# One of two oranda in a 55 gal is sick. HELP



## Blackmoons (Oct 27, 2010)

I have a 55 gal tank (vertical style --- you can read all about my tank and filter HERE: http://www.fishforums.com/forum/user-journals/30327-my-56-gallon-tank-start-finish.html). 

I recently (early June?) moved and in doing so switched my tank from a tropical to a freshwater goldfish tank.

I got one oranda and a few weeks later added a second. Neither is very large... only maybe 2 inches at most excluding fins. 

I'll be the first to admit I'm not great at water changes, which is why I was feeling good about keeping my stock at only 2. My last water change was two weeks ago and was probably just shy of 50%.

I have a large canister filter (see link above for details) and have yet to clean the filter since moving but was planning to do it in the next week or so but now one of the two fish is sick.

So bottom line: Last night I noticed one oranda sitting on the bottom of the tank but aside from sitting there he didn't seem too bad off. I did nothing. Didn't feed... I know that is a sign of bad things.

Today he looks a lot worse. He was lying at one point totally upside down and I thought for sure he was dead. But then he swam a little before collapsing back to the bottom (this time right side up). Now he's laying half bent in one of the plastic plants. The scales look ever so slightly prickled out (not real bad like I see in some photos of fish diagnosis websites) and he doesn't seem real bloated but it's just so hard to tell for sure. 

I just don't know what to do. I see all kinds of conflicting info on websites ... salt bath or no salt bath, etc. 

I should mention that my tank does have some aquarium salt in the water (I thought that was recommended but with all the reading I've done today I feel like that was totally wrong. I guess that was more so for tropical fish). 

I did a quick test of water with test strips that I have and although the ammonia and nitrates are the lowest testing level on the strip, they are not zero.... again... I'm due for a water change and a filter change on top of that in the near future so I wasn't shocked.

But it does seem too low for this kind of sickness. With a 50% water change two weeks ago, I know this couldn't have been brought on by exposure that low in such a short time... right? I do think overfeeding at one time could be an issue. I don't feed every day (usually ever 2 or 3 days) but then I probably feed too much (and they typically catch the sinking pellets on the surface before they sink). I'm just questioning everything I do at this point! 

HELP. I just don't know what to do. Other fish seems fine. I see no evidence of bacterial stuff... 

What can I do now to save my fish??


Here are two pictures I took on my phone to give you an idea...


----------



## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

That doesn't look good. I don't know much about goldfish, but I do know using salt is common for goldfish. Changing salinity, especially lower, quickly is bad. Fancy goldfish are prone to digestive/swimbladder issues. I suggest http://www.goldfishconnection.com/ this website sold me some metro food which helped my sick cichids and they seem to have a lot of info on goldfish illness.


----------



## Blackmoons (Oct 27, 2010)

Thanks for your reply in any case. I am setting up a hospital tank 10 gal) now. I think the fish is suffering from dropsy and I'm going to give it my best shot treating. 

So what I've gathered so far is add Epsom salt, a kanamycin based med and bring water temp up to about 80 degrees. Does that all sound right?


----------



## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

first of all....what is the tank temp ? what do you feed them ?
there should not be a heater in a goldfish tank ; they are cold water fish and prefer temps in the 50s and low 60s where possible.
feed only foods specifically formulated for goldfish.and you should only feed sinking foods as they can suck in too much air when surface feeding..most of their diet should consist of vegetable based foods..in fact ; if the fish is still eating i would give it some sinking vegetable pellets....using salt or epsom salt is fine for treating sick goldfish but not the best thing for maintaining them..

Please.........DO NOT RAISE THE TEMPERATURE ABOVE 74 F.................
not screaming , just stressing a point...lol

there are a lot of things that will affect the health of fish. unfortunately keeper do a number of not so good things without ever knowing it..so try not to beat yourself up if you made a mistake..
i think a hospital tank is a good idea..you will use less medication and will be better able to control things..

another suggestion that would be good for the fish is to add a good sized air diffuser..maybe a 4 or 6 inch airstone along the back wall...it will greatly increase the oxygen levels which is good for the fish..


----------



## Blackmoons (Oct 27, 2010)

My goldfish tank does not have a heater. It is at room temp. I read several places that a hospital tank for dropsy should be increased slowly up to 80% until the fish looks better. 

I do feed a goldfish food. Slow sinking granuals by aqueon. Typically the fish get them before they've sunk. 

Been setting up a hospital tank all morning. 10 gal. Heater set to 68 (room temp at the moment) since the tap was cold. Air stone as well. 

How much epsom salt per 10 gal?


----------



## Blackmoons (Oct 27, 2010)

I have not moved the fish into the hospital tank yet. Waiting for temps to be equal and for proper Epsom salt dosage.


----------



## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Do you have a TDS pen or other way to measure dissolved solids or conductivity? I do not know the correct dose, but you want to start with the water the same as the fish is in and then increase from there.


----------



## Blackmoons (Oct 27, 2010)

No I don't have anything to measure with :-( my original tank typically has aquarium salt in it. The hospital tank currently has no salt content. I don't want to shock my fish but I don't want to put aquarium salt in the hospital tank if I'm going to add Epsom salt right? Is it better to go from current tank water to no salt? Or go directly into Epsom salt water? 

Or third option is put some aquarium salt in the hospital tank then water change slowly over today and tomorrow and then slowly add in epsom salt? I just wanna get the sick fish into the Epsom salt as quickly as possible if he has any chance at survival... Is shocking him briefly really that much worse than what he's already going through?


----------



## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

If you move a fish to a lower amount of salt suddenly, you can cause more swelling. Healthy fish can regulate how much salt is in their bodies vs. the water, sick fish have trouble. You should ask a goldfish person, but I would start with the same salt as in the tank and either add epsom to it or replace the salt with epsom with water changes.

here's another link http://www.ponddoc.com/Fish_Health_Articles.html


----------



## Blackmoons (Oct 27, 2010)

Anyone know the best Epsom salt dosage? I used 1/4 teaspoon for 10 gal. Also, how much water changing should I be doing for the hospital tank?


----------

