# need help quick



## chronoboy (Jan 17, 2011)

Ok so today i go in the spare room to feed my angels and rams, and to my suprise there is eggs sitting on one of the rocks and i dont know what fish laid the eggs, i have pics and i hope maybe sombody on here can tell me if it was the rams or the angels, plus i didnt even think any of them had paired up, so now i dont know what fish laid the eggs even if i find out if it was the rams or the angels, so now i dont know what to do, do i leave them in there to be eaten or do i take them out but if i take them out do i need to take the parents out with them, how do i know if they have been fertilized or not, plus im on my way to go get another tank and stuff for a breeder tank but i dont know what all i need, if anybody can help me it would be great.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Those do look like cichlid eggs. It looks more like a ram place than an angel place (they like high, vertical surfaces), but its not definitive. The main difference is the size. They look a lot like angel eggs to me, but I can't tell scale from the pic. 

If they stay clear like that, they are fertilized, if they go opaque white, they aren't. Look at your fish, the guilty party should have visibly extended breeding tubes. Move the pair to their own tank, feed well and hope they will raise the next batch for you.

If the parents aren't trying to scare you away from the eggs, the eggs likely will be pleco food by morning. Move the whole rock into a 1 or 2 gallon glass or plastic jar with an air-stone, tank water and a few drops of anti-fungal. Put the whole jar in a 5 or 10 gallon tank full of water with a heater in the tank. Use a tweezers to pluck out eggs that turn bright white. Get a small sponge filter or two (one jar-sized, one tank-sized and put them in the parents tank to get 'cycled'.

You will have a few days before eggs hatch. Use the time to read some of the excellent angelfish raising instructions on the web. Ram care is exactly the same, except smaller. Get some small, live food such as microworms or baby brine shrimp. Also get a supply of teeny frozen and powdered food for backup. Baby brine shrimp, rotifers, daphnia, and stuff about that size. Don't feed until 'free swimming' a cloud of little fish swimming, not rocking on round bellies or hanging from strings.


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## chronoboy (Jan 17, 2011)

Ok so i went and found me a 10 gallon setup up for 30 bucks, came with hood lights filter, oh ya some start up stuff like dechlor and flakes, so now i have set this tank up in my office for now, i took some rocks i got from outside and boiled them for an hour, then i placed them in the tank and then filled it up with water out of my 55g, then i took the filters out of my 55g and rinsed them out in the new 10g (they needed to be rinsed out anyways they where getting clogged) and now i have it cycling and the water is brown and murky as heck from rinsing the filters in it but i guess that is a good thing, so tomarrow I'm going to head down to the LFS and pick up a heater and some sand and i think then it will be ready for some breeding.

On another note i have found the parent to the eggs, i walked in there when i got home and one of the rams was guarding them and has been everytime i walk in there, not letting any fish get near them plus its got a little tube thing comming out of its bottom, but then i noticed another one of my rams is about ready to lay some eggs she got the same tube thing and is looking a little plump and pinkish in the belly, so now i dont know what to do, do i put both mothers in the ten gallon, or do i just put one in and leave the other one in the 20g and take all the angels out and find them new homes, plus how do i know what ones they have paired with or can one male pair with two? and now im starting to think the solid blue ones are the males since the ones with the black stripes and blue spots are the ones that layed the eggs.

I'm thinking im going to need alot of help since i have never breed fish before, I figured i would have more time before they started breeding and laying eggs, but i was wrong i guess, so all the help i can get would be awsome.


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## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Well, both the male and female get the spawning tubes, so those are probably not two mothers, but the male/female pair responsible. That should help you come up with a plan a bit more easily.
Of course, just my luck, the fish guarding the eggs is not one with a tube? In that case, you should keep that one and the two with tubes together, whatever else you do.

If you mess around too much with them, they'll probably eat the eggs and ruin all the plans anyway. My advice would be to move the rock instead to another tank and take care of the fry yourself. Put an airstone near the eggs to provide water circulation, but keep the bubbles from actually touching the eggs.
While waiting for the hatch, get some food ready. You should have just enough time.


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## chronoboy (Jan 17, 2011)

so can i keep my 20g with all 5 rams in it their only a inch long each, and just take out all the angels? do you think they would leave each others babies alone or should i just separate them to their own tanks? my issue right now is room for all the fish, I got three tanks setup right now. 55g, 20g, 10g, and the 55g is filled the ten gallon is empty and the 20g has 6 small angels and 5 small rams, i plan on giving away the angels but its not as easy as it sounds nobody seems to want free angelfish right now.


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## chronoboy (Jan 17, 2011)

oh ya and i went this morning to grab the rock out with the eggs on it and well they where eaten, i was hoping i could wait till today to move them into the ten cause i wanted to wait for the water to clear up but i guess i should of done it right away, oh well atleast i know i can get them to spawn now, plus im prepared with a breeding tank now.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

plecos get eggs at night, or parents decide to eat them first if the are nervous. Sometimes leaving the lights on can help. 

Rams are usually pair spawners (the pink belly is the female. The spot or lack of black spots is color variety, not gender.) But i have heard of them acting like apisto harem-spawners. A male defends a larger territory divided into areas for 2 female and he spawns with both. 

A 20L might just be big enough for 2 pairs of rams. Can you give away the goldfish and put the angels in the 55? 

But since they ate the eggs, put a pair in the 10 and see if any more pairs form in the 20.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

depending on temps , the eggs could have hatched last night and the parents moved them to another spot..keep an eye on them to make sure..in the mean time get your breeding set up in order so you don't have to mess with it later...place their breeding rock in a spot where it has some cover or protection.....
chrono....email me your address and i will send you a couple of samples of fry foods....
[email protected]


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## toddnbecka (Jun 30, 2006)

In the pics the eggs look white, so they may not have been fertile.


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