# Overstocked? Really? Related questions.



## IronDoll (Nov 8, 2010)

I entered my aquarium data into a calculator and was surprised. With my current community of 11 fish in a 26gal tank, I am 116% capacity. I'm disappointed because I wanted more fish. 

Here's what I have.
1 Dwarf Gourami, 1 Red-tailed black shark, 4 lemon tetras, 2 long-finned rosy barbs, and 2 platys.

The notes warned of schools not being complete. This shocked me because these were suggested by the pet stores that I purchased my fish at. It turnes out that I need 1 more lemon tetra (it would take an hour to drive to that store) and 3 more long-finned rosy barb. Forgive my ignorance on this, how important is it to finish the schools? Is this information even accurate? I question the information becuase it differs from what I was originally told so I need a tie-breaker. 

I realize that the warning of the tank being overstocked *may* have to do with the maximum size of the shark and the rosys as I know they grow to 5-12 inches. Right now it's a 5mo old tank and the fish are pretty small, maybe an inch so I don't see it as a problem right now. Any advice or suggestions regarding this information? I thought if you kept the tank slightly over-crowded, it prevented the fish from growing to huge sizes. That being said, I wouldn't want them to be unhappy either so what ever is the best solution is all that matters.

I have just cycled a 40 gal tank, it has no plants or decor or fish as I am in the planning stages for this one. Actually, I was going come to the board for assistance after finding out that I screwed up on my 26gal. I could move a few fish from the 26gal to the 40gal if anyone recommends this. How would I go about this? I'm thinking safely that is, I wouldn't want to kill anyone. I think a bowl with tank water from both existing tanks to start then scoop up and add the fish then leave in it in the bowl for 15 min then add to tank. Does this sound at all correct?

Thanks for reading and any suggestions/advice. TIA!


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## iheartfish:) (Jan 19, 2011)

It's not overstocked. At least, not to me. The 1 inch per gallon rule is very roomy, and you seem to have less than 26 inches either way. You can probably safely finish the schools with out really overstocking the tank, but I don't know if the shark might get territorial or something. According to me, you can get more fish, but what do I know?  I pretty much a newbie at all this. Kind of.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

I do think the 'overstocking' is based on final size. Your bioload is in line for now, but there isn't a lot of margin for error. In other words, an understocked tank can handle neglect, overfeeding, cycling, or filter failure better than an overstocked tank.

Overcrowding really won't help fish stay small, it just makes them cranky like living in the dorm with too many roommates. Aggression gets worse and there isn't enough space to run and hide. A tank that size should have only one territorial fish such as the gourami or shark. Platies tend to overstock tanks by having babies. 

What shape is the 26? A long, shallow tank can handle more fish than a tall, narrow one.

I do think you need more barbs. They have a rep for nipping other fish when they don't have enough of their own kind to push around.

I would move the shark, barbs and platys to the bigger tank, add a few more barbs and tetra and call it done. 

The temptation is to keep adding more and more fish, but the only way to do that right is to keep adding tanks. The fish you have will keep getting bigger and making more fish (if you treat them right). Any unquarrantined new fish bring another chance to overload your filter and introduce new disease.


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## cossie (Dec 19, 2010)

when i did it i didnt really understand it and just clicked a random filter but i got 300%

however ig your fish are healthy and not dying then overstocking is not aq problem.


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## Corwin (May 23, 2010)

The 1inch per gallon rule doesnt really work, when taken in the light of the fact that it doesnt deal at all with the bioload that different types of fish put on the tank, for example a crayfish, a snail, and a goldfish would all put out different amounts of waste etc, though if they were the same size the inch/gallon rule would give them the same requirements for space, filtration etc.

Overstocking can be tempting but as mentioned earlier it can make your tank unstable, I would recomend keeping it understocked but it really is up to you.


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## IronDoll (Nov 8, 2010)

Thanks EMC7. I understand what you are saying about the bioload and keeping it clean. 

I hate the idea of moving my shark, he does such a great job of cleaning. I need a good algea eater if move him. I've pondered mystery snail but thought I'd end up with too many baby snails and it would get out of control besides, they're aren't much to look at. I don't like plecos. Maybe some ghost shrimp, again not much to look at. So far, it seems that I have a nice shark, he really minds his own business, same with the gourami. The only fish that the shark goes after are the barbs and Ive never seen the gourami nip at anyone. The gourami seems to swim at the top and middle whereas the shark swims at the bottom so I didn't see this as a problem. I know I sound like a child...Do I really have to move one or the other?  For the record, I don't mind moving the platies though.

In answer to your question about the tank, it's a bowfront, 24x15x21. 

OK, no problem getting more of the rosy barbs but as I mentioned, it is a big problem locating the lemon tetra. I am seriously dreading driving an hour for a fish. Can't I complete the tetra school with a different type? Maybe someone knows of a tetra that will swim with my lemons???

Thanks!



emc7 said:


> I do think the 'overstocking' is based on final size. Your bioload is in line for now, but there isn't a lot of margin for error. In other words, an understocked tank can handle neglect, overfeeding, cycling, or filter failure better than an overstocked tank.
> 
> Overcrowding really won't help fish stay small, it just makes them cranky like living in the dorm with too many roommates. Aggression gets worse and there isn't enough space to run and hide. A tank that size should have only one territorial fish such as the gourami or shark. Platies tend to overstock tanks by having babies.
> 
> ...


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## Corwin (May 23, 2010)

The ONLY shrimp that can be used as an algae eater and not starve is an amano shrimp and they will take leftover food over algae if given the chance making them only a passable algae cleaner.

You could always go for Nerite snails if you are interested in getting snails, their pretty and they wont reproduce in FW


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

One apple snail can be kept without fear of baby snails (they need 2 to tango and the eggs are easy to remove). If you watch your fish every day you will know when its time to separate fish. You can wait until you see a problem developing. The key is having extra tanks to move fish to and a hospital tank in case you are slow to notice. 

Stocking rules are stricter when you only have one tank and must avoid all potential incompatibilities. Fish do have individual temperaments and some 'safe' groups will go badly and some 'bad' groups will be fine.

Tetras will school with similar sized tetras with the same desire to school. It does vary. Some varieties will always be together, others will form up only when threatened.


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## Corwin (May 23, 2010)

True but in my experience you cant trust apple snails, I had mine for almost six months before it layed eggs. Theres no way to guarentee the one you buy wont be holding fertilized eggs which it will one day lay.


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## Cam (Nov 9, 2009)

Looking good, the shark will grow a little big for that tank, it would be a good plan to re-home him.


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## Revolution1221 (Apr 20, 2010)

yeah the shark alone has that tank over stocked based just on how big it will get and amount of room it needs to live a life. the 1 inch per gallon rule is IMO the worste lie in the fish hobby. when figuring out what fish you can have in your tank and how many it comes down to 4. main factors IMO. 1. compatability, in your case the shark is incompatable with your other fish. 2. waste out put. this is not determined by how many inches the fish is but rather body mass. compare say a 5 inch dojo loach and a 5 inch oscar. that oscar has far bigger body mass and is going to consume far more food thus it will dirty a tank much much much faster. 3. Adult size, when purchasing a fish for a tank never look at how big it is then stock your tank as if the fish were already an adult. i like to always tell people if you cant house the fish as an adult now than dont buy it. people may have good intentions to eventually move it to a bigger tank. but things come up they end up moving not having space or money for a larger tank but they grow attached to the fish and wont give it up so the fish suffers. 4. swimming pattern (for lack of a better term) how does the fish swim in a tank is it a slow moving fish that just kinda floats around the tank or is it a fast moving schooling fish or a fish that darts back and forth. look at giant danios while they may fit in say a 29 gallon when they are smaller they certainly wont be happy because they dart stop turn around dart stop turn around etc. they just dont have adequate swimming room. the stocking calculator you were using takes these things into concideration. while like emc7 said you may not be overstocked now but when the fish grow up you will be. just some things to concider. just reading some more of the posts in this thread. the sharks tend to get more and more territorial with age so that may be part of why you are not seeing much aggresion now. your gourami shouldn't be bad most types of dwarfs are very peaceful to their own kind except ive seen some pretty mean powder blue dwarf gouramis. you dont like plecos you say well look at a bristlenose you cant tell me thats not a beautiful fish. especially when they start reaching adult size they look like wicked beasts and are one of my personal favorite fish. pluss you will never find a better algae eater for the money i hear they even eat diatoms. you should check out planet catfish.com go to cat-elog and then go to L numbers and tell me you dont find 100+ plecos on their that you like. i mean just look at this one! http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/image.php?species=panaque+sp(l397)&image_id=11545


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## grogan (Jan 23, 2011)

Good post! The whole "Ill buy the fish now and get a bigger tank later when they are full grown" mindset is a bad bad way to buy. Of course we have all been guilty of it but listening to the advise of others who have done it and advise against it...sooo hard and the people at the stores are all to willing to sell you the fish.


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## blindkiller85 (Jan 8, 2011)

Revolution1221 said:


> look at giant danios while they may fit in say a 29 gallon when they are smaller they certainly wont be happy because they dart stop turn around dart stop turn around etc. they just dont have adequate swimming room.
> 
> you should check out planet catfish.com go to cat-elog and then go to L numbers and tell me you dont find 100+ plecos on their that you like. i mean just look at this one!


L-024 is wicked looking. Green body, orange/red tail? 

It's funny you mention giant danio's in the method of a 29 gallon. I had 4 and they did the same thing darting back and fourth in my 125 lol. What is adequate swimming room for these little buggers at that rate?


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## blindkiller85 (Jan 8, 2011)

Revolution1221 said:


> look at giant danios while they may fit in say a 29 gallon when they are smaller they certainly wont be happy because they dart stop turn around dart stop turn around etc. they just dont have adequate swimming room.
> 
> you should check out planet catfish.com go to cat-elog and then go to L numbers and tell me you dont find 100+ plecos on their that you like. i mean just look at this one!


L-027 is wicked looking. Green body, orange/red tail? 

It's funny you mention giant danio's in the method of a 29 gallon. I had 4 and they did the same thing darting back and fourth in my 125 lol. What is adequate swimming room for these little buggers at that rate? 

All considering I have a friend that lives here but her family is in Peru. Could probably work on something with them sending me L-024. Only problem then is trying to get them to breed because I'd make all kinds of radical amounts of $ lol


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## Revolution1221 (Apr 20, 2010)

125 isn't a bad tank size for giant danios. no matter what tank size you have unless its mazzive they are still going to go back and forth. its just a matter of them having to stop and turn around every second which happens in a smaller tank lol. check this guy out another personal favorite of mine(sultan pleco L-264. http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/image.php?species=leporacanthicus+joselimai&image_id=4889
and(L-260 queen arabesque) http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/image.php?species=hypancistrus+sp(l260)&image_id=1058


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## IronDoll (Nov 8, 2010)

Thanks Revolution1221! Great post! I'll move the shark this weekend. As far as the bristlenose, you are right it's a pretty fish. Maybe pretty isn't the right word...it's cooool. Trying to locate the really cool fish is difficult. 

Maybe you can answer a question for me...What happens if you don't finish a school? I don't want to go against this rule but I'm curious. I feel horrible not knowing all about each fish that I purchased. I trusted the sales rep at the fish stores only to find out my fish were probably unhappy not being in a complete school. Also, do you have any suggestions of a tetra species that will "likely" school with my 4 lemons??? TIA. 



Revolution1221 said:


> yeah the shark alone has that tank over stocked based just on how big it will get and amount of room it needs to live a life. the 1 inch per gallon rule is IMO the worste lie in the fish hobby. when figuring out what fish you can have in your tank and how many it comes down to 4. main factors IMO. 1. compatability, in your case the shark is incompatable with your other fish. 2. waste out put. this is not determined by how many inches the fish is but rather body mass. compare say a 5 inch dojo loach and a 5 inch oscar. that oscar has far bigger body mass and is going to consume far more food thus it will dirty a tank much much much faster. 3. Adult size, when purchasing a fish for a tank never look at how big it is then stock your tank as if the fish were already an adult. i like to always tell people if you cant house the fish as an adult now than dont buy it. people may have good intentions to eventually move it to a bigger tank. but things come up they end up moving not having space or money for a larger tank but they grow attached to the fish and wont give it up so the fish suffers. 4. swimming pattern (for lack of a better term) how does the fish swim in a tank is it a slow moving fish that just kinda floats around the tank or is it a fast moving schooling fish or a fish that darts back and forth. look at giant danios while they may fit in say a 29 gallon when they are smaller they certainly wont be happy because they dart stop turn around dart stop turn around etc. they just dont have adequate swimming room. the stocking calculator you were using takes these things into concideration. while like emc7 said you may not be overstocked now but when the fish grow up you will be. just some things to concider. just reading some more of the posts in this thread. the sharks tend to get more and more territorial with age so that may be part of why you are not seeing much aggresion now. your gourami shouldn't be bad most types of dwarfs are very peaceful to their own kind except ive seen some pretty mean powder blue dwarf gouramis. you dont like plecos you say well look at a bristlenose you cant tell me thats not a beautiful fish. especially when they start reaching adult size they look like wicked beasts and are one of my personal favorite fish. pluss you will never find a better algae eater for the money i hear they even eat diatoms. you should check out planet catfish.com go to cat-elog and then go to L numbers and tell me you dont find 100+ plecos on their that you like. i mean just look at this one! http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/image.php?species=panaque+sp(l397)&image_id=11545


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## Revolution1221 (Apr 20, 2010)

not having them in a proper school isn't going to cause irreparable damage but it can lead to stress when they dont feel safe and stress can lead to disease and they just wont be happy if they dont feel safe. as for what will school with the lemons i dont really know may be a better question for someone else. bristlenose are fairly easy to get ahold of they are becomming more and more common and i hope soon stores will stop selling common plecos for the most part and try to encourage bristlenose. i believe there are a number of members here who also breed and sell them.


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