# 20g Long Cycling thread



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

Just in case a problem shows up, but so far things going good. Started the fishless cycle 1/4/14 and just tested for Nitrites today(forgot yesterday) and they were around .5 to 1ppm (those purples are so close to the other I can't really tell, though Im leaning more towards 1ppm cus it was a bit darker) so... YAY! Haha, just when I was about ready to just say forget this crud i'ma go get TSS to jump start it

my tank was like: "Nope! We ganna save ya 10$. Here have some bacteria!"

Here is my tank so far:









The plants (except the sword and anubis) I ordered from someone but everything but the Wisteria and Dwarf Sag. aren't doing too great. I know plants have a tendency to melt back when put in a new tank. I have 3 long stem plants that are still going strong and one of the smaller ones have new baby leaves sprouting at the base so we'll see.

I have Flourish substrate under Sand with API root tabs. I'll get Flourish liquid fertilizer soon to dose the tank 1-2 times a week. No CO2, and no plans for it in the future either. I'll be getting some more plants from Petsmart soon (anubias nana... love that darn thing omg). This picture was when I first planted things in there so it's a bit thinner now because I've pinched off a lot of the plants down to the very last nub.

There's a 4200k light in the stand atm... I plan to get to lowes/home depo soon and get a 6500k one. Still want to find one more piece of driftwood to put in there... somewhere. maybe two more... but petsmart has crappy choices ATM and i am NOT spending 30$ for fake... plastic wood


----------



## Ice (Sep 25, 2006)

Skip on the Tetra brand stuff - they're garbage. Get API instead.


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

You said you are not using co2, using a source of liquid carbon instead, like flourish excel?


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

And looks nice


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

Liquid carbon huh? hmm I'll look for it. Petsmart has only 3 kinds of 'liquid' fertalizer: Flourish, Aqueon, and API. though they just said liquid plant fert. Is there carbon IN those? Or is there a specific bottle meant for carbon?

I've heard things that Excel causes problems for some plants though?


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

Yeah it melts some plants, other members will be able to say which ones as it has never melted mine.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

ahh... mmm maybe i'll stay away from that. I don't want to risk it. I know there are a few plants that REQUIRE CO2... but from my research it is not 100% necessary for most planted aquariums, so I'll just stick to just the fertilizers P: So if i end up with a plant that need CO2 100%... if they live... they live, if they don't I won't fuss over it.


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

I know loha does it completely without co2 and he has some miraculous plant growth, no clue how he does it.


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

a while back when i occasionally used ferts i used miracle gro...i also used job's plant spikes to put under sword plants.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

miracle grow won't leech harmful chemicals into the water and harm the fish? I heard about someone else doing that and seemed like their tank was fine but I was hesitant to believe it didn't harm the fish o-o I do have spikes that I use on my plants in my gecko vivariums but they're just tubes of fert, not in any covering or pouch of sorts I guess you could call them. They're uh... -goes to look- Jobes Fertilizer spikes. I have TONS OF THEM cus I bought a 50 pack for the price of a 25pack LOL would those work?


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

yep...them's the ones..break one in half and put it under a plant..never had a problem with miracle gro and the fish..about 1 teaspoon per 20 gallons.dissolve it in water first , then pour it in.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

interesting. Well I'll plop those in then with the root tabs


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

As of today the ammonia reads: 2-4ppm
Nitrites are around 2-5ppm
Nitrates are somewhere in the 5-20ppm (oranges are a bit difficult to tell apart but I'm leaning more towards 5ppm just cus it's still got a yellow-hue)

Is it just me or is this cycling really fast o-o I thought it took about a week for Nitrates to show up? Oh well... I'm not complaining. Go little tank, go!!! -cheers-


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

Well you probably introduced bacteria into the tank by putting those plants in there (just learned that from macshrimp). Now you don't need to wait for the bacteria to form, just for it to grow in size).


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

oooooh interesting. I didn't think plants could carry enough bacteria to make much of an impact.


----------



## TheJakeM (May 11, 2013)

The bacteria live on surface area, so all the leaves and such could actually carry a good amount. Not as much as substrate or a filter though.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

kind of look at it like a live food culture..you start with a little bit...you feed it....give it some time and it grows and multiplies..


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

I didn't think so either, but i guess they do.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

funfun.. well ya learn something new every day 

Nothing's changed today. The Nitrites seem a bit darker today but... the ammonia isn't going down. Still as green as it's ever been hehe.

Someone I know said my tank might be.... "double cycling" (two cycles going on at the same time but in different stages.. i think) and reccomended a water change, but I don't want to touch anything... Is that possible? I'd still need the ammonia for a food source anyways so does it really matter that there could be a 'double cycling' going on?

speaking of which I need to top off my water a bit... -flops to fill up a bucket a bit-


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

hmm never heard of a double cycle, wouldn't make any sense. I mean bacteria builds up once and then just reproduces, i don't know how a double cycle would work.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

Yeah I wasn't quite understanding how that could happen either... cus the bacteria is clearly there, so i don't know how it could 'double cycle' oh well... was just something i was confused about haha, thought I'd share it.

ANYWHO, tested my tank today and... taking a better look at the pH I am feeling confused... i'll just show pictures so you guys could see. The 'lighter' part of the tubs is what you need to look at since that was the part up against the white paper. P:I took both the ph and the high ph tests o-o


















Clearly its 7.6 on the low pH test. It's the 'high ph' test that I'm... getting a bit unsure on. It could be 7.8 like I've been led to believe up until now but... it seems so light it could almost be 7.4. But that would make no sense since the low ph test CLEARLY read 7.6. It's not 8ph.. not that icky yellow color looking, its more orange... sooo....... thoughts?


Also pics of the other tests.


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

ok....40 years in this hobby and i have never even heard of a "double cycle"...
you could have a tank in the cycling process and put in some more fish or some extra food and cause an ammonia spike which would also cause a spike in nitrites and then nitrates.......but that would not be a double cycle..


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

yeah, it sounded really weird to me, didn'tquite know how to take it. P:


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

I'd say the ph is around 7.6, otherwise you got some nice amonia going there, don't let it go too high, or it will kill the cycle.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

oh yeah I haven't redosed ammonia at all. I first added it in 1/4/14. So it's been there for pretty much two weeks. I'm waiting untill it gets closer to 1ppm or a little lower before redosing back to 4ppm.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

Well it finally happened. I tested this morning and Nitrites were still there, though for the past 2 days it has been slower to change to purple. What I mean is, when I hit the spike the first time, the tube changed purple IMMEDIATELY after adding the drops, before even inverting. The past two days it had been taking a few seconds to change, and really just stayed a dark blue until I inverted the tube.

Tested this morning, still had nitrites. Tested just now at.... 11pm... and I now have 0 Amm, 0 Nitrites, and a whooooole lot of Nitrates as it should be. My friend is taking me to the store Friday to get the fish since it's too cold now to bike home (I only live a few city blocks away from Petsmart) Montana just hit a bad cold spell so I figured I'd play it safe.

These were the readings. I took the Nitrite test twice cus the first time I was like "Wha-what? Did I miscount the drops?" so I took in a second time, counting carefully and turned out the same. Clearly there are no more Nitrites. 










So Friday after I get home I'll do a 90% WC, clean my filter (its full of tannis and random pieces of plant fluff) and go get my fish <3

Ganna dose my take up with ammonia as a test tonight and then test tomorrow when I get home and hopefully it'll zero-out. Soooo took me... 4-5 weeks total to cycle? Yup.


----------



## Ice (Sep 25, 2006)

Keep doing water changes. Something else is going on in the tank that's causing your spikes. With ammonia, I'd stop feeding everyday. Feed every 3 days and see what happens. Changing the filter cartridge might help too.

I wouldn't worry too much about the High pH test for it always comes out the same. The main concern is the standard pH. Could it be possible the substrate has additives of sorts that's causing the spikes?


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

??? eheh you got the right thread there hun?


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

acclimating fish now. added in more plants. Very pleased. my 2nd piece of driftwood is coming in monday and will go on the left.


----------



## sdfssddff (Nov 27, 2007)

I came across your thread mostly because i also have a 20gal long that is cycling right now... So how is your tank coming? I'd love to see pics of the new additions and find out what type of fish you chose!  

also i dont remember if you stated all the different types of plants you went with or not, but could you? it would be interesting to see what ones you went with for a no-co2 setup as that is also what I am going for. 

Tanks in advance


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

Heh, my tank now:











Most of the plants I ordered from the person were all clippings except the dwarf sagg. Almost all of them didn't make it. I have 3 stem plants that survived that I haven't identified yet that have now sprouted roots. The Pennywordi got as well is doing fine and the dwarf sag has a few new sprouts while the other leaves have wilted back.

I went and got new plants so my current plant stocks are:
Anubis Cong. (had since cycling started, growing nicely)
Anubias Nana
Amazon Sword (had since cycling, is exploding in new leaves, one of which is 3inches+ after just 4 weeks)
Green Crpyt
Dwarf Hairgrass
Dwarf Sagg.
Cardinal Plants
Wisteria
Narrow Leaf Java Fern
And those 3 mystery plants.

I do have some floaters as well.

I'll let cha know how things go with the new additions. so far they seem fine. I use API liquid fert once a week and have API root tabs and Jobes fertalize sticks in the substrate.

I dont plan to ever use CO2. it's just too much of a hassle for me. What plants don't make it with no co2 I'll know for future reference to avoid but I'm hoping these will be alriht. I have a t8 65000 bulb goin from home depo that sees to work fine. My anubias nana that I JUSt got last friday is already sprouting a little leaf.


My stock will be:
10 harlequin rasbora
5 false julii corys (might bump to 6 idk yet)
Albino BN Pleco
Female Betta.

I currently have 4 of the 10 harlys. had 5 but lost one to stress. I'll be getting the rest, hopefully, this weekend.


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

you can get away with more fish, and it looks beautiful


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

Oh? Would adding more to the harly's be best then? Up their numbers from 10 to... something else? Or could i get away with another school? If so what would you reccommend?


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

you could also get a "school" of female bettas. 5 or 6 of them do good together.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

meeh the betta i have now is mainly my 'center-piece fish' don't really want more. I'm content with one.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

Added some neon tetras and really liking the activity now. bought 3 more harlys (someone came in friday and snagged most of them litterally just an hour or so before me) so I still gotta get 3 more but i got 8 neons, though i meant to get only 7 but the guy gave me an extra (found out after i got home) sooo yay for free fish. spent 10$ on 11 fish, saved 11$. haha yeah petsmart is having a huge fish sale soooooo


but yeah. everyone's lookin good. my tank parameters are still in check. tested before the WC and ammonia and nitrites were 0, nitrates I think werea bout 10, so it looks like once a week WCs is what ill be doing  (only say that cus i know theres some peeps who do 2) We'll see how this week goes.


----------



## BettaGuy (May 6, 2012)

good call on another school of fish, will be nice to see the amount of activity. Just make sure that you keep up the water changes so that the extra fish don't poison the water with their poop.


----------



## M8D (Mar 26, 2013)

Yup. I'll be keeping an eye on my water this week to see how the new additions change things, if they even do and take action accordingly.

So far I'm impressed even in just the first day. They seem to all stick towards the right side of the tank as I don't see a lot go all the way to the left but the harly's and neons seem to hang together occasionally which I found interesting. Love the brighter colors of the neons. I wasn't to keen on getting them at first cus they just seemed to be in EVERYTHING but now that i see how much color they bring I see why they're always in tanks hahaa! I was ganna go with black skirt tetras but... they do get kind of big and i felt 6 of them would get a bit to large for the 20g with the harly's in there. Plus I wasn't sure how my betta would react to the fins (even though they aren't long just more noticeable)


----------

