# Sand as Substrate?



## Xox-Zip-xoX (Aug 14, 2010)

Recently I've been thinking a lot about switching a couple, if not, all of my aquariums over to a sand substrate, starting with my 55 gallon. I much prefer the look of the sand, and also feel it will go better with any future aquascaping, but I have a few concerns.

I guess I should start by saying what I initially had in mind for the 55. A planted tank with driftwood and sand substrate, that I plan on eventually stocking with 2 of my smaller 4'' Blood Parrots, 2-3 (maybe eventually a small school) of German Blue Rams, and possibly a school of Glass Catfish or Apistos, though I haven't made a solid decision on either of those yet.

My questions are:

1. Will I need an additional layer of a separate substrate beneath the sand if I want to have live plants?

2. Will these fish do okay with sand as a substrate? 

3. Will I have to worry about plants being uprooted from the sand?


I don't have any immediate plans to switch over. Right now the 55 is stocked with 2 Blood Parrots, a large Blood Parrot X Convict?, a Rainbow Shark, a Pleco, a YoYo Loach, and what I believe is a Featherfin Catfish. (all except the parrots came with a 35 gallon I recently picked up for free of kijiji and I realize will probably need to be re-homed as they most likely wont fit with my future plans  )


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## ZebraDanio12 (Jun 17, 2011)

1. No,it is not necessary.
2. The fish will be just fine.
3. Once the plants are rooted,they should be fine. Ive got some dwarf sag and vals in my tang tank with sand and it is never uprooted.

Btw,go with the apistos. My absolute favorite fish!


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## kcrunch (Aug 17, 2012)

I can answer 2 of the 3 questions:
Once the plants have actually rooted themselves you will not have to worry about uprooting and NO you will not need an additional layer, I think the additional layer would only give you air pockets that would create gases that you really dont want and could prove to be fatal.

Actually I believe the fish would be fine with the substrate, after doing a tad bit of reading... SO that is 3 questions and 3 answers...The Blood parrot and the Rams are Cichlids and will have no problem with the sand at all it is more to their natural habitat than gravel.


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## Xox-Zip-xoX (Aug 14, 2010)

Thanks for the answers!

I went to a LFS a town over from me and one of the employees tried to tell me that It was absolutely necessary that I have this other "nutrient rich"? substrate beneath the sand "otherwise it could cause serious problems for both my fish and plants" I thought it sounded absurd but figured I'd inquire about it on here just to be sure.



> Btw,go with the apistos. My absolute favorite fish!


I've never owned them before, but looks wise they're probably on my favorite list as well lol, they're gorgeous!

I do have one other question, this time regarding stocking, I mentioned in my original post that I received a few fish with a tank I recently got for free, I know I will probably need to re-home most of them, but would any of them be suitable with my envisioned setup? (2 parrots, 3-5 rams) the fish I received for free are an Albion Rainbow Shark, a Yoyo Loach, a Pleco (not sure which kind) and a Featherfin Catfish. They've only been here a short time but I'm already getting attached xD


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

very few adult cichlids school and apitos and rams are not amongst them. Expect each pair to defend and area of the bottom of the tank and be aggressive when spawning. Have more than one cave per pair. 

Plecos are hard to kill (I had an angel pair manage it), give them a few caves and they do well with most fish (they will fight for caves). They will eat eggs, so breeding cichlids can get aggressive toward them. The thing to watch with plecos is some get quite large and add a lot to the "bioload" of a small tank.


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## Xox-Zip-xoX (Aug 14, 2010)

emc7 said:


> very few adult cichlids school and apitos and rams are not amongst them. Expect each pair to defend and area of the bottom of the tank and be aggressive when spawning. Have more than one cave per pair.
> 
> Plecos are hard to kill (I had an angel pair manage it), give them a few caves and they do well with most fish (they will fight for caves). They will eat eggs, so breeding cichlids can get aggressive toward them. The thing to watch with plecos is some get quite large and add a lot to the "bioload" of a small tank.


Thanks,
I'm aware they won't actually school, I meant it in context of amount, since I have no idea how many I actually plan on adding at this moment.


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## Xox-Zip-xoX (Aug 14, 2010)

OH, I forgot one of my biggest questions, what sand would you recommend? I was originally thinking of picking up a couple bags of play sand from my local Home Depot.


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## ZebraDanio12 (Jun 17, 2011)

I use pool filter sand. Its like 5 bucks for a bag. Cheap and looks nice. Needs a VERY good rinse prior to use or your water will be milk white. Just rinse in a bucket as much as you think you need to, and then do it again.


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## Jaysee (Apr 24, 2010)

ZebraDanio12 said:


> I use pool filter sand. Its like 5 bucks for a bag. Cheap and looks nice. Needs a VERY good rinse prior to use or your water will be milk white. Just rinse in a bucket as much as you think you need to, and then do it again.


Same here - I prefer pool filter sand to play sand. However, from spending time on forums I've gathered that there are variances between PFSs and play sands - some play sands are better than some pool filter sands - so brand plays a large role in the quality and suitability of the sand. It's rare that I see a someone have a problem with pool filter sand, but it does happen occasionally. From what I've seen, there are far more issues with play sand, due to the wider range of quality. Pool filter sand has to be of a certain quality and uniformity (important for sand in a tank) for its intended use, where as sand for use in a sand box doesn't have as strict guidelines.

I HIGHLY recommend washing the crap (literally and figuratively) out of ANY sand you use. Like was said, wash it till you think it's good, then wash it some more...


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## Xox-Zip-xoX (Aug 14, 2010)

Thanks for the info. I've checked all of my local hardware stores and it would appear that none of them carry Pool Filter Sand of any sort, which I just don't understand. I'm going to keep looking though. If I am unable to find any Pool Filter Sand, what should I look for in Play Sand to determine it's suitability as a substrate?


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

hardware stores do not normally carry pool filter sand..try your local pool stores or maybe even lowes or home depot..


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## Xox-Zip-xoX (Aug 14, 2010)

I've checked home depot, and lowes, niether carry it in my area apparently. Not sure where the pool stores in our area are but I'll keep looking.


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## Jaysee (Apr 24, 2010)

In this area, pool filter sand is carried by hardware stores and such on a seasonal basis. One would have to go to a pool/spa store to get it in the off season.


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## kcrunch (Aug 17, 2012)

I would suggest using African rift lake sand. It will cost a bit more but will give you more nutrients and help control and keep a good PH balance regulated by the mineral in its composition.

I used a mixture of light and dark but my mix is more like 80% light and 20% dark and it is a beautiful look and the minerals it contains will help you produce a healthier environment. The pool sand can also be used and mixed with it but I prefer the look of the 2 substrates and actually did away with the pool sand and went with the 2 substrate mixes. I used white sand and Ivory coast and I love the way it looks and the fish are loving it as well.
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=8976


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## Jaysee (Apr 24, 2010)

I prefer my substrate to be inert; I don't want it raising the pH.

I just did my new 125 with a mix of 85% PFS and 15% Tahitian moon sand - looks great I agree.


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## kcrunch (Aug 17, 2012)

The substrate that I recommended doesn't raise the PH it maintains it at a level that the Cichlids will flourish. This way you are not puzzled with sudden death syndrome, this will prevent you from awaking to a tank full of dead fish and wondering and puzzling yourself about it. It just maintains a level so you dont have to worry about trying to use a boat load of chemicals trying to PH-up or PH-down. The chemicals are annoying and overdosing and getting the chemistry right is a pain. The other thing is that it not only looks good but gives you the advantage of concentrating on your fish and their health instead of trying to become a chemist. Last I checked I maintain an average of 8.2-8.7 most of the time it never ever spikes or drops suddenly. This is constant since re-establishing my tank after sandy. Take a look at the overview it is really good IMO, but to each his/her own.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Many people around here use black diamond blasting sand from tractor supply. It is supposed to be sharp, though. 3M color quartz is supposed to be good, in many colors, but hard to find. Play sand works, but it is very fine, & needs a lot of washing.

The most important thing with sand is to keep it out of your filter's impeller well. A sponge pre-filter is helpful.


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## kcrunch (Aug 17, 2012)

The problem with the sharp substrate and Cichlids is that they forage through the granules and sharp will surely cause a problem.


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## Jaysee (Apr 24, 2010)

Many aquarist believe that it's best not to alter their water chemistry with chemicals, and many also believe altering the water chemistry to be more "ideal" is not necessary. For some combinations of fish and water it is necessary though, and using aragonite sands (African cichlid sand) is a good way of accomplishing that. Aside from use with Fish that need a high pH to thrive, I don't believe it's a good choice.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

A buffering substrate is definitely safer than having add buffers to the water continually . Most sands are pretty inert and fine for fish, but some raise pH, high-silica sand can feed diatoms, and too fine a sand can compact and cause "anaerobic pockets" to form which can sporadically release deadly hydrogen sulfide gas, fine sand will also tend to get in filters. A nice, heavy, smooth, round sand will stay where you put it better and not hurt digging fish. Sand is a PITA, IMO, but it looks great and fish and plants like it.


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## Jaysee (Apr 24, 2010)

I think sand is as easy as can be, but I primarily use pool filter sand and run canisters, which are impervious to sand. Throw in some MTS and it's as maintenance free as it gets. 

With the exception of calcium based sands like aragonite, all sand is silica sand. Sand IS silica. There are silicates in sand that are bad (make sure that you don't inhale the dust) which is why it is important to thoroughly wash it. The real big concern about silica is with sandbox use - the silicates can be inhaled and are harmful. That's why there are "silica free" sands. The sand is still silica sand, it's just been thoroughly washed to remove like 99% of the dust.


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## dani2spot (Sep 19, 2013)

i like to put flourite under the sand, so there is a little something "extra" for the plant roots to grab onto. maybe it's just a paranoia of mine, but i don't like the idea of just sand as a substrate in fw b/c i feel like it doesn't aerate well. i'm worried that it will eventually adversely affect the water quality due to all the things that become trapped under the sand.


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## Jaysee (Apr 24, 2010)

Countless people use just sand without any problems whatsoever.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Some serious aquarist have told me they only use sand. And it is the most "natural" substrate for many fish (mud isn't really fun in a tank), so you can see more wild-like behavior. I only have a few tanks with sand. One of them has black sand and it is very pretty except for all the crap sitting on top. People often siphon their sand just for appearance sake. But then you have sand in the bucket, though i understand you get more skilled at avoided it with practise. Gravel is a lot easier to "gravel-wash with a filter".I expect I will do more sand and I move toward more natural looking tank with live plants. But I have a lot of bare-bottomed, heaped plastic pipe tanks, too.


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## Jaysee (Apr 24, 2010)

It's not a big deal if you lose some sand while vacuuming - you can always add more if you notice it looking a little thin in some places. I add sand (Heavier sands) while the tank is full and filters running. I thoroughly wash it so that it will not cloud the water, then I put it in a brita water pitcher, submerge the pitcher and pour it out where I want the sand.


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