# DANG! What The?? (cories)



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

So, if you remember, my one little cory I thought was being fin nipped.....so they are all moved now. He didn't handle the melafix well so I stopped using it and removed them all from the 30 gallon tank to my 10. Well damned if one of the OTHER cories eyes aren't bulging!!! My ammonia is 0, my nitrites are 0 and I'll give you the nitrate reading tomorrow as my bottle seems to have mysteriously disappeared so I have to go pick up another. I did change the water about 5 days ago but I went ahead, after I tested it, and did about a 20% change today just in case. My fry are great, I've not lost a single one since I've been keeping them, the snails are sexing and reproducing, my big ass snail couldn't be fatter or eat more...........they are all in this tank. So what the hell would cause the pop eye? Do you suppose the fin issue was not nipping so much as fin rot (as suggested by another member) and is now manifesting as pop eye in a different cory? Good lord.........I just want them healthy! There's no salt or medication in this tank btw. Food is the same too. Temp is the same as the 30 gallon they came out of.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

I should say that the first cory I removed was being treated in a 5 gallon hospital tank and didn't do well with the melafix so I put all of the cories back together in the 10 gallon tank............thinking it was a nipping situation. Possibly the two situations are totally unrelated but nevertheless my question remains, what the heck could cause this?


----------



## harif87 (Jun 5, 2006)

Are both of your cories eyes "poped" or is it just one? because if its just one it is very possible that he hit his eye somewhere (like a rock, decoration, filter intake, another fish....) Is he eating/actiong normally?


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Both of his eyes are popped......... He does seem a bit "different" somehow, I can't quite put my finger on it though. I'm going to obsessively watch him tonight when my toddler goes to bed and won't bug me. He's eating, he's hanging with his buddies, but his eyes are really bugged and something just isn't right............ I love these damn little things.......I hate to see something happen to him, especially if its something I did wrong. I can't THINK of anything I've done that would hurt him though. All I did was move him from the 30 gallon to the 10. No one else has the pop eye problem and they actually seem to be quite comfortable in the 10 gallon. Hanging out together more and all. They even seem to like the snail (they hang around him sometimes and all the fish share (read: steal) his food.

I just don't know......... I can't test for nitrates till tomorrow but even still, would THAT cause this?? The last time I noticed this, I had added a tiny amount of salt to the tank for ich.....and rapidly removed it. No other fish in my 30 gallon are having health problems. No one in my 10 has had any problems.....and fry are supposed to be super sensitive, no? So, if nothing has affected them, I wouldn't think its a water quality problem so much as a bacteria or illness or something......... But I'm always johnny on the spot with my water changes, same amount each time, temp doesn't fluctuate too much (its pretty warm because of summer so I cool it at each change by about 2 degrees and I run a fan and keep the lid up), I check my params, I always wash my hands and rinse well before I put them in the tank, nothing foreign has been in there..........so wth?


----------



## harif87 (Jun 5, 2006)

All that explination makes me lean more to the idea that it wasnt cause by any disease rather i think he simply bruised his eyes. It could have happened when you were netting him out or it would have happened when you werent looking. Popeye wont kill your fish, its justa condition not a disease. On the other hand popeye can cause a fish to go blind in some cases if he hit himself really hard in which case he would go blind and die of starvation since he wouldnt be able to see the food. Also popeye can be an indicator of a bacterial or fungal disease inside the fish. But i dont think this is the case since your water stats are good. Just watch for abrnormal eating patterns or swimming patterns (or lack of swimming patterns) or anythign out of the ordinary. If you do those might be signs of a disease accompanies by the condition of popeye


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Well, that makes me feel a little better. I can see that it could have happened when I got them out of the tank, sure. Of course everyone tries to be super careful but they get bumped probably and their little eyes aren't exactly NOT prominent anyway. I'll watch him very closely and if I notice anything more or different, I'm coming back here for advice. I just hope he gets better and isn't in pain (it sure looks painful, huh?).

Thanks!


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

He does seem to be less active......although he's not having any irregular swimming patterns. He's just not as lively......its just bizarre to me. The one that was getting nipped is healing and looking great and now this guy. Weird.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Nope, I don't think he's doing well........in the tissue around his pectoral fins, its all red. Not his gills, but around his fins. He looks a bit bloated to me too. So bizarre. He was totally fine in the 30 gallon, and now he's not. The others are fine though and so is everyone else. The cory that was getting bitten is healing and doing great (he never acted any different at all). Just this one guy. It's really bugging me, I feel so helpless.......like there is something I should be doing. I'm headed to my LFS tomorrow anyway to replace my nitrate test stuff but I wonder if there is something I can do to help him. Melafix sortof freaked me out because it started making my injured cory's eyes bulge. Once I changed the water he was fine. I even halved the dosage.


----------



## Guest (Jun 27, 2006)

I'm sorry to hear about your poor little guy. What an awful thing for you and the fish to have to go through.  

I've never had good luck with MelaFix. I know that everyone who is anyone, all the way up to Jack Wattley, recommends MelaFix.

My platies were having fungal/bacterial issues (fin rot, lethargy, poor appetite, clamped fins, thick slime coat...they were pretty bad off) and I used Fungus Cure, which is made by Jungle Labs. I've never been a fan of Jungle Labs products, but I dropped in the tabs at a half dose and it fixed my fish right up! Of course there's no such thing as a miracle cure, but if this disease is resistant to MelaFix, you may want to try something with a little more kick. That's just my two cents worth. Best of luck!


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Do you think its worth trying if I'm not sure what the deal is? What I mean is, how does the risk weigh against the benefit? And.......do you know the dosage/safety with cories by any chance? Bear in mind also that they are in the tank with my snail and fry...... I CAN move him to a separate hospital tank (good lord, I just put it away.......crap).

Ugh.....this totally sucks. I hate thinking he's in pain and I hate thinking he may suffer until I do the right thing. Sorta makes me think this whole fish thing isn't for me, I don't have the testicular fortitude for it. I'm not one for seeing anything suffer or die, which fish seem to do more than other critters.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

I just looked the stuff up.....and it actually seems like he may have a bacteria, from what I read on their site. However it says not recommended for crustaceans, I wonder how it affects mollusks?? Probably best to move him to the hospital tank eh?


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

As I read more I become concerned about everyone else thats in the tank.........so maybe I SHOULD leave him in there and treat the whole tank now. Great, so I probably just infected everyone. Fabulous. ^%$^%#&R&^#&^%R#&^#$^!!!!!


----------



## Guest (Jun 27, 2006)

My goodness, msdolittle! Are you _always_ here? :lol: Oh wait, I'm always here, too. Your dilemma is one where it's difficult to weigh the consequences of action versus inaction. I don't like the pasta method, where you throw a bunch of medication against the wall and see what sticks--especially not when there are other fish in the tank.

You said the fish is pretty bad off, and it sounds like it is. There is a "point of no return", so to speak, with fish. Once they reach a point, they aren't gettin' better. If you think the fish is there, you may as well just make the little feller as comfortable as possible. If you think there's still a chance, I'd give it a try. 

As far as dosage, I do half doses regardless of what kind of fish I'm treating or what kind of medication I'm using (except MelaFix...I've used full dosage on that). I believe cories typically require a half dose, so it works out well for them. 



> Ugh.....this totally sucks. I hate thinking he's in pain and I hate thinking he may suffer until I do the right thing. Sorta makes me think this whole fish thing isn't for me, I don't have the testicular fortitude for it. I'm not one for seeing anything suffer or die, which fish seem to do more than other critters.


Aw, don't let this get ya down. We all have those moments in fish-keeping when we feel like throwing in the towel. I can see your passion for fish and for maintaining well-being in all your animals. The world needs more people like you keeping pets. Just "hang in there." "This too shall pass." >>>insert further inspiring cliches here<<<

Just a thought on the side. I personally despise Mbuna, but a lot of people love them and you can't kill them without a hammer. I actually left one in a bucket with only enough water to cover half its body when I was redecorating the tank for about 4 hours. I checked every piece of every rock and decoration I pulled out of the tank to make sure there were no fish, but somehow this one got by me. When I got home, I went out to the garage (in the middle of winter) and saw the fish laying in the bucket looking REALLY mad. I put him back in the tank and he was fine. All that to say, you won't have to worry so much about your fish if you get tougher ones.


----------



## harif87 (Jun 5, 2006)

Dont be too hard on yourself ms dolittle. You said he looks bloated, which is a good thing since you know more about the problem. If in fact he is bloated then try feeding him a pea (thats been boiled and de-shelled). He might bo constipated which could case fluid buildup inside him. It also might be a bacterial infection. Before you start treating for a bacterial infection i suggest you do the pea idea first as it will eliminate an unneccsary dosage of meds if the pea solvs things. Also if you can its always better to move fish that are being treated to a quarantine tank. But then again thats only if you can. Good luck !!


----------



## Guest (Jun 27, 2006)

Sorry I took so long to post...gave you time to post twice before I got mine out. :lol: The other fish have definitely been _exposed_, but not necessarily _infected_. Just like with people, we are around disease all the time, but we don't always get sick. When a fish's immune system is compromised from stress, poor water quality, deficient diet, etc., they become more susceptible to disease. This is not to say that a healthy fish will never get sick, but it greatly reduces the risk.

I would treat the fish in a separate tank. If the treatment works, you know what to use on the other fish if they do become infected. That's my opinion...take it for what it's worth.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

LOL Michael you smarty pants. Actually, I have been here much of the day because I'm so freaked out (and I'm sortof a spaz by nature, so this isn't helping). That and my little one goes to bed at 7, the ol'man works nights so I'm solo all night long!! You didn't ask for a lecture did you......oh well. 

Mbuna? I'll have to look that up...... Yes, being a softie was a burden AND an advantage as a vet tech and I guess the same is true in pet keeping.......It makes me try to do the best I can for my pets but its ultra heartbreaking for me when something goes wrong. And then I worry forever about it. Probably this will mess with my sleep tonight and I'll have to go out first thing in the morning for medicine for him. So, needless to say......no I don't want to give up on him. I don't want him to suffer but I sure as hell can't let him die without a fight. He seems to have gotten worse since I initially made this thread. First it was just his eyes bulging, then he seemed a little fatter, now I notice the reddish around his pectoral fins...... It ain't lookin' good.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

harif87 said:


> Dont be too hard on yourself ms dolittle. You said he looks bloated, which is a good thing since you know more about the problem. If in fact he is bloated then try feeding him a pea (thats been boiled and de-shelled). He might bo constipated which could case fluid buildup inside him. It also might be a bacterial infection. Before you start treating for a bacterial infection i suggest you do the pea idea first as it will eliminate an unneccsary dosage of meds if the pea solvs things. Also if you can its always better to move fish that are being treated to a quarantine tank. But then again thats only if you can. Good luck !!



Ooh, I'll do the pea thing tonight. I actually just read about this on another thread here!


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Yep and I'll move him too.........wowza. Thats alot of activity for this little fart. I think I'm going to do that now, I'd hate to leave him all night. I'll give him his little pea too. Jeez its getting late here, I better get a move on. Kiddo wakes up early!


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

I swear to God I'm not high..........but the little mother is down there eating! The redness has faded but his eyes are still buggie. How the heck does he change so fast?? Anyway, I'm currently boiling his peas.......


----------



## harif87 (Jun 5, 2006)

Just so you know, that you should give the eyes about a week to heal if its not a bacterial infection. So in either case dont expect the size to poof down to regular size. The poor thing got a black eye ......(that is if its bruised). But like i said its not the eyes that kill fish, its the bacteria that the popeye accompanies, is what kills fish. But who knows if its either....


----------



## Guest (Jun 27, 2006)

I was wondering about your soft heart affecting being a vet tech. That's one of the things that kept me from trying to become a vet (notice I said try...ultimately it would have been my lack of intelligence that would have prevented me :lol: ).

Mbuna are a colorful cichlid that come from Africa. They are all basically the same shape, but come in a variety of colors and are about the most colorful fish you can get in freshwater. This will give you a few ideas. It's not by any means an all-inclusive list, but it gives a good place to start.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Well, all the cories are chowing on those peas.........I wondered if they'd like them and they really do! I sincerely hope its not an internal or systemic infection. I'll see what the situation looks like in the morning before I do any sort of medicating. If he's eating and acting okay, I'll just make sure and baby him and watch the water params ultra closely (which I actually do in that tank because my fry are in there).

I think I need to go to bed now but thank you M & M (Michael and Morris) for bearing with a spazzed out freaky wuss in her time of need.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

|V|][{|-|/\[-|_ said:


> I was wondering about your soft heart affecting being a vet tech. That's one of the things that kept me from trying to become a vet (notice I said try...ultimately it would have been my lack of intelligence that would have prevented me :lol: ).
> 
> Mbuna are a colorful cichlid that come from Africa. They are all basically the same shape, but come in a variety of colors and are about the most colorful fish you can get in freshwater. This will give you a few ideas. It's not by any means an all-inclusive list, but it gives a good place to start.



Interesting! I thought that word sounded familiar. I do often think that sometime in the future if I ever got a bigger tank...the cichlids are very pretty. I tried to save one a month or so ago as a matter of fact.......I just happened to have a tank set up with nothing in it and ran into a poor thing getting eaten alive in a pet store. Pricks wouldn't let me have him though......

The soft heart didn't so much as get in the way being a VT as it made me do a better job, or so I think. I was good at it.


----------



## harif87 (Jun 5, 2006)

Have a good one


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Night guys.


----------



## Guest (Jun 27, 2006)

"Spazzed out freaky wuss"...is that what they're calling concerned and attentive people these days? Well, at any rate, take care and let us know how it goes. And by all means, get some sleep!


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Well, he was worse this morning. I thought he was dead, he was floating behind the filter........I fished him out (he did try to get away) and put him in the 5 gallon tank. I went and got some maracyn 2 this morning. I'm using half dosages.......... He's swimming but his fins are all blood streaked now.

Keep your fingers crossed for the little guy!


----------



## Barb (Jun 25, 2006)

I'm sorry Angela, your fishy does sound sick. I had a fish years ago with the red streaked fins, and I am almost positive it was maracyn that I bought for him. It worked, so I hope it works for you, too.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Me too Barb.........He's still fighting so I do have some hope.


----------



## harif87 (Jun 5, 2006)

The red streaks could be signs of parasites or bad water conditions too.....just a lil more input


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Well, I wouldn't think its water conditions. I never miss a water change, my ammonia is 0, nitrites are 0 and I checked nitrates this morning they were less than 5. I don't have a ton of gunk in there, it smells fresh, no chlorine, ph and hardness haven't changed much (that I can remember correctly from when I last tested them until now). I don't overfeed so there isn't an abundance of food laying around........ Thats why this is so weird to me........ that and no one else is affected.

Regardless of all of that, he's sick so apparently SOMETHING is wrong. I just can't figure out what it is........ 

Now, how would he get parasites? Is that something that could come in on live plants maybe? I have put a few in here and there.

Oh, well......there is one thing. The temps are higher than normal because of summer. Its even gotten up to 80 degrees in their (former) tank. I try to keep it cooler with fans and leaving the lid up and adding cooler water. But, could that be the culprit?

The 10 gallon tank that they are now living in is cooler than the 30 that they came from. Its usually around 76 in that tank.....give or take a degree.

He's still hanging in. He's swimming but not eating much really. I gave him a couple peas and one shrimp pellet this morning but he hasn't really touched them. 

I'm watching him closely for any changes......

Another question, with the maracyn..........since I'm halving the dosage, should I still do as the directions say and add more each day (just by half)? It says the point of that is to get to a therapeutic dose in the water......so eventually he'll be at half the therapeutic dose for regular fish, so will half the dose be therapeutic for a cory?


----------



## Guest (Jun 28, 2006)

Hi msdolittle. I'm sorry to hear your little guy is still worse for the wear. Maracyn has proven to be a pretty reliable medicine, so hopefully that will do the trick. 

A temperature of 80F shouldn't be a problem for the little guy. I keep all my tanks at 80 and my turtle tank even at 85. I've heard from people who know that this helps prevent infections since part of treatment for most infections is raising the temperature. And the fish should be quite comfortable at 80.

With the Maracyn dosing, follow the directions, but half the dose. If memory serves, it's one tablet per 10 gallons every 24 hours. So you will treat 1/2 tablet per 10 gallons every 24 hours.


----------



## violet (Mar 17, 2006)

If you have seen redness in or at the base of the fins it is commonly a sign of an INTERNAL bacterial infection. Not really uncommon in corys. Septic infections like that can be contagious and I would treat all the fish IF that is the true problem.

I think it is Maracy Two which can be absorbed through the gills. I don't like dumping meds in the tank if I can help it. I use a medicated food with a AntiB from the tetracycline family, I want to say oxytetracycline but I am not sure.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Violet, I considered getting a medicated food......but then when I really thought about it, he's not eating much so it wouldn't help us really. 

I don't anticipate him making it through the night.......he's doing pretty bad. He's awefully pink now, it looks like he's bruised all through his underbelly........ I almost wish I could just euthanize him because he looks like he's in so much agony. I just don't know HOW or if I even could do it. 

I'm watching my other fish with an obsession so I will notice the very first sign of anything and I will treat immediately.


----------



## harif87 (Jun 5, 2006)

Hey ms doolittle, do you have any pics of him that we could use to assess the symptoms?


----------



## violet (Mar 17, 2006)

At some point I think I will get some Tricaine and then use the freezer but I either use clove oil or super chilled ice water for small fish.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Rest in peace little fella....... He passed away today. I just buried him in my flower garden. :'(


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

You know what, if I'd seen this before I found him (we just got home from the park) then I'd have taken a pic of his little body........... He looked all bruised on the underside of him and his fins, where they attach to his body, looked full of blood. Poor guy..... At least he's not suffering anymore.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Okay, this is very morbid but I dug him back up so I could take a pic (sorry little man!!!) and maybe help a future situation. Here he is.


----------



## Barb (Jun 25, 2006)

I'm sorry, Angela. (((hugs)))


----------



## MaryPa (Jan 25, 2006)

Ouch, poor guy. That`s why I keep Maracyn Plus on hand all the time. It saved my cory and many other fish I rescued.


----------



## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Thanks Barb and MP. Now I have the meds on hand just in case something like this happens again.....


----------

