# Angelfish



## frogman5 (Mar 13, 2007)

yes i was wonderin if i could keep angelfish in a 29 gallon tank and if so how many.


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## Guest (Apr 15, 2007)

1 Angelfish would be fine in a 29g. I wouldn't go with more than that. 

What fish do you have in the tank now? Some fish don't get along well with Angels.


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## frogman5 (Mar 13, 2007)

i have neons, bleeding heart tetras, danios, corys and platys


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## frogman5 (Mar 13, 2007)

would this be alright


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## Guest (Apr 15, 2007)

they will eat neons. i am an experianced angel breeder and you should get 3 juvies let the pair up and return all the other fish then u can breed angels


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

They shouldn't eat the neons. Only very large angels could manage to eat a small neon tetra; my neon tetras are 1.5", and my adult angelfish don't touch them.
Not to say that it's impossible; but unless you have a very large angels or very small neons, it shouldn't be an issue.

That said, you appear to have a lot of other fish in your tank. Other than the platies, your fish are all schoolers and I would expect that you have at least 4-5 of each of them. You would have room for one angelfish in your tank.

If you cut back on your other fish to, say, one school of tetras, you could get away with one established pair.

If you decide to get a group of juveniles and let a pair establish and then sell the rest, get at least 4 of them. If you get two or three, the biggest one or two will pick on the littlest / weakest one. So get either one, or more than 3.

Oh, I thought I'd ask, what dimensions is your tank? If it's a "long" tank (about 3 feet long), it's too short for angelfish.


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## frogman5 (Mar 13, 2007)

so would one be ok or should i put some fish in my 5 gallon


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## MaryPa (Jan 25, 2006)

I`m getting a pair of Angels and they`ll be in a 29 gal. I think that`s plenty of room for 2 fish that size.


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## Guest (Apr 15, 2007)

MaryPa said:


> I`m getting a pair of Angels and they`ll be in a 29 gal. I think that`s plenty of room for 2 fish that size.


According to your signature, you don't seem to have as many fish in the tank as the OP does. 

A pair of angels is fine in a very lightly stocked tank IMO. But when you add in 2-3 schools of fish, bottom feeders, and anything more than that, you are asking for trouble.

Frogman, can you provide numbers of the fish you have? Assuming you have atleast 4 of each of the fish you listed, 1 angelfish will be fine.


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

frogman5 said:


> so would one be ok or should i put some fish in my 5 gallon


No, none of the fish you mentioned are small / inactive enough to live healthily in a 5 gallon tank.


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## frogman5 (Mar 13, 2007)

o sorry i meant my 10 gallon my bad to put some of my fish in


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## Guest (Apr 16, 2007)

The Neons would be the only ones I'd put in the 10g.


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## frogman5 (Mar 13, 2007)

alright nvm im not goin to get an angelfish maybe later in life tho

thanks for all ur info tho appreciate it


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## MyraVan (Jan 19, 2005)

Allright guys, I'm planing on getting some angelfish, and I'm confused about the advice given here.

Zoe says: If you decide to get a group of juveniles and let a pair establish and then sell the rest, get at least 4 of them. If you get two or three, the biggest one or two will pick on the littlest / weakest one. So get either one, or more than 3.

JustOneMore20 says: A pair of angels is fine in a very lightly stocked tank IMO. 

I have a 58g tank. Current occupants are:
6 rosy barbs (2 adults, 2 juveliles, and I just discovered 2 babies!)
11 tetras (blue and neon)
1 bristlenose pleco

I am planning on adding:
some angelfish
6 polka-dot loaches
maybe one small eel like peakc0ck eel

The tank is heavily planted, if that makes a difference.

I've been trying to figure out how many angels to get. I don't want to overdo the bio-load, but then I don't want the angels making problems by bullying the smaller ones... Any advice would be appreciated.

Also, our water here is very hard, pH 7.8. Will angels still form pairs and breed in this? I've heard that soft water is best for breeding angels. (I don't want angel babies, not if it's going to wreak havoc with the other tank occupants.)


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## Guest (Apr 16, 2007)

MyraVan, in your case, I'd suggest keeping a pair in your tank. Get 4 or so juveniles and let 2 pair up, then sell/get rid of the other 2. If you are worried about a pair causing problems, you could keep just one angel. Your tank is big enough and lightly stocked enough that you would be fine with 4 adult angels, but IME when you have more than one, its hit or miss with angels as to whether they will get along. Its really up to you how many you keep and I'd say you could have as many as 4 if you wanted. 

The only fish on your list I'd worry about with the angels is the rosy barbs. Do you see any nippy like behaviour among them? I've never kept these, but I have heard some about them being nippy. If the cause problems, adding a couple more to the group could help.

Make sure you add juvenile angels. That will ensure that the Neons don't become food. By the time the angels are full grown, the Neons should be as well, and shouldn't become food.

If you add an eel, make sure your tetras are full grown. When eels get larger, they will eat small fish.

I have heard of angels breeding in a higher pH, so its possible if you have a pair, they might breed.

I tried keeping more than one angel in my 55g for awhile. At first I had 1 and then added 2 more. They got along wonderfully for 5 months or so, when my original one died abruptly. The remaining 2 seemed like best buds and got along great for awhile until one of them ended up dead (this one had torn fins, so i suspected the other angel). Now I just have one and thats all I'm going to keep.  Not to steer you away from them, but just to say that however many you want, add them at the same time. Remember that you may eventually have to get rid of 1 or more because they all have different personalities. 

Oh and when I was talking about a pair in a lightly stocked tank, I meant a 29g.  I should have specified....sorry! 

HTH!


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

MyraVan,

Sorry to be confusing  The difference between a pair and two angelfish, is that the pair is a male and female, established and breeding. Two angelfish who have not paired up may exhibit aggression towards each other; and if one is tougher, it can bully the little one.
Whereas if you have an established pair, they can live together peacefully (assuming the pair is mature, etc).

Regarding your pH; 7.8 isn't all that high. It's a little higher than neutral but considering that pH goes all the way up to 14, it's not very high. Your angelfish will have no problems thriving and breeding in that water. To give you an idea of how adaptable they are, my angelfish are thriving and breeding in my tap water with a pH of about 11.

As Kristin suggested, start with 4 juveniles and keep the first two that pair off. You could get away with 4 angelfish in a 58 gal, but probably not two adult pairs; an aggressive pair will commandeer at least 30 gallons when they are spawning, so two spawning pairs would be a tight fit.

If they spawn, just let the parents raise the eggs. The babies probably won't survive very long in a community tank, so you won't be innundated by 100s of baby angelfish.


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## Guest (Apr 16, 2007)

Paired angels OFTEN kill EVERY other fish in the tank including corries


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## MyraVan (Jan 19, 2005)

Kristin and Zoe, thanks very much for your info. I think your idea of buying 4 little angels and keeping the first pair is a really good one. Also, it means that I will only have 2 adults in the tank. I like to keep my fish loads light since I find that my tanks are more healthy and easy to take care of that way.

About the rosy barbs: they are one of the most peaceful types of barb, so I am hopeful that they will get along with the angels.

I'd like to ask one more question about buying them. I almost always buy from my local shop, which happens to be a very good shop. They always have angelfish in stock, but they don't always have such a good selection. I'd like to buy 4 angels that look different; if they come from the same tank and look similar I'm worried that they might be brother/sister and I don't want to interbreed. But my shop usually doesn't have 4 different types of same-sized angels. I asked them about this, and they suggested that if I can't find enough of the same size, that I buy the littler ones first, let them stay in the tank for a few weeks, and then come back for bigger ones. The idea is that the little ones will stake out their territories first, and then the bigger ones, when they are added, won't bully the little ones. 

Is this sound advice?


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## Guest (Apr 16, 2007)

That sounds good 2 me


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

The first fish in a tank do have a kind of home field advantage, so I think its good advice.


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## Guest (Apr 16, 2007)

Interbreeding isnt that bad either


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

> Paired angels OFTEN kill EVERY other fish in the tank including corries


That is VERY untrue! Where did you get this information? Angelfish will definitely keep other fish out of their territory when they are spawning, but they have no interest in killing other fish. I have spawning angelfish in several community tanks and they do not touch the other occupants.

MyraVan, I think that's a good idea. It'll be okay if they aren't all the same sizes, they should still get along okay as long as you don't have something like one small one and two big ones. Inbreeding isn't terrible, but if you do too much of it, you can actually weaken the strain and bring out the poor qualities. I disrecommend inbreeding unless you need to do it (to develop a certain strain etc).


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

> Paired angels OFTEN kill EVERY other fish in the tank including corries


 Its a matter of tank size. Paired cichlids kill fish that won't leave their territory, so if the angels pair in a ten and 20 high is their territory size they can and do kill other fish. In a 55 or 70, no problem.


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## MyraVan (Jan 19, 2005)

Thanks guys, I'm getting lots of good advice!

Still a few more questions

Flow: my tank is 220 liters (official capacity, of course it's less than that since I have gravel, etc in it), and the filter turns over 1000 liters/hour. This is a turnover of 5x the tank volume per hour. The current is fairly strong, much more so than in any tank I've ever had before. The barbs, tetras, and my bristlenose have no problems with it, but will small angelfish (body about dime-sized, which is what I plan to buy) cope with it?

Also, roughly how old will angelfish be when they form pairs?


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

Sorry, I was a little too adamant that angelfish never kill other fish. As emc said, they can if they don't have enough room (a pair of angelfish of mine once killed a dwarf gourami who got jammed in the corner of the tank by their eggs.)

Anyhooo, the angelfish shouldn't have a problem with the flow as long as there are areas of the tank where flow is slower. What kind of filter is it? Flow is okay but obviously you don't want your fish to have to fight to swim. If it's a canister, can you adjust the direction of the spray? If it's a HOB, can you raise the level of the water?

My angelfish formed pairs at about 8months old.


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## MyraVan (Jan 19, 2005)

My filter is a cannister. I have the intake in the lower right corner, and the exit from the filter is a spray bar across the back left side, just below the water level as it makes too much noise if it's above the water level.

Yes, I think that there are some areas of the tank that don't have so much flow. On the left towards the front, for example. So I hope they will cope...


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

Can you change the direction of the spray bar to lessen the flow?


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## Guest (Apr 17, 2007)

Well mine paired up in a 55g and killed about 10 other fish this has happened a few times and i have great water quality maybe you have unhealty lazy angels if they only bet flake food....IM pretty sure i knoe more about brreding angeks i have had 6 brreding pairs before


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## Guest (Apr 17, 2007)

And angelfish WONT be able to deal with that flow and will pair up at 7 months and later if fed well


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

> you have unhealty lazy angels if they only bet flake food


What's with the 'tude?
My angle are far from lazy, they eat a huge variety of flakes, pellets, frozen and live foods, and they are perfectly healthy. I've spawned more than six pairs and raised countless babies. But this isn't a pis**ng contest; and generally, given enough room and healthy conditions, angelfish are not aggressive fish, and they will not actively seek out and kill other fish in a tank. Not that it's impossible or unheard of, just uncommon for angels to be that aggressive. And just because it happened a couple times in your tank, it does not mean that it will happen in every situation, nor should you proclaim your "facts" as the only truth.

MyraVan, I would take swordtailbreedr's advice with a grain of salt  Your angelfish should be fine with a fairly high flow (within reason, obviously). I also have oversized canisters on my tanks and my angelfish just stay out of the path of the water (although sometimes I catch them darting into the flow). Like I mentioned, try re-directing the flow to see if you can make the impact on the water less violent (ie aim it toward the back glass, slightly downward?). You can also stock up even more on the plants, which will help slow down the water flow, or just put some ornaments in the path of the flow (driftwood, rocks, etc) to diffuse it.

Worst case scenario, maybe it's time for a bigger tank?


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## Guest (Apr 17, 2007)

you have angelfish in one tank you know less than me i am sure ur angels arnt normal


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## Guest (Apr 17, 2007)

hey there...

When i had my angels, they pretty much stayed in the current my filter made. it wasn't very strong but they still stayed there alot.

swordtailbreedr...i do not mean to sound rude or anything but could you please use punctuation and not use abbrievations for words. it is very hard for me to read your posts. thanks.
Andrew


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

I don't think angels mind current too much, as long as they can get away from it if they want to. Mine frequently duck under the HOB filter to eat the algae that grows on the output.

swordtailbreedr, i have more than one tank with angelfish in it. I'm starting to doubt that you even own angelfish, you know so little about them. Please do some research and get your facts straight; the angelfish you claim to breed will be the healthier and happier for it.


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## sonofbreeder (Jul 17, 2005)

My dad and me keep 16 tanks of angelfish from 55's all the way down to 20's angels aren't that aggresive but they can be, right now we have 7 pairs and most of the rest are angels we have raised. They shouldn't be bothered by high current to much and swordtailbreedr you obvisily need to grow up and stop actting inmature.


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