# Is this normal / expected!?!



## 207lauras (Jan 28, 2009)

So it has been forever since I posted but oh the horror that I am at this moment witnessing in my tank!!!!
I was just peering lovingly into my beautiful 40g and there is a FREAKIN pygmy cory tail hanging out of my angel fish's mouth!!!
1st off I despise the angelfish! My hubby had them growing up and thought they would be a nice addition. I researched a little and thought they would be ok. I have had them since about August last year (I think). I got them at dime sized and they are now 3+ inches in diameter. I have not grown to love them at all.
Anyhow they have exited this long with no issues and now one of my beloved corys has become a MEAL!
Is the only solution to this to give away the angels before they go on anymore murderous rampages??!! Will they just keep getting bigger or are they about done growing?
Its not like they are starving or anything...mean little buggers!!!!
:x


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## Ghost Knife (Mar 12, 2008)

207lauras said:


> So it has been forever since I posted but oh the horror that I am at this moment witnessing in my tank!!!!
> I was just peering lovingly into my beautiful 40g and there is a FREAKIN pygmy cory tail hanging out of my angel fish's mouth!!!
> 1st off I despise the angelfish! My hubby had them growing up and thought they would be a nice addition. I researched a little and thought they would be ok. I have had them since about August last year (I think). I got them at dime sized and they are now 3+ inches in diameter. I have not grown to love them at all.
> Anyhow they have exited this long with no issues and now one of my beloved corys has become a MEAL!
> ...


You really only have two options. Either get rid of the Angels or get rid of the Cories. Typically Angels won't bother Cories, but since they're smaller Pygmy Cories they may think they are a snack. You could probably keep regular sized Cories with the Angels though.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

The mouth rule applies, it if fits, its lunch. That old saw about keeping fish together when the are smaller and they will ok together when they grow up may work for stupid fish, but not cichlids. They figure out what they can eat. Time for hubby to get his own tank.


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## 207lauras (Jan 28, 2009)

hahaha! Thanks!! Since the hubby tank wont be happening anytime soon I think its time for the angels to get packing! I am more of an underdog type of person so I may get some more little guys to make the tank more lively, its silly but the pygmys are my absolute favorite so far! I also love my betta and he is about 1/2 the size of the angels so he can go back to being the king! I have to call the lfs tomorrow and see if they will trade for some tetras or something!


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Hurry, when my angels started eating all the neon tetras, they spawned for the first time within a week. I'm assuming cravings go with egg-laying.


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## 207lauras (Jan 28, 2009)

*ok what now*

The tail has been hanging out of its mouth since 4ish yesterday. I am assuming it was just barely large enough to fit in...and dont corys have barbs along their sides? The angel isnt gasping....it just has a little fish caught in its mouth! What should I do??


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## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

heheh, I would think you'd laugh and say "Ha! That's what you GET, evil angelfish!" 

The cory might even still be alive, you know. 

Anyway, if you want to do anything, then it would involve some physical grabbing of fish. The cory probably has it's fins locked fully erect to keep itself from being swallowed, but this also means that you can't just pull it straight out, either.
This won't be fun. Do you have any tweezers?


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## 207lauras (Jan 28, 2009)

ewwwww. Yes I told myself it would be the evil fish's karmic retribution if it choked and died from its evil ways!!!!!
However, if you think the cory may still be alive, well thats another story! How exactly does one go about grabbing a fish? I also dont want to rip up its mouth and have it die because I ripped it to shreds.....
I am more of a what you get is what you get type of evil, not death and destruction from my hand type of evil!
Yes I have tweezers, large plastic tongs for snail smushing and small metal ones for my jewelry hobby as well.
Step x step instructions would be good!


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## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Hmmm....

Well, I suppose the thing to do would be to just do it. I doubt that you have any ms222 around, and clove oil can kill, so this is just going to have to hurt.

Get a big wad of cotton and soak it in tank water, and lay it on a table. Lay the angelfish down on it, and cover it with another wet wad.
Watch to see if it makes any gasping motions. These might be your opportunity assess the state of the cory.

Poke the cory a few times to see if it's tail starts to flick, indicating life. If it is stiff, then it's dead. Either way, grab the tail and wiggle the cory back and forth, gently. With any luck, the angel will feel when the spines are loose and will attempt to spit it out, which of course it can't without any water. You'll just have to watch for this sign or feel for any sudden looseness, and then... well, that part will be up to you, since you're the one who will be seeing what is happening and should be able to see what to do.

If it's really, really stuck, then gently pry open the angel's gill cover so that you can see into it's mouth from behind, looking at the cory's face. You might be able to spread the angel's "cheeks" wide enough from here to get the cory loose.

If the cory is dead, it's probably a better bet to just leave it alone. It will start to rot and get mushy, making it easy for the angel to get rid of in a couple of days. As a bonus, that's one angel that might not ever try to eat a cory again.


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## 207lauras (Jan 28, 2009)

Thanks TOS, I am actually pretty sure the cory is dead at this point..
I have been watching the angel for the better part of the day and have seen no signs of movement from the cory, other than each time the angel breathes, it moves the tail a bit ( I dont believe it is independent of the breathing). The tail fin is pretty messed up and I think I may just wait it out. Let the evil one be uncomfortable for as long as it takes... the bully :x
if it doesnt die from lack of eating first, though I doubt this will happen if he is getting the rotting bits of fish (ewwwwwww)
Will keep you posted if anything changes or if I decide to torture it!


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## Ghost Knife (Mar 12, 2008)

All of this makes me want to keep Angels even less. Of course I had the same problem with a Senegal Bichir a few months ago. He tried to swallow 4 of Rosy Barbs like a snake swallowing an egg of course they all died in the process. I decided to get rid of him since he was so aggressive because I didn't want him trying to pick a fight with any other fish.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Its a stretch to call any cichlid a "community fish". People always forget Angels and discus are cichlids. They are smart, aggressive-when-breeding omnivores (though angels don't really like veggies).


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## Ghost Knife (Mar 12, 2008)

emc7 said:


> Its a stretch to call any cichlid a "community fish". People always forget Angels and discus are cichlids. They are smart, aggressive-when-breeding omnivores (though angels don't really like veggies).


I agree as Angels should be considered Semi-Aggressive fish.


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## hXcChic22 (Dec 26, 2009)

emc7 said:


> Its a stretch to call any cichlid a "community fish". People always forget Angels and discus are cichlids. They are smart, aggressive-when-breeding omnivores (though angels don't really like veggies).


Most commonly kept cichlids, yes. But Kribensis and Rams are great community fish unless they are spawning. 
Then again, they are dwarf cichlids, not normal ones. 
I didn't like angelfish when we kept them. They were way too sensitive and definitely got into fights with the other fish.


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## 207lauras (Jan 28, 2009)

Yeah I kinda of knew they were semi aggressive, I mistakenly thought if I had then from teeny tiny they would be ok with the tankmates...thought wrong. I will be trading them in at the lfs in the next few days. 
They are really pretty fish, but every time I look at that them I just think of big dumb meatheads who like to fight with eachother and that kind of annoys me! I have been wanting to add more pygmy corys and probably a little school of tetras so I think I will move in that direction.


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## Toshogu (Apr 24, 2009)

Interesting fact about corries. not only do they have barbs that point backwards so they can't be swallowed from behind. they are armored, and most will emit a neuro toxin from thier gills when stressed. If you ever buy a bag of corries and when you get home they are all dead in the bag. they stressed and released the poison.

Most fish are straight up predators. Rule of thumb is, research what they eat naturally, and expect that behavior. It's like trying to teach a shark not to each something that fits in it's mouth. Not going to happen cause it's a hardwired reflex.


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## Buggy (Oct 17, 2006)

Well, in defense of the Angel, it was only doing what is natural. It saw something that looked tasty, thought it could eat it, so it tried. No different from a human eating a shrimp or oyster. But I understand how you feel about the cory. Since nature rules it's best to just remove the temptation or remove the tempted.


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