# I've finally decided!



## Dragonbeards (Dec 14, 2008)

OK, I have been asking lots of questions around the forums, pertaining to what should I put in my 20g when it is empty, and I have finally made a desicion. It is (hopefully) my final choice, so I am going to need a little help. 

Below are the list of fish I want to get for my Southeast Asia Biotope, and also, the list of plants I want to get. 

How many of each of these fish should I get? Also, is there something I need to know about the fish/plants I have chosen? I do plan on doing a lot of research, as I am sure _this_ is what I want.

Fish


Dwarf Loach (_Botia sidthimunki_)
Horse Faced Loach_ (Acantopsis choirorhynchus)_
Purple-headed Barb_ (Puntius nigrofasciatus)_
Five-banded Barb_(Puntius pentazona)_
Cherry Barb_ (Puntius titteya)_


Plants


Crinum thaianum  
Ceratopteris thalictroides  
Hygrophila difformis  
Nymphaea lotus  
Cryptocoryne willisii  




Sand or gravel substrate
Driftwood
Heavily planted


Thanks in advance for the time. I try not to change my mind so much, but I am female, and as mom says "Females are supposed to change their mind a lot. It keeps men on their toes." 


Dragonbeards


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## N0z (Jun 3, 2009)

cherry barb are very nice fish but i dono what the other ones are so cant help you there xD


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

Cool fish choices! But....you have schooling/shoaling fish there.....and a 20g isn't all that big, so you really shouldn't have 3 schools of fish. I would choose 1 type of Barb and have 6-8 of them....and then maybe find a centerpiece type SE Asian fish to add....along with the Dwarf Loaches. Horse-faced loaches get like 8"...so a little on the large size for a 20g IMO.

I think Honey Gouramis are SE Asian....so you could have a pair of those for centerpiece....or a single Betta. 

Plant choices look good.  FYI H. difformis and C. thalictroides look very similar. There are many Cryptocoryne species...some tall and some stay shorter, so you could mix in more if you wanted. Crypts are cool plants.


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## Dragonbeards (Dec 14, 2008)

How's this:

4-6 Dwarf loaches
6-8 Cherry Barbs

and one of these fish. I was just looking for SE Asia fish, so I have no clue the size tank any of these grow to need. The website I tried wasn't very helpful

1 Greater Scissortail

or

1 Scat

or

1 Archer fish

or 

1 Smallscale Archer

These could all need enormously huge tanks, or a 20g would be fine, I honestly don't know, because again, the site I tried wasn't to helpful in that aspect. It did give me a good list of SE Asia fish though, so that's why I tried it.


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## Guest (Jun 5, 2009)

DB,

Archer fish : will grow up to 10 inches

Small Scale Archer Fish: will grow up to 6inches.

Scat Fish: largest i've seen is about 9 inchs but rumoured to get up to 12 inches.

Greater Scissortail: no idea sorry

i dont think your 20GL is suited for any of these guys but thats just my opinion.

Cheers!


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

is a 20 gallon even big enough for a bunch of dwarf loaches? Don't they need more swimming room than that?


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

I think the Loaches will be fine in a 20g....and Cherry Barbs are good choices too. The others listed ^ aren't so good. Like Zakk said, they all get too big for a 20g (that Greater Scissortail gets 5-6" and looks like they are a schooling fish).


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## Dragonbeards (Dec 14, 2008)

So what centerpiece fish would you recommend? I'm thinking of a single, bigger fish, that will grab the attention of anyone looking at the tank. Not necessarily brightly colored and such, just bigger than the smaller barbs and loaches, so that it really stands out.


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

A gourami would be good, but the larger ones need more swimming area than a 20g can provide IMO. I would stick with 1 or 2 Honey Gouramis...they aren't larger than the loaches, but are a tad larger and taller than the Barbs. It will be hard to find something SE Asian, small enough for a 20g, and that can be kept singly and larger than your other fish.  There are too many restrictions.


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## StripesAndFins (Dec 31, 2008)

the scats, archers, etc. are all brackish water fish too. you could do a pair of dwarf gouramis which are a little bit bigger than the honeys. Good luck!


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## Guest (Jun 6, 2009)

actually Stripes, they do well in both enviroments. i had a scat that lived well over 3 years and then i traded him with a friend when i was moving house.

personally, i suggest as a center piece, IF the tanks height is 18 inches, a nice black or koi angel pair. preferably established.

hope this helps.


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## StripesAndFins (Dec 31, 2008)

Zakk its probably not 18in high. most 20s come in 24x12x16, or 30x12x12. and an angel pair shouldnt be kept in a community set-up in anything less than a 29 gallon. a pair alone, maybe in a 20gal high, but not in a community. My opinion on the Dwarf gouramis stays the same.


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## Guest (Jun 6, 2009)

i;ve got 4 in my 25. 18H.


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## Dragonbeards (Dec 14, 2008)

4-6 Dwarf loaches
6-8 Cherry Barbs
1-2 Three Spot Gourami

This sound like a good list? Is there anything I need to know about any of these fish? They will get along fine, right?


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

Three spot gouramis get too large for a 20g (5-6").....and they are rarely peaceful....so you definitely wouldn't want 2. I would go for a smaller gourami. The tank is only 20g.


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

Dwarf gouramis are nice too. I had one, and he was really nice. But they may not get as big as you would like.


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## Guest (Jun 6, 2009)

but again, Dwarf Gourami's are prone to die easy! its something called Dwarf Gourami Sickness! unless you willing not to get attached to him, i'd say go for it. BUT, on the other hand, you ARE looking for a centerpiece fish, which means, you will inadvertently get attached to it. so that means you are back to looking again.

sorry DB!


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

really? they tend to die easily? I have never heard of that before.
Is it kind of like how neons die randomly from that neon tetra disease?

Maybe i just got lucky with mine?


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## Guest (Jun 6, 2009)

neon tetra are just delicate lil darlings! i guess its all got to with all the inbreeding goin on that make them weak.


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## N0z (Jun 3, 2009)

i had 2 Gourami's clean out my hole tank of fish so i wouldnt get them


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## StripesAndFins (Dec 31, 2008)

how about this: orange chromide. they stay about 3.5 inches and live around India/Sri Lanka. it is a cichlid so i dont know about its temperment. http://www.aquariumlife.net/profiles/asian-cichlids/orange-chromide/100053.asp


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

i would be very careful when adding cichlids to a community tank. Even the ones that are supposed to be good with other fish have personalities of their own.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

hmmmmmm..i raised 17 gold marble angels in a 38 gallon tank....is that more than 2 for a 20??


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## StripesAndFins (Dec 31, 2008)

your a fish genius. you could keep 2 angels in a five gall and get 100 fry per week. you can do anything and have it work out for you.


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## Dragonbeards (Dec 14, 2008)

My tank is of the 24Lx12Wx16H variety. What would you recommend? I am getting mixed reviews about the angels. Would they do OK in the tank, with good filtration and lot's of plants? Or am I best to keep looking? 

Goodness, if I knew it would be this hard to find fish for the SE Asia biotope, I would have picked something else  . But I really like the SE Asia loaches and barbs (plus I know places to get them) so I guess it is good just to keep looking.


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2009)

Sarcasm aside SAF, yes, anything IS possible IF you know what you are doing. Fortunatly for Loha, he has years of experience behind him in keeping healthy fishes, not to mention that he doesnt have to go to school, unfortunatly you do, which means he has time to do more wc's there by ensuring a healthy overstocked tank than reading up and studying which i think is a total waste of time. schools dont perpare you for the real world anyway!


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

Zakk said:


> schools dont perpare you for the real world anyway!


lol lol lol lol lol
that is the funniest comment!
It is so true though! Half the things I learn in school, i will never use in the future!


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2009)

its true buddy!

i'm a double post grad holder and a triple grad holder.

MBA, MA Eng Litt : Post Grad.
BA History, BA Western Classicasl Music and BSc Computer Science :Grad.

where did that all lead me to? A Mortgage Company! playing with numbers come easy to me but the schooling system doesnt allow for me to do that. my admissions depened on my grads and not my apptitude!


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## <3~Pleco~<3 (Jan 31, 2009)

i have no idea what I'm going to be or do in the future yet.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

here is the thing about schooling that a lot of folks don't realize...
while there are many things you will not use much in the future; but it is important that they are stored away in your head just in case you may need them..
it is very much about rounding you out to have the ability to adapt to many different situations....
lol..... i wish that i only had to go to school.. when i started keeping; i was working 12 hours a day.. sometimes 7 days a week..even when i had over 100 tanks set up ; i still worked 12 hours.. and rasised kids too.

schools do prepare you zak...just not how you think they would....lol

if you want to make money; get your degree in chemical engineering..then go get your MBA.
t is what my brother in law did.. after his former employer downsized and let him go; he has had to take a pay cut down to $350,000 a year.. but where he works now; he is next in line to be president of the company..


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2009)

Maybe sir....you do have a point. i


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## Dragonbeards (Dec 14, 2008)

Sure learn a lot when you are homeschooled...

Anyways, back on topic, I have a book of fish (just got it yesterday, it's so cool) one of the fish in there is the Badis. Would that work? I should look through the whole book, but I haven't gotten around to that. Maybe I will find something.


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2009)

i'm guessing Scarlet Badis or is there some other name?


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## Dragonbeards (Dec 14, 2008)

In the book, it just said "Badis". The scientific name is "Badis badis" if that helps.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

what does the name "badis badis" make you think of?????

BAD BAD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

they are mean little rascals...
the reds are gorgeous..the blues very pretty..i have kept both..they managed to kill several of my fish before i could get them out...i sent them to the swirling river...

stripe...yes..i could keep a breeding pair of angels in a 5 gallon tank...... but i would not get 100 babies a week from them.... closer to 300.....lol

dragon my friend...how could you have "finally decided" when you can't decide?.......lol...........this can be a very frustrating hobby..there are so many fantastic fish out there, that it is almost impossible to figure out which one you want ; because every new one you see you want more than the last one you saw...and there is always another one to look at...

but...if you really like the angels; i think 2 of them would be fine in your tank... just remember to make sure any tankmates are too big for them to eat...

here is a pic of one of my old angel tanks..lousy pic and the glass is really dirty ; but oh well...
this is one end of a 75....about the same number of fish on the other end.....lol


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## Guest (Jun 7, 2009)

thats a scarlet badis. badis badis doesnt exist anymore. yupp they make a nice fish but go with an angel IMO.

Loha,

i got one that looks JUST like the silver with the yellow crown minus the black markings. the skin is pure silver.


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## Dragonbeards (Dec 14, 2008)

Yes, I thought I had decided too. But the same problem keeps poppong up. To much to choose from! But the angels will be fine? Good. So. Once more, the list is:

4-6 Dwarf Loaches
6-8 Ruby Barbs (0r another type of barb, depends on what the store has)
2 Angles

I sincerly hope this is the last revision. The angels sound good. Eye catching, beautiful, and mom loves them. That is always a plus.

Oh, about the angels, I have heard there is problems getting good stock? Or is this just with the Petco/Petsmart angels? My LFS has some angels in regularly, they keep em in stock because they go so fast. They also get in barbs, so that just leaves the loaches to find.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

hey zakk...take a loot at this site.....

http://en.microcosmaquariumexplorer.com/wiki/Angelfish_Types


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## Tallonebball (Apr 6, 2009)

In my experience barbs can be very nippy with fish with long fins, such as angel fish... I wouldn't recommend angels with barbs besides gold barbs.


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## Guest (Jun 8, 2009)

awesome!!!!!!! thanks Sir! 
So far i've got:

1 Redhead Marbled Angelfish (non blusher)
1 Black Marbled Angelfish
1 Golden Angelfish
1 Golden Angelfish with Orange markings on the head and few patches of black on the body!


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

Cherry Barbs aren't nippy in my experience, so they should be fine with Angels. The hard part will be keeping 2 Angels in a 20g from beating each other up and the other fish. Keep your fingers crossed that you get a pair and that they don't breed.


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## Guest (Jun 9, 2009)

hey SB,

i got 4 mature angels in my 25. apart from your usual chasing around its quite fine. they get along together quite well.


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## SouthernBelle23 (Mar 24, 2009)

Yours are small....I'd like to see what happens when they get mature.  Juvie angels behave differently than mature angels....and they sometimes get more aggressive as they mature...especially if a pair forms.


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## Guest (Jun 9, 2009)

ummmm actually they are easy 5inch tip to tip. the juvies didnt make it. these are 4 big adults.


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## betta0fish (Feb 16, 2009)

A single male betta is nice


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

thie pic is about 1/2-2/3 of a 75 gallon tank.. no problems with the fish getting along... none had beat up or killed any ot the others... none were juveniles..all adults or just turning.. i used this tank for their pairing off.. 
so i think that 2 in a 20 gallon high will be fine...
although i am not an angel expert by any stretch of the imagination... i have kept a few in my time and these are just my observations and opinions..


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