# I'm bored with my 30 gallon



## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

So all my other tanks are fun and I'm involved with but my 30 gallon.... Nothing ever happens there and it's just not that great of a stock in my opinion.. The decor is great though, I might add a cave too and I still take care of it but it's not interesting.
Would you guys be able to suggest a nice stock for it?
Currently:
1 bristlenose pleco
2 rainbow fish (small bread)
3 gold barbs
2 gold zebra danios
6 harlequin rasboras

They alL eat very enthusiastically  one of my rainbows died today so I only have 2 now, should I get another male to make a trio again?

High ph, hard water, high filteration, rocks, gravel, silk plants

Thanks guys!


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Instead of 4 different schooling fish, I'd trade out for 1 huge school so you could see some wild type behavior. And, IMO, any tank w/o a cichlid is boring. So maybe a dwarf cichlid or two.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Lol maybe I'll have just a bunch more harlequin but I want the rainbows til they die... I can part with the gold barbs and danios no problem lol. Any specific cichlid you'd recommend? Do they need a different type of food?


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

no, cichlids eat pretty much the same things. The trick in that size tank is finding one not too big or aggressive that also likes the water. Maybe a krib


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## toddnbecka (Jun 30, 2006)

Maybe a colorful corn snake? LOL. 
Here's an old pic of my Okeetee chowing a f/t pinkie, they go down easier now:


Little carpet python would fit that size tank for a couple years too:


More interactive than fish, and water changes are smaller too. :mrgreen:


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## bullseyejoey (Aug 30, 2012)

Snakes are awesome, I agree with Todd. I have a Texas Rat Snake myself in a 15 gallon tank.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Haha, I don't think my family would appreciate another species in the house too much, what with the 3 cats, dog, 5 aquariums, and dwarf hamster. They're not animal people but I'm very persistent.


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## bullseyejoey (Aug 30, 2012)

Haha that's cool, but if you ever are looking for a new species, GO WITH THE CORN SNAKE!


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

The krib cichlid seems cool, but a lot of websites say they're aggressive and not good for community tanks? And some websites say 30 gallons and others say 50.


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## toddnbecka (Jun 30, 2006)

Krib's aren't terribly aggressive, but it depends on what other fish you have. A single female shouldn't be any problem, a male would likely be more territorial. 
The barbs, danios, and rainbows are all social/schooling fish. They should each be kept in groups of 5 or more. Rainbows 3m/2f, the rest aren't as particular about sex ratios.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

The reason I have what I have is because:
I asked the lady at petsmart for some gold barbs, like 5 of them and she ended up thinking the yellow zebra danios were also golden barbs. Google search told be they could school together so I figured they'd be fine. 
Then I just always had this one harlequin rasbora and I decided to actually get him I. A school and here we are.
The guy at the LFS said that sometimes rainbows are ok in a trio so I had 2 males 1 female and they were fine, one of my makes just died. I wanted some other flashy fish, maybe an angel but he recommended rainbows and they were supposed to be my fancy large fish, well they ended up not being so big.


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## big b (Aug 17, 2014)

shouldn't she know what fish are what?she works there and it is her job to know right?


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## toddnbecka (Jun 30, 2006)

Angel will outgrow a 30. Most rainbows are actually pretty rough on others of their own species, having a few more spreads the aggression around so that one fish doesn't get most/all the grief. Zebra danios are faster swimming fish than gold barbs, and normally stay closer to the top, while barbs are more bottom oriented fish.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Yeah she should have -_-
And really? I hear a lot of people keep Angels in a 30 tall. My angels aren't growing, grrr


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

I have a pair in a 30 tall, like a 20H, but higher. They have to like each other. a normal 30 is likely okay for 1 or 2 normal finned angels, but avoid the super tall veils. But I bet they would eat your rasboras.

Maybe one of the harder water apistos. I think agassizii is one. 

check out thekrib.com, dwarfcichlid.com and cichlid-forum. com


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Hm, the agassizi is actually really pretty and seems like a good fit. Just one? And get rid of the yellow fish?


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

I wouldn't be in a hurry to ditch the strays, but if you can trade them in our give them to good home, go ahead and make some room. The great thing about apistos is they don't need much space, just a piece of tank bottom. 

v-paw: To make angels grow faster, do larger and more frequent water changes, feed a high-quality high-protein food twice a day and add a little carbonate if your water is super soft.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

emc7 said:


> I wouldn't be in a hurry to ditch the strays, but if you can trade them in our give them to good home, go ahead and make some room. The great thing about apistos is they don't need much space, just a piece of tank bottom.
> 
> 
> 
> v-paw: To make angels grow faster, do larger and more frequent water changes, feed a high-quality high-protein food twice a day and add a little carbonate if your water is super soft.



Oh yeah I'd give them to my friend, and the problem is my water is too hard XD I usually give the, frozen food 4 times a week and flakes once or twice, freeze dried bloodworms, microforms, and brine shrimp, sometimes Shrimp. Maybe I don't feed them frequently enough but do you think their growth is stunted? Weekly water changes of 50% bunk it up?

The only thing is they can be agressive and seem to prefer soft water and sand with roots, caves and I have gravel and rocks with silk plants and one piece of driftwood.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

IME angels need soft-water for hatching the eggs. the rest of the time, hard is fine. Yea, bump up water changes to increase growth, though bigger angels are meaner angels. Also more temp. 

What I consider normal, discus nuts consider stunted, they change water twice a day to get dinner plate sized fish. 

IMO, fish grow fast and slow seasonally with available food and water qualities. Breeders push the growth by mimicking the high-growth season to get the fish to sale size sooner. True harmful stunting requires both small containers and not enough water changes


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## big b (Aug 17, 2014)

v-paw said:


> Yeah she should have -_-
> And really? I hear a lot of people keep Angels in a 30 tall. My angels aren't growing, grrr


If she did that to me i would have been like,"UH ARE YOU STUPID?,DO YOU WANT TO GET FIRED?NO, YOU DON'T? THEN GET ME THE RIGHT FISH!" My mom has learned over the years that i dont take no crap from anybody and i will get exactly what i payed for or i will start yelling at somebody......Yeah i should probably start going to anger management classes,but i wont :twisted::twisted:


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Haha, I thought about it but then in the back of my head I decided "no... I'm sure she knows what she's doing... I hope... Come on, you can't mess up THAT badly right? I mean she only dropped one fish so far..."

Twice a day?! Jeez. My temp is at 78 F in that tank maybe a bit higher. I could try twice a week with 50% is that enough? Three? That's a lot of water.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

What sort of growth are you looking for and how big are they now? After about a year they will slow down growing and start laying eggs. Young fry also need some specific nutrients, so look for a fry food with DHA. Also separate by size, the biggest ones can suppress the growth of smaller ones. Water changes flush out all the signals fish put into the water. Some live plants may also filter them out.

Sorry for the thread hijack, EW. There are knowledgeable fish people even at some chain stores, but they didn't learn it from their employers. 

I love to watch apistos pair off and spawn, but they can be pretty aggressive. Not boring. On the other hand, a lone cichlid will often pay more attention to you and even can be trained with food.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

emc7 said:


> What sort of growth are you looking for and how big are they now? After about a year they will slow down growing and start laying eggs. Young fry also need some specific nutrients, so look for a fry food with DHA. Also separate by size, the biggest ones can suppress the growth of smaller ones. Water changes flush out all the signals fish put into the water. Some live plants may also filter them out.
> 
> Sorry for the thread hijack, EW. There are knowledgeable fish people even at some chain stores, but they didn't learn it from their employers.
> 
> I love to watch apistos pair off and spawn, but they can be pretty aggressive. Not boring. On the other hand, a lone cichlid will often pay more attention to you and even can be trained with food.



It's fine  yes I think a cichlid would be a good idea then. I'll try more research on an apisto but I don't want to breed them or anything, I'm just worried my environment isn't ideal.

Well my angels, I have a pinoy, who isn't turning blue, and a... Not koi... But looks like the one that's almost like a koi. They didn't really tell me what he was more than once and I just don't remember.

The yellow one used to be smaller but now they are about the same, I don't know if I have a male female pair and wasn't really planning on breading. They're larger than a half dollar, but they're supposed to be the size of my palm I believe. They are only if you count the fins but I've seen much larger Angels at the pet stores that are getting rehomed and their bodies are Palm sized.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Would a German blue ram be good? I really love them and am thinking to get one for the 30 or maybe a pair for the 65, but I wanted something larger for the 65.


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## bullseyejoey (Aug 30, 2012)

I think a single one would do better in the 30 and save the room in the 65 for something cooler!


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Good point, the only thing is that I have gravel in the 30, and high ph and water hardness. But in the 65 I have rocks, sand, and some small pebbles, and I have mostly soft water fish so I'm adding peat moss to it soon. So it seams like the ram would be happier in the 65, right?


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## bullseyejoey (Aug 30, 2012)

What the pH like in the 65? Sorry I failed to notice the high pH in the 30... Rams prefer neutral to slightly acidic water if I'm correct...


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

bullseyejoey said:


> What the pH like in the 65? Sorry I failed to notice the high pH in the 30... Rams prefer neutral to slightly acidic water if I'm correct...



You are correct, the ph in the 65 is also at about 8.0 but when I add peat moss hopefully it will be between 7.0-7.5 unless that's hoping for too much. We have this type of tap water here.


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## bullseyejoey (Aug 30, 2012)

Getting the water down to an exact pH of 7 is really the only thing you can do, but I'm really not sure if you want to "waste" your money on your next fish that's going to die. I've had German Blue Rams before with slightly acidic water, and I still had trouble keeping them alive for long. Maybe someone else here can steer you down the right path, but as for me, I'd say no to the ram...


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

bullseyejoey said:


> Getting the water down to an exact pH of 7 is really the only thing you can do, but I'm really not sure if you want to "waste" your money on your next fish that's going to die. I've had German Blue Rams before with slightly acidic water, and I still had trouble keeping them alive for long. Maybe someone else here can steer you down the right path, but as for me, I'd say no to the ram...



I've also never been able to get a nitrate of 0 so I guess it's better I don't, but I still really like them...


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## toddnbecka (Jun 30, 2006)

German blue rams are about as demanding as neon tetras, and many of them are treated with hormones to enhance their color, which shortens their life span considerably. Bolivian rams are a bit less colorful but generally easier to keep. It's not really likely you'll ever have a tank with 0 nitrates, even heavily planted tanks usually have at least some in the water. 
If you want a colorful, hardy cichlid that does well in hard/alkaline water check out some Australoheros or Gymnogeophagus species.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Well I never kept a neon alive that long so I guess you're right. My nitrates are always very high for some reason... I do all the water changes other people do but it's not cutting it. 
Maybe I'll be able to get Rams in the future if I ever move to a place with better water  although now I have the perfect conditions for some african cichlids like peacocks and such. But I already have other stocks so *sigh*


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## toddnbecka (Jun 30, 2006)

Have you tested your tap water for nitrates?


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Yes. It's at 0, there is some ammonia though. But I started to use prime conditioner and that seemed to help a lot.


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## Ice (Sep 25, 2006)

It all depends on your water source bullseye and v-paw.

I had a German Blue Ram for almost a year. He was an awesome fish and easy to care for and my water is fine and not acidic. I had my Ram with 5 neon tetras, 4 cory cats, and a peacock grudgeon with no problems.


I usually do water changes every 2-3 weeks & feed my fish every other day or 2. I rarely test my water unless something drastic is happening to my tank. I see no reason why you can have a German Blue Ram in your tank.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

If they really are so expensive I probably should hold off
Even with water changes and I do 50% a week my nitrates are at 40 give or take. My ph rose to 8.4 in my soft water fish tank so I just ordered the peat moss and will be using that. The others are at 8 and 8.2 so I think adding a little would be a good idea so that I can grow more plants and they can have a higher quality of life.


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## Ice (Sep 25, 2006)

They're not all that expensive. I bought mine for $8. Now, there is another Ram species that is prettier than the German Blue Ram - the Electric Blue Ram. A LFS was selling them anywhere from $14 - $20 a piece.


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## Ice (Sep 25, 2006)

Check them out in Liveaquaria website:

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=830+889+1084&pcatid=1084


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

I know my LFS has electric blue belly Rams but I think that the german blue ram looks nicer  I've never seen one in person though so maybe it's different. I'll room into it another time or on another thread I guess  since the 30 gallon has gravel and not sand anyways. I used to have my dwarf gourami in there maybe that would be good to move back over and make more room in the 65? He is very timid though. Or is there some nice larger than what I have fish that would fit nice and look good but isn't too aggressive? 

I think I should rehome all the yellow fish though since they aren't a complete school and I never really loved them anyways. (Ouch)
But I won't until I know what I'm really adding to there now.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

A gourami is a good centerpiece fish. Just don't expect them to get along with cichlds.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

That's actually a great idea. I'll move him  now to start a thread about the 65 gallon...


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## wpe_15 (Dec 18, 2014)

I know this may be late and I don't think this fish has already been mentioned but I suggest getting a Laetacara Curviceps. These fish are peaceful and stay relatively small at about 3.5 inches making them perfect for your tank size. They are referred to as Dwarf Flag Cichlids (or on liveaquaria.com as "Red Breast Smiling Cichlids"). You should check them out!


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Laetacara dorsigera is another nice dwarf. So is heratilaipia multispinosa.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Hmmmm, would they get along with the dwarf gourami? I moved him yesterday but I still don't really want to keep the yellow school of fish.
So would you guys think it'd be better to get one of those dwarves?
Or get another school or fish?
Or just expand on the rasboras and add a dwarf?
Wpe - they're cute but my ph is far too high to house them comfortably 
Emc- they seem pretty cool! The second one might not like my ph though. And is it better to have a pair or a single?


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## wpe_15 (Dec 18, 2014)

Sorry I didn't notice the pH difference.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Okay guys, I don't have the barbs or danios anymore. So I'll add 2-4 more Harlequin rasboras. Any other things I could add?


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## thirdgen (Feb 26, 2013)

This is a great thread, and it will help me as well. I don't know enough to recommend anything, but I'm loving this thread. So many cool choices for a 30 gal. Very interesting.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

what i really cannot fathom is how anybody could be bored with a tank full of fish...


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

Awe thanks lordgen! That makes me happy 

Lochachata- I know... I'd say that tank has the best decorations and looks great, but nothing ever happens in it. It's also in a place I don't see it too often, it seems like all the fish are just super high energy for feeding time and just all looks the same the other times.

Just to make it clearer.
Current stock:
1 bristlenose pleco
6 harlequin rasboras (will add more)
2 rainbow fish (small kind)
1 dwarf gourami 

Should I get one more larger fish? Or another school? Or would the rasboras be really happy with a giant school? Etc?


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

more rasboras..very often when schooling fish are few in numbers they become shy and will hide or be inactive..but when in a larger number they become more active and bold.


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## v-paw (Feb 17, 2013)

I picked up 6 more rasboras today, I'll tell you guys how it goes!
I'm going to try not quarantining again....


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## thirdgen (Feb 26, 2013)

Wow, that's gonna be a nice school you have! I bet they will look amazing in those numbers.


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