# Sand and gas pockets?



## PhishTank (Jul 13, 2010)

Is it true that gas pockets develop under all sand substrate? And they can hurt your fish?

I assume that vacuuming can help? What about loaches or catfish scurrying about?

How long does it take to develop?

Thanks for your help!


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## Superfly724 (Sep 16, 2007)

Yes, and not only is it toxic to your fish, it is also toxic to you. You generally don't want to vaccum since you'll end up siphoning all of your sand out. Just stir it up every now and then. Unless you have fish that dig really deep, or really shallow sand, fish won't do the complete job.


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## PhishTank (Jul 13, 2010)

Superfly724 said:


> You generally don't want to vaccum since you'll end up siphoning all of your sand out.


Slightly off topic... but I shouldn't vacuum sand? How do you keep it clean?


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## Superfly724 (Sep 16, 2007)

Basically, you hold the siphon above the sand and move it closer and closer until you suck up the debris. You'll probably still get a little bit of sand, but not enough to make a difference. It also takes some practice.


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## PhishTank (Jul 13, 2010)

Got it. I am looking forward to going sand. These tips help a lot! Thanks!


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## Ricker (Nov 23, 2007)

If you are going to stir up sand you better do it like every other day once a week if not you can let gas build up and kill your fish. I've had sand before i just left it alone got some bottom feeders. I never had a problem. thats my advice


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## snyderguy (Feb 9, 2010)

I've stirred mine up once since I put sand in about 3 months ago and never had a problem. But I also have 4 bottom feeders that are constantly digging in the sand.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

I think the big danger with "anaerobic pockets" come when stuff is decaying under the sand. So look for missing digging fish and snails. But animals that dig through the sand and eat stuff will help.

This is on land, but its neat/scary http://imaginativeworlds.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-15042.html


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## PhishTank (Jul 13, 2010)

emc7 said:


> I think the big danger with "anaerobic pockets" come when stuff is decaying under the sand. So look for missing digging fish and snails. But animals that dig through the sand and eat stuff will help.



Missing fish? Do you mean fish that died and disappear under the sand? Or fish that die because of the sand.

Maybe sand isn't such a good idea.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

missing fish that die under the sand. Some digging fish will bury themselves when they don't feel well. 

Lots of people have sand in their tanks and usually you will hear a story about an occasional 'rotten egg smell' during a sand stir, but every once in a while you will hear about bubbles, rotten egg smell, and dead fish. I think it is pretty uncommon (killer heaters are more likely). Still its another reason to keep your nitrates under control and to remove algae rather than bury it.

Sand has drawbacks, besides showing waste and poison gas, it can chew up your impeller wells if you let it in the filter. But if your fish come from sandy areas, you won't see all their natural behaviors without it. 

And you can get HS pockets in gravel, too. any deepish substrate with no water flowing thru it (like a UG filter).


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## PhishTank (Jul 13, 2010)

Thanks for the info. Hmm. I have to consider all of this when I decide between sand and gravel. I want to go with black substrate. 

I also need to see what kind of gravel is out there.


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## Corwin (May 23, 2010)

black sand could make it difficult to catch spots you may be missing, as the bacteria itself turns the sand a deeb blueish black.

Ive heard that plants help to counter this, is that true?


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

I think so, plants eat the decaying stuff under the stand and their roots make an upward path to allow gas to escape in small quantities. However, they make it really hard to stir the sand and give you roots and stuff that can die and rot.


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## Corwin (May 23, 2010)

ive noticed -_-

though i have also noticed that the planted sections of my tanks build up gas FAR slower than the other areas.


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## PhishTank (Jul 13, 2010)

Will gas build up in fine gravel, as opposed to sand? 

I'm looking at the black flourite on this web page:
http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.com/Product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=4870


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## Revolution1221 (Apr 20, 2010)

PhishTank said:


> Will gas build up in fine gravel, as opposed to sand?
> 
> I'm looking at the black flourite on this web page:
> http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.com/Product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=4870


it can build up in gravel and the smaller the gravel the easier it is for gass to get trapped but the thing with that is when you gravel vac once a week you release those gas pockets and you just cant do that with sand. when it comes to stiring up the sand to release the pockets i feel the easiest way is to use your vac like stated above to skim the top of the sand without actually sucking it up but when you are done stop the vac from sucking then use it to stick down into the sand wiggle it a little bit and do that throughout the sand it will not make your water as cloudy as actually stiring it up with your hands but can be just as effective for releasing the pockets.


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## petlovingfreak (May 8, 2009)

The finer the substrate the easier it is for gas/decaying matter to build up in it, because since the particles are so small they pack much closer together not allowing the gas to escape.


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## Blue Cray (Oct 19, 2007)

Has anyone even ever had a dirty enough tank to create a gas pocket? I've been keeping fish with a sand substrate since the begining and I've never had a problem with it.


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## snyderguy (Feb 9, 2010)

Blue Cray said:


> Has anyone even ever had a dirty enough tank to create a gas pocket? I've been keeping fish with a sand substrate since the begining and I've never had a problem with it.


I've seen gray spots on the sides of my tank where roots had died but I always dig those up. Never actually seen gas pockets.


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## hXcChic22 (Dec 26, 2009)

Nope, our 20 long has the black moon sand and our loaches, especially the horseface, are always burrowing into it and keeping it stirred up. 
As for our other 20 long and our 10, no idea how they stay stirred up other than that I've emptied them both recently and rinsed the sand really well because we didn't do a good initial rinse in them. Oh, and our dragon goby in the 20 long likes to "interior decorate" and constantly move sand around in large amounts.


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