# Sticky  what are killifish



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

the only fish i know called killis are bait fish me and my friend catch in traps in Jersey. These fish are brackish/salt water and are caught mixed with baby bluefish. Are these the same or different from killifish?


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

It's very likely that the baitfish you mention are killies, since ther are numerous brackishwater species of Killies in the USA.

Killies are a very large group of fresh and brackish water fish which occur on at least four continents. The USA has quite a number of them, but most of ours are fairly drably colored. The real showstoppers come from the jungles of western Africa, and when you see one, you will be astounded by the incredible colors and patterns.

Killies have a few different spawning styles, but they are best known for laying eggs which dry out and hatch several months later when the rains come. These killies get their their name from a dutch word, Kill, which simply means "puddle." These puddles dry up, but the eggs survive. When the rainy season fills the puddles with water again, the eggs hatch. These fish are known as annual killies, and they don't live very long, as you might imagine.

Petshops don't generally carry killifish, because they are not mass-produced on fishfarms. the killie hobby is dominated by dedicated killie keepers who raise fish and trade the eggs with each other through the mail. The AKA, or American Killifish Association, is the primary contact organization for killie keepers and those wishing to learn about them or get eggs. You can also usually find lots of eggs available on Aquabid.

Punch up the words
NOTHOBRANCHIUS or APHYOSEMION in your search engine and see what they get you. You'll be amazed.

Killies aren't really all that expensive when you buy them from other killie keepers, but they tend tocost a bundle when you can find them in a petshop. There is one Killie, the "Golden Wonder," which is found in petshops fairly commonly, and it's pretty cheap.
The Dr's Foster and Smith catalog is about to start carrying killies as well, but the prices they want are ridiculously high, so they'll never sell. You can get the same species for 1/4 the price from some killie breeder.

Killies are tough as nails, and while they have certain requirements, those requirements are pretty easy to meet. Once met, the fish are very enjoyable, and a true HOBBY fish.


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

do brackish water killies need brackish water or can they survive in fresh. I have a tank with some room and i can get live New Jersey bay killies from my friend. If i have to i'll add a bit of salt. My molly and guppy will like it but i don't know about my platys and my frog.... just in case what size tank do killies need??


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

do brackish water killies need brackish water or can they survive in fresh. I have a tank with some room and i can get live New Jersey bay killies from my friend. If i have to i'll add a bit of salt. My molly and guppy will like it but i don't know about my platys and my frog.... just in case what size tank do killies need??


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

They can live in fresh water, but they'd prefer a little bit of salt.
However, your frog wouldn't like THAT one bit.

You might not want to put these guys in with your other fish, because they are pretty mean and nasty. I don't know what species you are talking about, but most of the fundulidids in that group get pretty big. 
Most killies are very small, and are often kept in very small tanks, but the USA's killies are generally much bigger and need more room.

Killies are pretty cool, though, and well deserving of their own tank. In fact, the USA has oodles of very "tankworthy" fish species.


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

nice how many gallons per killie? the ones i'm talking about are commonly called minnows


----------



## MyraVan (Jan 19, 2005)

I don't have killifish, but I would like to get some eventually, so I have been reading about them. I didn't think that there were any killie keepers on these forums, but Old Salt sure sounds like he knows what he's talking about. 

Could you describe the tank setups you have for your killies? And how can newbies get into them? Raising fish from eggs received in the mail sounds pretty difficult for a beginner.


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

I don't have a set up i'm asking how many gallons per killie so i can start my set up if i want to. I'm talking about wild killies in Jersey not raising from eggs so its a bit easier you just have to buy a killie trap


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Since I don't know the exact species your Jersey Killies are, I can't really answer the question.

I will tell you that brackish water fish need for room than freshwater fish, because the osmotic pressure is different and salty water holds less oxygen than fresh water. Therefore, if you use salt, which would be better for them, you would have to keep fewer of them.

I suppose a good guess would be to compare them to swordtails. A swordtail needs about 8 square inches of surface area, and a killie probably twice that for each "swordtail-sized chunk" in the killie.
So, let's say you have a four-inch long killie, which is about equal to two swordtails. That fish will need a surface area of 32 square inches. Calculate the number of square inches the top of the tank has, which is length times width in inches, and divide that by 32, and that's about how many 4-inch jersey killies you should be able to keep without much trouble. If the killies are fat, make sure to count the extra girth as more swordtails.

A ten-gallon tank is 20X10, so it has 200 square inches of surface area. That's enough for a dozen swordtails, or six killies of the same size in brackish water, or maybe eight killies in fresh water ( although they'd probably be happier in the brackish water )


----------



## MyraVan (Jan 19, 2005)

Old Salt: do you keep any of the smaller killies, like Fundulopanchax gardneri? That's the sort I'd be thinking of getting. If so, what is your tank setup like?


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

I never was much into the Panchax and Fundulidids, so I haven't kept them much. Fundulopanchax as a genus has been largely replaced with Aphyosemion, so if you mean Aphyosemion gardneri, then I'm with you all the way; I like those guys!

I know it's pretty generic, but I usually kept killies in very soft, peaty water with a pH around 5.5-6.0, although sometimes I'd try to match the conditions as exactly to the fishes' specific preferences as I could. I used distilled water to get the low hardness required, and once mixed with the peat/soil/gravel it absorbed enough minerals to be safe for the fish.

I usually used 5 gallon or even ten gallon tanks instead of the little 2.5 gallon ones favored by most serious killie keepers.

I'd make sure the background and gravel were very dark to make the fish feel comfy and to make their colors stand out more. Decor would usually consist of a few short, squatty plants and a few big clumps of java moss. If I had a nice small piece of driftwood I would sometimes include it, but just as often I wouldn't. 

Filtration would be simple, usually undergravel filters or sponge fiters, but never outside box filters. You don't want a lot of water current in a killie tank, since they live in puddles. Many serious killie breeders don't use any filtration at all, but instead do lots of water changes.

This sort of setup should be okay for gardneris.

Hatching eggs you get through the mail isn't as hard as it sounds. The hatching methods for each species are different, but an instruction sheet usually comes with the eggs. Think of them as really big brine shrimp. 

Because these fish are so short-lived, buying adults can be disappointing. Yes, it's easier, but they don't last as long as they would if you hatched them yourself.
The truth is, killies aren't really good beginner fish at all. It takes an experienced hobbyist to raise the fry and breed the adults. However, if you can raise, say, danios, then you can raise killies.
They're not difficult at all once you know how.

Here in the states the easiest places to find them are Aquabid and the AKA ( American Killifish Association ) website.
There is a similar organization in Britain; I think it's the BKA? it should be easy to find with a little web searching. Once you find either of these resources, you'll be able to learn anything you'd ever want to know about keeping and getting these wonderful fish.


----------



## MyraVan (Jan 19, 2005)

I think I do mean Aphyosemion gardneri. I've seen the same fish listed Fundulopanchax gardneri and Aphyosemion gardneri, and I didn't know which was the right name for them.

Thanks very much for your info. Right now I haven't raised any kinds of fish from eggs, so I'd probably better wait until I have some experience with that before I try the killies. Unless I can actually find some place that will sell me adults...


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

these are the killies i'm talking about
http://www.ag.auburn.edu/fisheries/aumerc/Research/smallbullmins.JPG
They are called minnows but i'm sure they're a member of the killies family they are normaly found at bait shops for bluefish fishing


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Oh, THOSE guys.
Well, I have some bad news for you. This species gets HUGE. I've seen them nearly a foot long!
Bull minnow, indeed.
They'll be okay for a little while, but they'll out grow your tank in a year or so.


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

yeah i can always let them go when ever when they get big. I If i'm right they can grow over a foot i some cases. i fish for them maybr if they get to big i can let them go at my fishing spot nothing wrong with some healthy fish to catch.


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

yeah i can always let them go when ever when they get big. I If i'm right they can grow over a foot i some cases. i fish for them maybr if they get to big i can let them go at my fishing spot nothing wrong with some healthy fish to catch.


----------



## Larry-T (Jan 18, 2005)

Do NOT let them go if they get too big. The chance of them carrying diseases or parasites from aquariums into the wild is too great. In most states, it is illegal to release fish into the wild even if they were captured there in the first place.

If you're really interested in the possibilities of killifish, the American Killifish Association (www.aka.org) is holding its annual convention in suburban Washington, DC. Check out the web site for details.


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Larry is right about that. Tropical fish diseases picked up in an aquarium can wreak tremendous havoc if infected fish are released into areas where those diseases don't naturally occur. You would have to keep your killies in a separate room from all your other tanks and make absolutely certain that they were never in contact with anything which had been in contact with your other fishtanks if you plan to release them later, and even then it's likely illegal to release them anyway. That's one of the greatest responsibilities you have as a fishkeeper, protecting the natural environment from your hobby.


----------



## Guest (Mar 6, 2005)

goldfish, those are not killiefish. what you have are mummichogs, or mummies. a lot of people call them minnows. they can be a bit aggressive and they are definetly food hogs. however, they are incredibly hardy. they are a saltwater species. definetly do not put them in freshwater! they will die. you might have found them brackish water too because the tides pull them up there. however, it's a fairly heavy brackish water.


----------



## Guest (Mar 6, 2005)

here's a picture:
http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96062883/K=m...://www.pearlfishpress.com/images/Fundulus.JPG


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

that picture isn't the fish i'm talking about.


----------



## Guest (Mar 7, 2005)

mummichogs can vary in looks. that picture u showed is a mummichog


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Mummichogs ARE Killifish. Killies come in a wide variety of shapes and sizes.


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

glad to have livened up this section of the forum but i think i'll stick with goldfish livebearers and tetras


----------



## Guest (Mar 7, 2005)

mummichogs are killifish? wow... guess ya learn something new everyday. thanks oldsalt!


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

What killis (small) are avalable in chain stores such as petco or petsmart and what size tank is required


----------



## Larry-T (Jan 18, 2005)

You won't find any killies except the occasional "golden wonder" (Apl. lineatus) which gets fairly large. If you want killies, you should join the American Killifish Association and purchase killies from breeders and local affiliate clubs. There's also a national convention, which will be just north of Washington, DC. Go to www.aka.org for more details.


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

do you ever find killies in a LFS???


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

do you ever find killies in a LFS???


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Almost never.
LFS's buy fish from wholesalers/fishfarms, and killies are too hard to mass-produce on farms.

Like Larry T said, you'll occasionally find the "Golden Wonder" killie in stores, and sometimes the Lake Tanganyika Killie, but that's about it unless yo find a REALLY good fish store run by a guy who knows his stuff. I had them in my store for awhile, but almost never actually SOLD any.

The best place to find them is through the AKA or on Aquabid.


----------



## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

i like killis but hate ordering anything online


----------



## Larry-T (Jan 18, 2005)

As far as getting killifish is concerned, some LFS do carry killies, but they are stores which get them from local breeders.

If you join the AKA, you will get two resources that will assist you in getting the killies you want:

1. The business newsletter is a monthly publication with lists of killies and killifish eggs offered by other members. During the prime shipping season, (I think it's March through October), live delivery is guaranteed through the AKA's code of ethics. There are also announcements of meetings and shows in various parts of the country.

2. Affiliate clubs. There are a number of AKA affiliates in the U.S. which cover most of the major metropolitan areas around. By finding your closes club, you will be able to get killies directly from breeders who can and will coach you on their proper care.


----------



## loach<3r (Nov 8, 2006)

I was in PetSmart today (So. Calif) and they had Golden Wonder Killis. I asked the Manager about it and he said they would be regularly stocking this fish in the future ( yay for me! ). I plan on snagging a few once my q tank is finished cycling. I love the personality of this fish.


----------



## firebelly (Sep 21, 2011)

*Golden killifish*

I have two golden killifish male and female. Just a few days ago I notice a baby killifish! S/he is in a nursury now. What would be the best thing to the little guy? Also I want to feed foods to my Male and Female golden killifish the raise the chance of them having fry again. I bought them some millworms. How often should I feed them these? Is there any other foods I can feed the adults?


----------



## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Just feed them a nice variety of whatever they'll eat, with variety being the operative word.
The baby fish will need very tiny food for about ten days. One good one is concentrated greenwater. Go to a pond and grab some plants. Put them in a jar and swish tehm around. Repeat until the water is greenish. Let the jar settle for a couple of hours, and then pour off the clear water, leaving only the concentrated green stuff. Feed the baby fish several drops of this several times a day for about 10 days, after which it should be able to eat bigger things, like flake food ground into flour.


----------

