20-gallon that they used to fit properly to a 75 gallon. My husband and I have decided that we want to stock the 20-gallon again. It has been cleaned, and set up with new everything, rock, filter, air-stone, etc. I've never had "small fish" like tetras and danios. We were wondering if the following would be an overstock. 

4 Neon Tetras
4 Zebra Danios
4 Male Fancy Guppies
and 2 African Dwarf Frogs. 

We are aware that ADF do need breathing room at the top, we plan to leave 1" - 1 1/2" of the tank unfilled. The tank hood we have is a full cover, and is a very snug fit for the filter - not more than 1/4" on each side and 1/2" in front for water to flow in. 

Like I mentioned we are new to small fish, so any help would be great. We did look around the forum before posting, and it did help answer quite a few questions already! We hope to become a regular visitor around here. 

:fish::fish::fish:


----------



## Dilligaf_1 (Jan 28, 2013)

Hi ashley, I love the tetras, as a matter of fact, I have been keeping fish for many years and I have never been without at least one tetra tank going. They have great color, and are almost always on the move, and if you make small schools in your tank, it will almost look like water flowing as they move around together. Neons, and cardinals are 2 of my favs. I would not worry too much about your proposed stocking, it will be fine, but I do have some concerns about the choices. Fancy guppies are usually not the best swimmers, and in a tank of speed demons, neons & zebras, you may find some nipped tails. The african frogs, although they are called dwarf, that is relative, dwarf compared to what, a giant 10" frog.....what I'm trying to say is they will still grow to about 2" in size, and well I'm not 100% sure but I think those neons may make a nice snack.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

Dilligaf_1 said:


> Hi ashley, I love the tetras, as a matter of fact, I have been keeping fish for many years and I have never been without at least one tetra tank going. They have great color, and are almost always on the move, and if you make small schools in your tank, it will almost look like water flowing as they move around together. Neons, and cardinals are 2 of my favs. I would not worry too much about your proposed stocking, it will be fine, but I do have some concerns about the choices. Fancy guppies are usually not the best swimmers, and in a tank of speed demons, neons & zebras, you may find some nipped tails. The african frogs, although they are called dwarf, that is relative, dwarf compared to what, a giant 10" frog.....what I'm trying to say is they will still grow to about 2" in size, and well I'm not 100% sure but I think those neons may make a nice snack.


And this is exactly why I'm here asking! 

What else would you suggest putting with danios and tetras? Those are our two favorties to watch. we are looking for some more color as the tank its set very earth-toned.


----------



## Dilligaf_1 (Jan 28, 2013)

If you want to stick to the tetras, check out Congos, they will look bland when they are small but as they grow the colors are awesome, I also like emperor tetras, again full grown they are stunning. You may also like some of the more flashier types, like diamonds, von rio's, or phantoms are all crowd pleaser's. If you are looking for something a bit larger, a couple of angel fish...and i do mean a couple...tank isn't big enough for a whole flock. Angels occur naturally with neons, and it is said that having the smaller fish with the angels, makes the angels feel more comfortable. Anyone else...ideas for ashley?


----------



## Dilligaf_1 (Jan 28, 2013)

I just thought of another possibility, if you stick with more acidic water, apisto's are also colorful dwarf cichlids that tend to stay near the bottom of the tank...the tetras and danios will occupy the rest of the water column.


----------



## ZebraDanio12 (Jun 17, 2011)

ADF will not eat other fish. They are practically blind. They will however eat invertebrates like shrimp. But tetras or danios? No, they are too fast and he will hardly see them. I've had many ADFs and only time they ate a fish was when it was dead.

I second Dilligaf's suggestion for apisto's. Or any type of dwarf. I have a pair of orange flash apistos, had a pair of cockatoos (lost male to old age), a pair of blue rams, and my new addition is a pair of curviceps.


Dwarf's are awesome! I think by far the most interesting have been the curviceps when in breeding mode. SO cool.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

We are going to our Fish Shop this weekend to check out what everybody looks like. I'll let you know what we decide. Thank You for all the suggestions.


----------



## Trout (Mar 16, 2011)

I've heard that dwarf frogs are pretty filthy creatures, and that's part of the reason I wouldn't want to get them. And I would definitely get more that 4 neon tetras. Personally, I'd suggest at least 6 of them. And Dilligaf, I was also going to suggest a couple angels to have a little something graceful to look at when your eyes get tired of zipping back and forth with the tetras. That's all I got for now... Though if you want to do Danios, Celestial Pearl Danios are certainly eyecatchers! Such beautiful fish.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

Trout said:


> I've heard that dwarf frogs are pretty filthy creatures, and that's part of the reason I wouldn't want to get them. And I would definitely get more that 4 neon tetras. Personally, I'd suggest at least 6 of them. And Dilligaf, I was also going to suggest a couple angels to have a little something graceful to look at when your eyes get tired of zipping back and forth with the tetras. That's all I got for now... Though if you want to do Danios, Celestial Pearl Danios are certainly eyecatchers! Such beautiful fish.



Would two Angela be okay in a 20 with other fish, as in I do not plan on upgrading this tank to a larger one. This is our bedroom tank.


----------



## Trout (Mar 16, 2011)

If what Dilligaf said is true, and angels occur with Neons in Nature, a couple should be perfectly fine with a school of neons for just a 20. I'm not really sure how big they get.


----------



## Dilligaf_1 (Jan 28, 2013)

20 gal properly filtered should be ok for a couple of angels, it is about the smallest size I would house them in though. The other fish are almost a non issue, with only a small school of neons, and the danios, you will be fine. Zebradanio12, thanks for the info on the frogs, I didn't know they were nearly blind, and you are right they certainly would have a rough time catching those fish. And like Trout said I would go with more than 4 of the neons, 6 or 8 make a nicer show. ( cardinals are even nicer....just saying)


----------



## ZebraDanio12 (Jun 17, 2011)

Dilligaf, your welcome

Angels will eat neons when they get bigger and get to the size of your hand. Keep that in mind.


----------



## Dilligaf_1 (Jan 28, 2013)

Oh please don't paint my beloved angels in a bad light lol they too would have to try and catch those little speed demons.....and I think the neons are sure to have the advantage. Ive kept them together for years, but as you mention, angels are cichlids and their predatory ways should not be overlooked, mine were always housed in aquariums with plenty of cover, and areas for the little guys to hide if they were ever threatened, good point for Ashleymd to consider.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

We have decided to reconstruct our tank set up to make it a bit more Angelfish friendly with hiding spots and cover. We are thinking two Angels and a handful of Tetras and Danios.


----------



## ZebraDanio12 (Jun 17, 2011)

Angels are great, but they are actually very good at catching fish. If i ever had excess guppy fry i would feed em to angels. As long as ashley gets tetras too big for the angels mouth, she will be just fine.


----------



## C. King (Dec 14, 2012)

I have had angels with neons for years, no problems. My angels are as big as my hand. I do have cardinal tetras which are a bit bigger than neons as adults--they are as colorful, maybe even more so full grown! I also highly recommend cherry barbs. Other barbs are a no no with angels, but cherries are great, and you can't beat their vivid red color, which gets even brighter with age. Just be sure to get equal numbers of male (bright red) and female (more dull) cherries. I have two each, and they are happy. In fact, my tank is a 20 gal. too! I would never, ever have zebras with angels, however, due to zebras penchant for fin nipping. Guppies have different water parameters from neons or zebras, but I reluctantly added one to my tank as a present to a little girl who " really really wanted" one, and he has adapted, but mixing fish with different needs is not recommended. (unless you are trying to avoid an in store small child meltdown, that is!). Other fish that go well with neons, cardinals, danios, angels, and cherry barbs : hatchet fish, who are top level dwellers. They are fresh water flying fish, so must have a good tank cover, which you have. Also, rasboras-sweet natured schooling fish with a smart looking black triangle. Bushy nose plecos are good bottom dwellers that wont out grow your tank like the other plecos will. Whatever you choose, do not buy more than a few at a time, and give the tank at least a week to adapt before buying more.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

We are looking at a Zebra Pleco- anybody have experience with them? From what I've read they stay small around 3"-4".


----------



## ZebraDanio12 (Jun 17, 2011)

ashleymd said:


> We are looking at a Zebra Pleco- anybody have experience with them? From what I've read they stay small around 3"-4".


Zebra Pleco!? My gosh are those ever expensive!


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

Okay. Wasn't sure. Never mid that idea. Lol. I knew what they looked like and their size and care/maintenance but didn't see any prices anywhere. I'll take your word. I'm not looking to spend an absolute fortune.


----------



## ZebraDanio12 (Jun 17, 2011)

ashleymd said:


> Okay. Wasn't sure. Never mid that idea. Lol. I knew what they looked like and their size and care/maintenance but didn't see any prices anywhere. I'll take your word. I'm not looking to spend an absolute fortune.


If I had the money, I'd get one. Those suckers are priced around 300-500$! But they are so beautiful. Too bad...


----------



## C. King (Dec 14, 2012)

Since you cleaned the old tank and added new everything, be sure to let it cycle before spending $$ on fish...


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

It's been up and running for almost three weeks. Still not planning on fish for a couple more.


----------



## C. King (Dec 14, 2012)

let us know what you end up getting! maybe some pics...


----------



## Dilligaf_1 (Jan 28, 2013)

yes pics please, and i really like all of Kings suggestions, cherries would add some great color! And thanks for sharing the guppy story, I have a similar story....only the little girl ain't so little, its usually my wife who's pleading with me to buy the prettiest (most expensive) fish in the store!


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

So we were at the Fish Shop today and we looking at their display tanks. We fell in love with a set up they had. It was a 29 gallon with a ton of plants and rock hide aways. The fish included:
Neon Tetras
RummyNose Tetras
Cardinal Tetras
Glowlight Tetras
Orange Galaxy Rasbora
Yellow Furcata Rainbows
Ghost Shrimp
Cherry Shrimp
and a mix of itty bitty snails

We are thinking about all of the above with the exception of the Cherry Shrimp and Neons. We were considering 6-8 of each fish, and 3-4 shrimp.

Opinions?

We were unsure of what we would stock so there are no plants in the tank yet. Are there any VERY idiot-proof live plants? I'm not good with plants but live looked so much nicer than plastic.


----------



## Obsidian (May 20, 2007)

"running" does not equate with "cycling"

Are you adding an ammonia source? If you are not adding an ammonia source (fish food, a shrimp prawn, pure ammonia itself...) then you are not cycling, you are just running water around a tank. You can use a biological additive that will help do this pretty quickly. I prefer Stability but there are several others that would work.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

I've always cycled with adding fish food daily and once a week adding ammonia.


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

have you tested for ammonia and nitrites ?? you will want to test so you don't add fish when readings are high..
the price of zebra plecos has come down a bit..you can now find them in the $150-$200 price range..they also prefer temps in the upper 80s...lots of current and high levels of oxygen...plenty of places to hide and lots of meaty foods...
they can be extremely aggressive and have been known to kill and eat mates..


----------



## Obsidian (May 20, 2007)

Adding fish food works really well  I just don't ever assume when someone says they have their tank "running" for 3 weeks they are cycling it because then they get shocked later when they do go through the cycle LOL. Then they are all- man I let it run for weeks.....


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

I do bring water samples to the Fish Shop weekly. Everythis is balanced and ready to go. We just aren't in a rush to add fish yet.


----------



## C. King (Dec 14, 2012)

That set up you described at the store sounds lovely! But if you are going to invest time and money on a tank, go ahead and buy a good test kit- the kind with test tubes, not strips- that tests for ammonia, Ph, nitrates &nitrites. You will be glad you did, and so will the fish. As for plants, amazon sword is pretty tough. You may want to use a special plant substrate instead of gravel, but if you already have gravel, they make great little plant food tablets that go under the roots. Plants, like fish, have their own individual requirements of light and water parameters, so I recommend getting a good plant book and reading up on each variety to find some that will match your water parameters. Bring it with you to the store and look up every plant before buying, because the petshops often carry plants that are misrepresented as aquarium plants, but really are not. This sounds like alot of work, and I guess it is, but after having plastic plants for years, I started a planted aquarium a year ago, and I have never regretted it, and the fish are happier, too- so it was/is worth the extra effort. I would get the plants in and settled before adding the fish.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

Here is the tank set up. We decided against live plants right now. Adding some fish next weekend.


----------



## C. King (Dec 14, 2012)

Very pretty! I really like that gravel. And the plants are so realistic...so different than years ago, when they were super fake looking plastic!


----------



## Trout (Mar 16, 2011)

Egeria Nanas are super fool proof. I just put it in my tank and it took off without any special anything. I'm going to have to prune it soon. It's doubled in size since I got it about a week and a half ago. Another name for it is Narrow-leaf Anacharis.


----------



## Dilligaf_1 (Jan 28, 2013)

Tank looks great ashley! I see the clear tube in there...planning on adding an elephant nose or knife to your stocking list? They love hiding in those cause they feel secure, but they don't seem to realize we can still see them.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

C. King said:


> Very pretty! I really like that gravel. And the plants are so realistic...so different than years ago, when they were super fake looking plastic!


Thank you. The plants are all silk plants. I love the realistic look to them. If my goldfish didn't uproot everything they would have silk plants too. Lol. The colors with the silk are much better than the cheapo plastic plants. 




Trout said:


> Egeria Nanas are super fool proof. I just put it in my tank and it took off without any special anything. I'm going to have to prune it soon. It's doubled in size since I got it about a week and a half ago. Another name for it is Narrow-leaf Anacharis.


Thank you for the suggestion- we will check them out when we get ready to do live plants. 




Dilligaf_1 said:


> Tank looks great ashley! I see the clear tube in there...planning on adding an elephant nose or knife to your stocking list? They love hiding in those cause they feel secure, but they don't seem to realize we can still see them.


Nope, no knife fish or Elephant nose (although we fell in love with the elephant noses at our LFS) I tossed it in there to see if any body uses it. I'm planning on getting another ground cover silk plant to put over it. If they don't use it- I'll take it out.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

The tank is on hold for a little bit pending the results of my insurance claim. I hit black ice and pretty sure I totaled my car out. I know fish aren't expensive but still. Cross your fingers it's fixable. :-/


----------



## C. King (Dec 14, 2012)

What rotten luck!  Hope no one was hurt.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

Woohoo!!! It's not totaled- insurance will cover the damage. Fish tank is back on. We are planning on going Sunday to get some fish. I'll post pics. We are so excited.


----------



## Trout (Mar 16, 2011)

w00t.  That sounds wunnerful


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

So we got 6 Glo-light Tetras and 6 Cardinal Tetras today. I had to con them to come out with food. I'm starting the "training" process. All our fish have now learned to associate two light taps on the tank means food. We feed in the same spot and tap every time.  Maybe it's just by chance that it works but I'd like to think they are "trained". 


The tank setup (the fish are in there somewhere):










The crew:

































Our stocking plans changed a little now that we have 6 of each fish. We are thinking of not getting either the Furcata Rainbows or the Galaxy Rasboras. Still not sure. As it stood we already had our stock plan slightly high, but we don't want to completely overcrowd just to get all the fish we want. Nobody wins - unless I can convince the boyfriend to let me get another tank. Lol.


----------



## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

The answer to all fish problems is another tank. For QT, for Hospital, for spawning, for fry raising, for incompatible fish, for growing fish, for fish you can't resist. 

Understocking a new tank is far safer than overstocking one. Wait and see how things go with the fish you have. But long-term, (wait 3 months with no dead fish), I would add a single or pair of dwarf cidhlids. Something like Apistogramma borelli and call it done. 

Do try a few "low-light" plants. Don't spend a lot of money. But try an elodea or java fern. They can help water quality and, if they grow and multiply, they will be cheaper than plastic in the long-term.


----------



## C. King (Dec 14, 2012)

I love cardinal tetras! Mine have grown much much bigger than when I bought them, and their colors get even more intense with age. ( Be sure to wait a week or two before adding more fish, to avoid over taxing the good bacteria)


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

C. King said:


> I love cardinal tetras! Mine have grown much much bigger than when I bought them, and their colors get even more intense with age. ( Be sure to wait a week or two before adding more fish, to avoid over taxing the good bacteria)



I have a personal waiting period of 30 days in between adds. That gives me time to do a partial water change and rearrange to break up an territories that have been established.


----------



## C. King (Dec 14, 2012)

good idea. Some people (usually newbies) get so excited, they add a full tank of fish in just a few days. Then, they are on the forum wondering about sick fish! I never know if a person has much fish experience, so I tend to state the obvious.


----------



## Trout (Mar 16, 2011)

One question, while we're on the subject of not taxing the bacteria too much. Will three pearl danios be too much of a tax on a newly cycled 10-gal? I just don't want to split them up.


----------



## ashleymd (Jul 6, 2012)

So I'm back after a long hiatus. A lot has happened in the past 8 months. We never did go back to get more tetras. We ended up getting engaged and married instead. LOL. We had gotten engaged in March, our work schedules got completely flipped around in May, I started a second job in June, the Hubsters took on another job in July, I started school in August, and we got married in September. *phew* 

But back to the fish. We have 5 glo-lites and 3 cardinals remaining. Not sure what happened. It’s like they disappeared into a Black Hole. Within a week we had lost all 4 fish. No traces what so-ever. We have two thoughts - the other ate them, and/or they jumped somehow and the cat got them. I immediately tested the water and all levels were within the norm. That was back in the end of March.

Everybody has been happy and stable since. We are looking to add maybe just a couple more, but we are looking for a "tank cleaner" type of swimmer that is not a typical pleco or snails - I don't like the look of either one. LOL



As far as our Goldfish tank goes - I can't keep it clean for the life of me. I do roughly 1/4 - 1/3 water changes once a month. I have a Fluval filter made for a larger tank, and a simple over the back filter. The amount of brown algae is crazy... any suggestions? I've done a water test and their levels are pretty normal, the ammonia is a little high - but it always has been, I believe it's just because they are goldfish and they produce a TON of waste.


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

corydoras are great cleaner fish and always interesting to watch....get 5 or 6 of the dwarf cories..pygmeus are the most common..

as for the goldfish tank ; you should be doing about 40% water changes at least once a week , not once a month.....


----------

