# World Trade Center



## harif87

Wooohoo! Theyve started to build! Passed by today and took some pics. Its going to be great to have the towers up again. I for one cant wait until that big hole in the landscape is filled again.


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## BV77

God, I can't imagine living amongst so many people


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## Guest

Very cool! *stares at the city...*

Btw, LOVE the avatar...I've seen that kid before :lol:.


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## Bear

some one know what its going to look like?


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## Ice

Ichthius said:


> Very cool! *stares at the city...*


LOL !! See I told you ... you need a Yankee in your life ...

Welcome to the big city, Ich !! WHOO HOOO !! Nothing like experiencing the city that never sleeps ! Come out of the woods ... ROFLMAO !!! j/k ...


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## Osiris

Very Cool, keep takin the pics!


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## Guest

Man great idea! lets biuld it again so the terrorists can attack again!


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## Guest

swordtailbreedr said:


> Man great idea! lets biuld it again so the terrorists can attack again!


Unbelievable how much ignorace and obnoxiousness was put into that one sentence. I suggest not opening your mouth if thats all you can think of to say.


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## Mazzy

It's about time! Glad to see something happening there. I'm curious who got the contracts.
Maybe in another six years we can manage to clean up New Orleans too.


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## Kyoberr

That is so exciting! I always wondered when they were going to start that. It is about time!


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## Mazzy

Although I agree that the post was in ill taste. I would like to comment on this "we fought for your freedom so shut up" mentality it seems we have all of a sudden in this country. 
I protest the war. I do it every Monday night in front of the court house in my town. Now, most people drive by and wave, flash the peace sign, or honk and yell "yeah"s but there are the few who instead give the "they are fighting for you're freedom" thing too and I just wonder if anyone thinks about that when they actually say it to me and the other protesters. I mean, in essence, what that statement means is exactly what I wrote above "someone has fought for you to be free so don't use any of that freedom and forget that this country was built on and supposedly holds dear, those who dissent" because of course that is what democracy is. 
So, although I disagree completely with the whole fear thing - I never much liked the "be afraid for your lives" shpeal trying to be spoon fed to us - I also believe completely in freedom and I believe complete in this country so, for that reason, I say if you want to say your piece you go right ahead.


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## Ice

Although I do support our troops in Iraq and Afghanistan 100% but I firmly believe this war has and is now another Vietnam; a war we will never win. Too many radical in the Middle East and Iraq. You cannot make them change the way how they believe in religion. All wars down though ancient history has always been over religion. I say it's time for our troops to come home and let Iraq settle their own problems. Instead, let's concentrate on hunting down and bring Osbama bin Laden to justice.


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## Sue Gremlin

All political stuff aside, it will be so good to have a 1776 foot tower back on the NYC landscape. It's my home turf and I have been disoriented since the towers fell. I will very much look forward to the day it's complete.


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## Ice

I'm equally looking forward for the new memorial being completed in Ground Zero.


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## MDsaints

yea if any terrorists really do anything to america again ill be real pissed. thats why im joining the Marines when im 18 now. i hate terrorism and i think that the war on it is right. Glad thier rebuilding it. just proves how strong America is.


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## Guest

no one had to fight for our fredon in the first place so thats a stupid argument, and baby baby, guess what there will be another terrorist attack- nothing is stoping the terrorists and they are smart-than can do it. I am not saying its good its just undeniable that there is no reason to belive 9/11 wont happen again.


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## Mazzy

well there's no reason to beleive anything won't happen again really. Planes get hijacked, it's not some completely off the wall, never heard of, event. People blow up Embasseys and other gov't buildings, it's not unheard of. All kinds of things happen all the time. It's not the first time America expereinced an attack (Pearl Harbor) and of course it won't be the last. To pretend it can somehow be prevented from ever happening again is ridiculous. 
However, to live in a way of never moving forward, i.e. not rebuilding on the trade center site, or to live in constant fear is equally ridiculous. 
I'm happy something is finally going to fill that void. It's been a show in incompetance and Americans not reaching out to each other (it's my understanding there was a lot of time tied up in arguing over exactly what should be built or not built there) that has caused this space to be empty for so long. It has been a drain on our collective pschycy (Americans that is) to have it left empty and it will be a big boost to the country as a whole to see new life being brought to what has been just an open wound.


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## Guest

Scuba, his "ignorance" might be a real look into reality . so..as americans i guess we are building these new towers as a symbol of freedom? wouldnt you think that makes it a prime target..again? Im not sure if im for or against the towers being rebuilt, but there is a level of danger in rebuilding them. 



Baby_Baby said:


> How about no.
> 
> I'll rip the heart out of my own chest before I see another terrorist attack on my country.
> If anyone even so much as tries to get over here to hurt me and my fellow Americans, they will have HELL.


So you are single handedly going to prevent another attack? or are you simply relying on heightened security at the airports. We are as vulnerable now as we have ever been... No patriot act or random searches at airports is going to stop people from the objective they want to achieve. If you honestly believe we arent at danger... then you need to wake up.


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## flamingo

Why do these threads always turn into a debate/ speech/ soapbox sort of thing?

It's not symbolizing anything but rebuilding and using wasted up space. Sure it has some symbolism there, etc. but it's nothing more than that. When 9/11 happened, it opened the eyes of the entire WORLD. Now, years later, it still has a lasting effect- but people have begun to become "blind" yet again.

And the whole war thing, everything about it is wrong so why go on speeches about it? I've seen people protest out in front of places with signs saying "get rid of war"- and then 2 hours later they leave in their cars and go to their homes and watch tv...

But, anywho. It's awesome to see they've had this much progress so far- and the guts to rebuild them.


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## Guest

did i say i thought they were dong a bad job? did i down talk the military? i am point out TRUTHS, YOU CANT STOP EVERYTHING AND STILL HAVE ANY FREEDOMS. I have family in the military too, i support the troops, i care for those who have lost their lives. im simply saying OPEN YOUR EYES.


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## Guest

GoodMike said:


> Scuba, his "ignorance" might be a real look into reality


His ignorance isn't coming from his argument, its coming from the way he is expressing it. His comment was rude and childish. Mazzy on the other hand at least expressed his/her feelings with some sort of respect (and reason on top of that).


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## Mazzy

flamingo, I think the subject alone makes this thread something that would have to turn into a debate/soapbox/speech sort of thing. I understand your point that it was just a fact-of-the-matter type post but since our counrty is divided, so are we and so there will be dicussion and debate on the issues surrounding all the things that the towers symbolize to each individual. 

I actually think it's a good thing that we debate these issues. Not to start some flame war but because all too often we tell ourselves, or we hear the phrases "no politics, religion, etc. to be discussed here". Now I can understand the religion part, these are deep seeded beliefs with no right or wrong awnser - unless someone is presuming they can speak for any given "higher power" which is arrogant to say the least. However, politics, at least between Americans, _should_ be discussed. Afterall, we are supposed to be a country of and by the people and so if the people aren't discussing politics then we aren't self governing anymore, instead we are just being led like sheep (and as an animal husbandry professional I can tell ya, sheep are some of the dumbest animals that walk the earth - they are lucky they were domesticated or they certainly would have become extinct.). So rather than shy away from these discussions, I hope more Americans begin to embrace them and practice our right to self govern, otherwise, we just may wake up one day trying to figure out when it was that we allowed all of our rights (and especially our ability to self govern) to fall by the wayside without even noticing we were giving these rights away.

Lastly, Baby, we want the same goal, for our men and women to come home safely and soon. FYI, every Monday, to my right, stands a veteren.


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## Ice

swordtailbreedr said:


> no one had to fight for our fredon in the first place so thats a stupid argument,


Excuse me ?! No one had to fight for our freedom ??? Where the H*** did you get that idea ?? Don't you know your own country's history ? Our forefathers fought for our freedom going back to Revolutionary War to break from the British rule ! What about the Civil War, WW I, WWII, etc ... We have fought to KEEP our freedom for hundreds of years ! I just hate it when some kid comes in here and thinks otherwise. You don't know what you're talking about regarding freedom. Remember this, son ... FREEDOM ISN'T FREE !!!!! If it weren't for our troops in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc ... fighting to keep our nation free, we wouldn't have the freedom now !!! NUFF SAID !!!


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## Guest

Ice said:


> Excuse me ?! No one had to fight for our freedom ??? Where the H*** did you get that idea ?? Don't you know your own country's history ? Our forefathers fought for our freedom going back to Revolutionary War to break from the British rule ! What about the Civil War, WW I, WWII, etc ... We have fought to KEEP our freedom for hundreds of years ! I just hate it when some kid comes in here and thinks otherwise. You don't know what you're talking about regarding freedom. Remember this, son ... FREEDOM ISN'T FREE !!!!!


Agreed. Well said.


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## harif87

I agree 100%.


Its as simple as my History professor put it; people died [and continue to give their lives] just so that you can vote, dont let their deaths be in vain.


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## Mazzy

OK, I disagree. 
We got into WWI because German u-boats sank several British ships which happened to have Americans on them. There was outcry from the American people, the American gov't tried to restrain Germany's method of unresticted warfare (aka killing whom ever got in their way) and failed and so declared war on Germany. We did not get into that war to protect our own freedoms. Only our own gov't and our own people can take away our own freedoms. 

WWII - The US stayed neutral upto and until Japan bombed Pearl Harbor. The US then declared war on Japan, while Hilter declared war on the US and so the US followed suite by declaring war against Germany and thus, WWII. We did not get into that war to protect our own freedoms. Only our own gov't and our own people can take away our freedoms. 

Civil War - it would be nice to think that at the time Northern Americans really felt slavery was wrong and we (the North) were just these cute fuzzy bunnies that wanted what was right over what was easy. The reality however is that the north was industrializing and the south was not. The northern states were taxing their residents to pay for roads etc. while the south expected the federal gov't to pay for these services. The actual war was over who had the real power, the states or the federal gov't. Abolishing slavery, was simply a side effect used to gain more soliders for the north to use in the war. Not all rainbows and peaches, but reality none-the-less. We were not fighting to keep our freedoms (as a country that is. Obviously non-white Americans _were_ fighting for their freedom from slavery), we were fighting for taxation rights (states vs. feds). Only our gov't or our own citizens can take away our freedoms.

Iraq - we were attacked and wanted someone to blame. Iraq did not attack us, Iraq had no weapons of mass destruction, Hussein hated BinLaden even more than Americans (they were complete and total enemies), Iraq had no plans to attack the United States, there were no AlQaida in Iraq prior to the toppling of Hussien because, as stated above, AlQaida was assossiated with BinLaden and BinLaden and Hussein were what... complete and total enemies!
We are not fighting for our freedoms. Our freedoms have not been threatened ('cept by our own gov't via the Patriot Act). Only our own gov't or our own people can take away our freedoms. 

The only war in which we fought for freedom was the Revolutionary war where we actually did fight for our freedom from England. That's it. Yes, we all know the slogans "they hate us for our freedom" (my personnal fav. - reality: they hate us because we won't get out of their countries and let them BE FREE), "fight 'em over there so we don't have to fight 'em over here" (another fav. - no country has ever tried to invade the US and none will, our citizens have the unique freedom of being allowed to carry guns, something most in the world don't have - they are afraid of our civilians, not our military), and the ever popluar "support our troops" as if anyone who does not agree with the war is somehow anti-American because their idea of supporting our troops doesn't consist of watching them endlessly dying for no benefit to our own country. I support the troops. I just don't support the troops _to death_! 

So yes we have fought a single war for our freedom but only one. Since we will never be ruled by another country again, we will also not have to fight for our freedom again, except of course possibly against our own gov't. Afterall, it is the Constitution that says if the gov't of the people is no longer representing the people, it is the _duty_ of the American people to overthrow that gov't and start anew.


I apologize for this post being so long, but I would like to add one final note.... wouldn't the true honoring of our troops be for us all (Americans, Iraqis, Saudis, etc) to live in peace? It seems only then will those lives have been lost not in vein.


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## Ice

Excuse me but I differ with your comment regarding WWII : Yes it DID threaten our freedom.
Freedom is NOT free !! Remember that ! Oh yeah, when was the last time you thanked a WW II vet or any soldier for protecting our freedom ? Ask them if they think freedom is free ? I guarantee you, they will say "No".


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## Mazzy

"freedom isn't free" is a bumper sticker slogan just like the others mentioned above. Freedom is actually free just like peace and good will. These are ideas and ideas are free. If you choose to be a peaceful person, you are free to do so - free. 
I will gladly hear your opinions about WWII that are opposing my knowledge of the event, but an alternative explanation actually needs to be presented when you tell someone else that their facts are incorrect. Saying "you're wrong and here's my slogan to prove it 'freedom isn't free' " is not an alternative argument or a proof of incorrect statements, it's simply a slogan; one fed to the masses by those currently in power - just like "support the troops", "flip flop", "fight 'em over there...", etc. 
I would like to hear what you think constituted us fighting for our freedom during WWII, especially since we remained nuetral, not joining in that war for years and years while it continued between England and Germany. It seems we would have been much more interested in joining the fight had we actually been fighting for our own freedom. 
Anyway, I would like to hear your understanding of WWII to get a better idea of why you think we were fighting for our freedom.
Thanks.


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## harif87

Mazzy said:


> "freedom isn't free" is a bumper sticker slogan just like the others mentioned above. Freedom is actually free just like peace and good will. These are ideas and ideas are free.


So where is the dreamed Utopia? If its free why cant we just live in utopic conditions? .....It cost something, be it physical or intangible. Everything in this world has a cost be it a thougt or something tangible. Nothing is free. 

And WW2 was a fight for our freedom. Naziism was a socialist movement. It had a totallitarian ideology. Need it not be said that a socialist totallitarian govt wouldnt grand the individual freedoms that america promises to its citizens. And dont think for a second that just because the nazis didnt step foot on american soil, they wouldnt have came to us after europe was dominated. WW2 was a fight for our freedom, not only our freedom, but the freedom of all of the euroasian continent.


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## Mazzy

My point about WWII is that if we truely felt like our freedoms were being threatened as you say, we wouldn't have stayed nuetral for years. As for Hilter and Nazi Germany, if we had cared about his agenda, we would have entered the battle when it began, not years down the road. 
A country that feels it's freedoms are being threatened would certainly enter the battle rather than sit idley by remaining nuetral to both sides. If we were that concerned aobut Hilter we certainly wouldn't have maintained that nuetral status. We did not consider him or his movement a threat to our way of life, thus, we didn't get involved - until of course Japan bombed Pearl Harbor and we declared war against Japan, not Germany. It wasn't until Hilter declared war against the US that we awnsered by declaring war on Germany. So, we had no intention on fighting Germany to begin with nor, even after Pearl Harbor, did we see Hilter as any kind of threat since it wasn't until Hilter declared war on us that we were like "oh, ok then we declare war on you too". 
So, again, our freedoms were not threatened. We were not fighting to gain freedoms or to keep our own. Lastly, as with the Civil War, our involvement and the end to the atrocities Hilter was performing on Jewish people was a side effect, not the reason, we went to war. We did not say to ourselves that Hilter was horrible and we need to stop him. Instead we went about our business until we had no choice but to join the battle. It's that "no choice" part that is the difference between great leaders and warmongers ("warmonger" - another bumper sticker slogan. Kinda like "freedom fighter or "terrorist", it all depends on which side of the fence you are on. In other words, they are one in the same.)!


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## Fishboy93

Mazzy said:


> OK, I disagree.
> We got into WWI because German u-boats sank several British ships which happened to have Americans on them. There was outcry from the American people, the American gov't tried to restrain Germany's method of unresticted warfare (aka killing whom ever got in their way) and failed and so declared war on Germany. We did not get into that war to protect our own freedoms. Only our own gov't and our own people can take away our own freedoms.


Please note the fact of the Zimmerman Telegram urging Mexico to attack( Thus threatening our freedom)



Mazzy said:


> WWII - The US stayed neutral upto and until Japan bombed Pearl Harbor. The US then declared war on Japan, while Hilter declared war on the US and so the US followed suite by declaring war against Germany and thus, WWII. We did not get into that war to protect our own freedoms. Only our own gov't and our own people can take away our freedoms. .


Please note that this did threaten our freedom and the Japanese were already attacking the Phillipines( a US territory) and also were pressuring Alaska.


I agree with almost all of what you say after, but wasnt the point of this thread to just say "hey we're rebuilding" and not "They rebuilding it so we can blow it up and lets all get mad and flame each other"? meh..


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## harif87

Mazzy said:


> My point about WWII is that if we truely felt like our freedoms were being threatened as you say, we wouldn't have stayed nuetral for years. As for Hilter and Nazi Germany, if we had cared about his agenda, we would have entered the battle when it began, not years down the road.
> A country that feels it's freedoms are being threatened would certainly enter the battle rather than sit idley by remaining nuetral to both sides. If we were that concerned aobut Hilter we certainly wouldn't have maintained that nuetral status. We did not consider him or his movement a threat to our way of life, thus, we didn't get involved - until of course Japan bombed Pearl Harbor and we declared war against Japan, not Germany. It wasn't until Hilter declared war against the US that we awnsered by declaring war on Germany. So, we had no intention on fighting Germany to begin with nor, even after Pearl Harbor, did we see Hilter as any kind of threat since it wasn't until Hilter declared war on us that we were like "oh, ok then we declare war on you too".
> So, again, our freedoms were not threatened. We were not fighting to gain freedoms or to keep our own. Lastly, as with the Civil War, our involvement and the end to the atrocities Hilter was performing on Jewish people was a side effect, not the reason, we went to war. We did not say to ourselves that Hilter was horrible and we need to stop him. Instead we went about our business until we had no choice but to join the battle. It's that "no choice" part that is the difference between great leaders and warmongers ("warmonger" - another bumper sticker slogan. Kinda like "freedom fighter or "terrorist", it all depends on which side of the fence you are on. In other words, they are one in the same.)!


I see your point, but you didnt answer my question.

And just because we didnt realize it first doesnt mean we didnt realize it at all. In an ideal situation we would have recognized it after WW1 but we didnt. Nobody did. Did the jews in germany know that their freedom, as well as the right to live, would be taken away from them when hitler forced them into ghettos? No they didnt. Nobody did. The fact of the matter is that whether it took an incident like pearl harbor to push us into it or whether we realized it on our own makes no difference. Our freedom along with the freedom of the entire world was at steak, and the fact that those countries fought agianst those who sought to take away those freedoms are worthy of praise whether they knowingly fought for freedom or not.

World War 2 was a fight for freedom, along with other things... as was World War 1 and as was the french revolution.


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## Mazzy

Fishboy, I agree and understand that the point of the post was just to say "hey they are rebuilding" - which is fantastic IMO. But as I think I mentioned in another post, the subject allows a discussion like this by default. I don't see it as flaming. Yes, people will get mad but that comes with the territory and I still think it is a very positive thing to have this and other discussion like this. 

harif, I am assuming you mean the "dream Utopia" question? And my reply would be that there will always be those that prefer war over peace. It may sound strange but it is also very true. I'm not speaking of an "us and them" type of situation but of all people in all countries, including ours, in which there are those in power that benefit from war (Haliburton ring any bells). Truth be told, in some way, monetarily speaking, even we benefit from wars via moneies coming into our states from war manufacturing or other war related services. I can't explain it in detail but there is an excellent documentary on the subject called "Why we fight". I highly recommend viewing it. It is non-partisan. 
In addition to the few gaining from the deaths of the many, there is the simple fact that there are many people who can not even imagine peace. They can't fathom how we would all coexist peacefully. I think that is a very sad view of the world but it is still easier for many or even most to see the world in an "us and them" fashion rather than just imagine how it would be to live in harmony and then try to reflect that in our daily lives. Call it fear or prejudice or whatever, some will always hold that negativity within them and refuse to simply coexist and accept their fellow humans so Utopia is an unrealistic goal for our species regardless of the fact that freedom is a concept/idea and not a tangible object. 

And lastly, again Fishboy, thanks for pointing out those historical facts. I did not know of the Zimmerman telegram so I looked it up and am more knowledgable for it. However, I still don't see where this threatened our actual freedoms. Were we not allowed to go where we wanted and do what we wanted? No. Was there some great oppressor taking control over us or telling us how to live and where to work etc.? No. Was anything, even something as simple as the television, taken away from us? No. I just don't agree that our freedoms are threatened by others (save the Revolutionary War). I do believe that only we can let our freedoms go and unfortunately, at this time, we seem to be becoming so lazy and uninvolved in our own gov't that I don't see that as an impossiblity. As a matter of fact, I think we have become so complacent that that is what scares me most, Americans not caring about what the American gov't does to ourselves (again see Patriot Act) or to other countries which directly affects us (see 9/11).


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## Fishboy93

Regarding the Zimmerman Telegram- Mexico attacks us(they wont win but w/e) and then oppress us, so thats what I was talking about( In a hypothetical manner) I think we should have a debate section....


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## Mazzy

I agree a debate section would be cool. Unfortunately there are those who can debate with the understanding and acceptance of opposing views and those that can't. Defintely not saying I'm "above it", I can get jsut as mad as the next person but I prefer thoguht out awnsers and mutual respect prevail like I'm sure anyone does and I always learn something from that format.


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## harif87

Mazzy said:


> harif, I am assuming you mean the "dream Utopia" question? And my reply would be that there will always be those that prefer war over peace. It may sound strange but it is also very true. I'm not speaking of an "us and them" type of situation but of all people in all countries, including ours, in which there are those in power that benefit from war (Haliburton ring any bells). Truth be told, in some way, monetarily speaking, even we benefit from wars via moneies coming into our states from war manufacturing or other war related services. I can't explain it in detail but there is an excellent documentary on the subject called "Why we fight". I highly recommend viewing it. It is non-partisan.


So it costs somebody something. I mean if there are people that want war then the cost would be lack of war. Now that may not be a cost to you, but it is a cost to someone else. Whether or not that somebody else makes someone else pay because they recieved the brunt of the "deal" is a different story, but highly likely. But as the qupte says "what goes aroudn comes around" but thats totally off topic. The fact of the matter is that its not free. Like i said before; everything costs something, be it physical or intangible. I think you need to choose your wording more carefully, especially since you request a debate section. How can one debate if their ideas arent properly or concretely defined?


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## Mazzy

To use the arguement that blood for money is costing someone something I think is morbid to say the least. Again, freedoms, in respect to our countries Constitution, is an idea and that makes it free. As it says "we hold these truths to be *self evident*. So, just as our forefathers agreed, I believe that freedom is something you give yourself, or in the case of this debate, the "self evidence" of it would be that our freedoms are concrete and given to us by ourselves and no one else and therefore can not be taken away by anyone else (no one can threaten taking something you give to yourself) - self evident aka you already know you are free, no one needs to tell you so. So, if no one needs to tell you so (self evident), then in the same respect, no one can tell you you are not free anymore but you, or, no one but you can chain yourself.


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## Ice

*bangs head on wall*


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## harif87

Mazzy said:


> Again, freedoms, in respect to our countries Constitution, is an idea and that makes it free. As it says "we hold these truths to be *self evident*.


Yes freedom may be self evident, but who ever said that "self evident" things are free? Peace isnt free, itll come at the cost of getting rid of all those against peace. Social contracts are many times self evident, and the whole basis to the mundane social contracts comes at the price of two parties having to hold back from doing something in order to make the interaction between them successful.
In a marriage, its self evident that the husband and wife must remain fiathful to eachother (in matters from taking the kids to school in the morning to matters of cheating on the other spouse). But that faithfulness is a perfect example of how something "self-evident" can cost something. (Which in the case of a marriage is the holding back of doing what would benefit one spouse instead of doing what benefits both spouses). So i dont accept your implications of the phrase "self-evident"



> So, just as our forefathers agreed, I believe that freedom is something you give yourself, or in the case of this debate, the "self evidence" of it would be that our freedoms are concrete and given to us by ourselves and no one else and therefore can not be taken away by anyone else (no one can threaten taking something you give to yourself) - self evident aka you already know you are free, no one needs to tell you so. So, if no one needs to tell you so (self evident), then in the same respect, no one can tell you you are not free anymore but you, or, no one but you can chain yourself.


A person makes him/herself free? Then why did we need a constitution for it? What sparked the migration to a different land from europe? What was the motto of the french revolution? Why doesnt america have a monarchy? Why didnt the surfs free themselves? Why didnt the blacks free themselves? Why didnt the russian gouloge prisoners free themselvs? Im sorry but thats impossible. A person cannot make themself free. Throughout history, and even today, people impinge on other peoples freedoms in every aspect, again, be it physically or mentally. I really dont know where your going with this.


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## Osiris

#1
Stay on topic, all this started after a lil girl in lil boy's body made a terroist comment(swrdtalbrdr) 

Harif, was sharing pics that they are rebuilding, which is indeed nice to see. Hence a good quote "why do we fall, to pick ourselves back up" 

So keep it on topic last warning.


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## harif87

Like Osiris said, back to topic.

Here is one more shot i took before the weekend. Its not so great because the vantage point was blocked by a metal grate ..but better than nothing.


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## Guest

Very cool . Keep posting pics! It's great to see the progress.


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## Mazzy

So, based on the image below, does this mean there are still going to be the big squarefoot prints of the buildings and they are jsut building around the fringe of ground zero? And also, I see in the image one building is labelled "Tower 2" which of course it can not be so have all the remaining towers recieved new names?


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## harif87

The 2 square footprints are going to be memorials as far as i know. I think theyre going to build a few smaller buildings on the frontal periphary of the freedom tower.


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## Ice

Cool ... keep up the progress as it happens.

A side note : I remember going to NYC for the 1 year anniversary of 9/11 to at Yankee Stadium for a game, when I got the view of the skyline heading into NYC, it was wierd not seeing the World Trade Towers along side the Empire State Building. I felt a huge sadness of not seeing the towers in that skyline.


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## harif87

I feel you Ice. Its a noticable difference in the skyline and the gap just reminds everyone of what happened that day.
The thing is that over here its not uncommon for a person to have lost 3 or more people in the towers. Its actually pretty unlikely that there is a single person in NYC who hasnt lost someone in the towers, and we all know the losing someone is no joke. Three Thousand died that day. Three Thousdand people. Try to understand what that means. Imagine how many people lost a person that they love, be it a spouse, brother, sister, mother, father, kids, grandparents etc. then do the math. And they all died because they did nothing to a group of people who hate them anyway. The event is more than just the towers.....


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## Ice

I hear ya, bro. I'm well aware of the losses and the number of people that doknow more than one friends/relatives/collegues/neighbor that perished when the towers fell.


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