# help with new aquarium please :)



## Teale (Apr 9, 2008)

After only having betta a 20 gallon might be a little harder but thought i would give it a go. i am hoping to get a package with light, pump included. and will get a tank vac for my freshwater aquarium.
I am wondering what COLOURFUL neat looking, hopefully hardy fish i can put in together ( i will just google the names for pics), and hopefully i wont have to get a heater but ok if i do. also prob. want plants.
I have 5 female betta's too if it is possible at all to add them to the mix too.


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## Phantom_Ram (Oct 23, 2008)

If you add dividers you could do all 5 betta's in there, but in an open tank they might all fight. Are you doing a 20 gallon high, or a 20 gallon long?


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## jones57742 (Sep 8, 2007)

Teale said:


> After only having betta a 20 gallon might be a little harder but thought i would give it a go. i am hoping to get a package with light, *pump* I believe that you mean a filter? included. and will get *a tank vac* have you considered a Python as it will vacuum as well as assist with refilling the tank for my freshwater aquarium.





Teale said:


> I am wondering what COLOURFUL neat looking, hopefully hardy fish i can put in together ( i will just google the names for pics),


Tl: The hardiest fish in my tank which I also find to be aesthetic are:
Red Phantom Tetra's
Sterbai Cory's
Orange Laser Cory's
Striata Loaches
Bristlenose Pleco's

Nice Angels can fill out the MidDepth fish and will also be the TopDepth fish.




Teale said:


> and hopefully i wont have to get a heater but ok if i do.


You will need a heater. I recommend a VisiTherm.




Teale said:


> also prob. want plants.


Please review *Rex Grigg's Site* and post with questions.

TR


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## Teale (Apr 9, 2008)

Phantom_Ram said:


> If you add dividers you could do all 5 betta's in there, but in an open tank they might all fight. Are you doing a 20 gallon high, or a 20 gallon long?


even with female betta? you mean fight with the new fish , all 5 get along fine right now.

jones57742 sorry i meant filter 
thanks for your help everyone

I have been looking online, but can't seem to find any compatibility listings.
i like these which do you think would go together?:

the male Albino Bristlenose Pleco
Electric Yellow Cichlids 
Pseudotropheus socolofi albino
clown loach
yo yo loach
pea puffer (said they are freshwater???)
Lyretail swords
shrimp to clean
and possibly female betta if possible. (and i am now looking at 33g. and know not all can go in, but wanna see which can life together. 
THANK YOU


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## Teale (Apr 9, 2008)

are all tetra's compatible? I really like the leopard tetra i think thats the name.
also what is this fish?
http://www.petpig.com/fish/fish/Glass-Fish.jpg


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## Buggy (Oct 17, 2006)

From that list....the Albino Bristle Nose pleco, the yo yo loach, the Lyretail sword and maybe ONE female betta would work together. The others would either get too big, have aggression problems or have different water requirements.

Not all species of tetras will get along together but I'm not sure which ones would be a problem as I've not kept that many different species myself.

That picture is a tetra and they are dyed those colors. A cruel practice that most fish hobbiest seriously detest. From what I've read/heard, the dye is injected under the skin. It will soon fade and the process can weaken the fish leaving it suceptible to desease and will shorten it's lifespan.


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## Teale (Apr 9, 2008)

thanks sounds good. I found the info after posting about the painted glass fish. god people go too far. to bad they are really cool!


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## jones57742 (Sep 8, 2007)

Teale said:


> even with female betta? you mean fight with the new fish , all 5 get along fine right now.
> 
> jones57742 sorry i meant filter
> thanks for your help everyone
> ...


The *ABN's* are community fish and are a real cleanup crew for the tank bottom as well as tank walls. You could house two of them in your 20G tank.

Unless you really enjoy grief forget the *EYC's.* Due to their aggressiveness no way will they work in a community tank (also water parameters become an issue).

*Pseudotropheus socolofi albino* are less aggressive than the EYC's but I would still not put a Lake Malawi cichlid in a community tank.

*pea puffer* - I also enjoy the appearance of many dwarf puffers but subsequent to quite a bit of research determined that they were much too aggressive for a community tank.

No way on the *clown loach *as these are social fish, an absolute minimum of three is required and they can attain a length as long as a 20G tank. Also as they begin to age the distinctive orange and black bands begin to become more wide black polygons with orange interior.

No way on the *yo yo loach *as these are social fish, an absolute minimum of three is required, they will attain a length in excess of 6" and boisterousness will cause way too much commotion in a 20G tank. Also as they get to be 2 or 3 years of age their distinctive markings begin to dim.

You have another winner here with the *Lyretail swords*!

*shrimp to clean* - this may just be me but I have never had much luck with shrimp in a community tank or a dedicated tank (I believe that this condition is due to the lack Ca... molecules in my tank water). A real, real cleaning crew is Malaysian Livebearer Snails (aka Malaysian Trumpet Snails).

and possibly *female betta* if possible - Please excuse me here Teale but "what is your 'thing' with female betta's"? If you could explain I might could help you with alternates. The real problem with betta's in a community tank is that these fish are accustomed to slow moving or stagnant waters in which the water conditions are very poor and hence have very low oxygen concentrations as well as are absent of most other species of fish ie. they are not happy campers in a well maintained community tank!

Two Questions:


[1] Did you review Rex Grigg's site? IMHO, most fish will be happier fishies in a planted tank and a review of his site will save you a ton of grief before you "haul off and buy" your aquarium.


[2] Have you considered Platy's? Many very aesthetic colorations are available and Platy's, IMHO, are much hardier fish than are Guppies (although I keep :chair: attempting to breed a strain of Guppies which I can enjoy).

TR


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Electric Yellow Cichlids
Pseudotropheus socolofi albino
clown loach

Don't do any of these in a 20 gallon tank, they will get too big.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

You need a heater unless the room with the tank never goes below 75F.


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## Teale (Apr 9, 2008)

guppies might have to work. do they get along with Lyretail swords, and or mollies?


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## Teale (Apr 9, 2008)

I am talking to someone who wants to sell there tank and fish:
"there are 2 red tail sharks, 3 black skirt tetras, and 2 mickey mouse platys. the tank is 30 X18 (almost by 22 with the lid)=33 g."
would different Platy's or tetra's be able to live in this tank if i got this, just wondering if i can add more fish?


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## jones57742 (Sep 8, 2007)

Teale said:


> I am talking to someone who wants to sell there tank and fish:
> "there are 2 red tail sharks, 3 black skirt tetras, and 2 mickey mouse platys. the tank is 30 X18 (almost by 22 with the lid)=33 g."
> would different Platy's or tetra's be able to live in this tank if i got this, just wondering if i can add more fish?


Teale:

I do not believe the tank is 30" as the 30G standard is 36"x12"x18".

In a 110G tank the Red Tail Sharks will reach an adult length of approximately 7" and are very frisky (and sometimes very aggressive) fellers.

The Black Skirt Tetras are reported to be semi-aggressive as well as fin nippers.

The moral of the story is that the 2 Platy's will probably soon die from stress and I am not aware of other fish which you could put in the tank other than Cory's or Pleco's which will not attain a large adult size.

TR

BTW: If you believe that you can "deal with" a used tank and live in a large metropolitan area have you tried craigslist.com?


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## Teale (Apr 9, 2008)

http://alysta.com/books/fishtank.htm
thanks for telling me the dimensions didn't set off any bells.
the site above has some, i think she might be talking about a 29 g.??


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## Phantom_Ram (Oct 23, 2008)

Buggy said:


> That picture is a tetra and they are dyed those colors. A cruel practice that most fish hobbiest seriously detest. From what I've read/heard, the dye is injected under the skin. It will soon fade and the process can weaken the fish leaving it suceptible to desease and will shorten it's lifespan.


You're right Rita, buying dyed fish only provokes the dying of others for sale, and it does shorten their lifespan. I remember talking the LFS out of buying them a few years ago before I left. 
Here's an article I found on dyed fish.
http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/pfk/pages/show_article.php?article_id=72


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## jones57742 (Sep 8, 2007)

Teale said:


> http://alysta.com/books/fishtank.htm
> thanks for telling me the dimensions didn't set off any bells.
> the site above has some, i think she might be talking about a 29 g.??


Teale:

Hopefully some Forum members with more experience than me will weigh in here but the link which you provided is publishing "way offbreed" standard aquarium sizes.

The only 30" really standard aquarium is a 20G long.

TR

BTW Teale: You seem to be partially in the mode of buying an aquarium and then "figuring out what to do with it". As a base line comparison I spent several months in research before purchasing my 110G and initial fish as well as plants (and still screwed up "big time" on the aquarium).


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## WildForFish (Aug 5, 2008)

Hello jones57742,

Would you please further explain the following quote?






jones57742 said:


> and possibly *female betta* if possible - Please excuse me here Teale but "what is your 'thing' with female betta's"? If you could explain I might could help you with alternates. The real problem with betta's in a community tank is that these fish are accustomed to slow moving or stagnant waters in which the water conditions are very poor and hence have very low oxygen concentrations as well as are absent of most other species of fish ie. they are not happy campers in a well maintained community tank!
> 
> Thank you for your time in advance.
> 
> WFF


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

> The only 30" really standard aquarium is a 20G long


Not true, a 29 gallon is the same footprint as a 20L, but taller. This is a standard size.


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## COM (Mar 15, 2008)

You're right emc.

Teale- if you are buying new stuff don't buy a kit. They will give you junk and for the same (or less) we can recommend the best equipment for your situation.


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

hmmmm..not sure where to start here..ok..bettas...you can keep as many female bettas together as you like.when i was breeding them i had a couple hundred in the same tank together.but they do prefer a calmer surface as they are top dwellers.there are a number of small tetras you could have..neons and cardinals.silvertips.black neons,glowlights and others.also some rasboras and small barbs like cherries.a couple of bushynose plecos would be fine.otocinclus are great little fish for algae control.
if you are thinking od fish like yellow labs or other rift lakers,you can forget about any other community fish.guppies are ok for top water.as are swordtails.but they will need a good amount of floating plant cover as they will ear the fry.cories are great for the bottom,;but research the ones that strike your fancy..some like warmer water and others like cooler water;but most like it between 76 and 80 degrees.
i have always maintained a number of books on the hobby.far easier to use than the internet..lots of good info and you get to see what they look like.


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## jones57742 (Sep 8, 2007)

WFF:

I will try:

Betta's are indigenous to Thailand (aka Siam and hence Siamese Fighting Fish) and proximate areas which possess similar topography and climate to Thailand.

Their principal habitat is rice paddies. 

Obviously the water quality of these paddies is very poor.

Betta's' possess a labyrinth organ which allows* them to induce oxygen to their bodies via the atmosphere (*actually they must "breath air" as well as assimilate oxygen via their gills).

I have only read of one or two other species of "fish*" which possess a labyrinth organ and these "fish" have been found to exist now as well as have been identified in the fossil records (I just cannot remember what age right now) and hence are "real evolutionary throwbacks"[*I believe that substantial debate is still ongoing as to what these creatures are among the nerds {I can say this because I are one}].

These species of "fish" do not live in the rice paddies of Thailand and hence Betta's are accustomed to "having their indigenous waters to themselves".

WFF:

I hope that this post suffices for the elucidation which you requested.

TR


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## WildForFish (Aug 5, 2008)

Thank you, jones57742


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