# Tetra easy balance



## Blackfinshark

i've been using this stuff every week but i still do weekly water changes. it says you can go up to 6 months without having to do any water changes but i just think your tank would be full of poop and uneaten food. has anyone actually went that long without doing water changes? or even 3 months or 1 month?

it's not that my water gets cloudy. it stays clear. it's not the water i'm worried about it's the gravel or sand with poop and food all over it. lol

if you're gonna clean the poop and food might as well do a water change in the process. kindof hard not to really. lol

what are your thoughts on this? 

i would use it regardless because it helps keep nitrates down and keeps algae growth down as well and keeps the ph in check.


----------



## lohachata

i don't waste my money on anything that tells me i don't have to take proper care of my fish..
we do 30% weekly water changes on all of our tanks..


----------



## emc7

I think this is the stuff that runs the cycle backwards nitrate - nitrite- ammonia - nitrogen. So if you use it regularly, your tank doesn't cycle (no ammonia) and if you stop using it, you'll get new tank syndrome. But if you let your tank get dirty (high nitrate) and then use it, it can kill your fish as it goes through the nitrite and ammonia spikes on the way to nitrogen. The theory is that you never let the ammonia/nitrite/nitrate build up. But I have read of enough people who've lost fish with this stuff that I'd only use it in a fish-free tank. But if you are using it regularly, be careful about stopping.


----------



## Blackfinshark

it doesn't stop or reverse the cycle. at least as far as i can tell. i put it in both of my tanks when they were brand new. they both went through the regular cycle of cloudy water (bacteria bloom) and then ammonia spike (smelly tank) and then nitrite spike and on to nitrates.

once your tank is cycled the ammonia and nitrite are kept down by the bacteria naturally. the only thing that will rise is nitrates and this product helps to keep that lower for longer so you can go longer without changing the water.

i don't plan on going longer than a week or two between water changes ever. i just think the substrate would get too dirty.


----------



## emc7

The nitraban in the easy balance reduces nitrate as in reduction, the opposite of oxidation. Keep on eye on your parameters if you change anything.


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah it said make sure you have an air pump and air stone when using the easy balance. i guess that makes sure you have enough oxygen in the water. it says on the bottle not to use it if you don't have an air stone.

i don't use it to avoid doing so many water changes. i use it for water quality. it keeps water chemistry balanced, ph balanced, adds vitamins, minerals, and electrolytes to help keep the fish healthy.


----------



## lohachata

hmmmmm..i have 75 tanks full of healthy fish and i have never used that stuff..


----------



## Blackfinshark

lol. i didn't say it's not possible without using this stuff. obviously there are many different brands out there and many different approaches to keeping an aquarium.

tetra products are just readily available at my pet store so that's the brand i've chosen to go with. they recommend using aqua safe, safe start bacteria, and easy balance so that's what i'm doing. i also add aquarium salt to my tanks as well. 1 teaspoon for every 5 gallons.

there are other products at my store like prime, jungle, and api. they all basically do the same stuff so you just choose whatever you like and go with it.


----------



## weedkiller

Personally I would rather do the water changes weekly, there are other ways to have crystal water, I use fine filters in my cannister and change approx every 2 months, carbon is supposed to be good but you will need to change every few weeks.
Not many of us like adding treatments and additives where its unnecessary.....
Like loha says.... 75 (where do you get the time) tanks and all healthy with no extras,


----------



## lohachata

hmmmmmm...i guess you may not be understanding me....lol..
the only chemical or additive we use is a dechlorinating agent.and we don't even use that when we do less than 40% water changes..we keep just a few types of medications but rarely use them...our fish are healthy and the tanks are crystal clear.some of our tanks are also overstocked..
the whole idea is to pay attention to mother nature and do your best to mimic her.
once again , something i always tell folks.......

" The more you mess with your tanks ; the more problems you create for yourself. "

what will you do if for some reason you cannot find this product ? there could be problems..

but as long as you are happy with your method of fishkeeping , stick with it...


----------



## weedkiller

lohachata said:


> " The more you mess with your tanks ; the more problems you create for yourself. "
> 
> what will you do if for some reason you cannot find this product ? there could be problems..
> 
> but as long as you are happy with your method of fishkeeping , stick with it...


Ahmen...


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah i see what you guys are saying but i always find it amusing.

there is nothing "natural" about a fish tank. no disrespect to you guys. i understand people wanting to do things as natural as possible and that's fine. 

what do you guys feed your fish? fish food? there is nothing natural about fish food. it's sold in a container or package.

an aquarium is a glass box. nothing at all natural about that. that's just the plain honest truth.

if you want natural you should stick with fish ponds or a lake in your yard and such. that's as close to natural as you can get. 

unfortunately you can't do that with tropical fish or they will die because the water will get too cold in the winter time. that is unless you live on the equator or something. lol

if you're gonna go that route just keep goldfish and koi in a pond. they can tolerate the cold water.

to each their own i guess.

as far as the product it's always available for purchase where i live. has been my whole life. tetra has been around forever almost. i don't understand not adding dechlorinator when doing water changes 40% or less. that would mean you never use it at all. you are only supposed to do 10-30% water changes so that would be all of the time that you weren't using it wouldn't it? i guess there are certain times where a bigger water change would be necessary but that's not the norm by any means.

i guess if you really wanted to go natural you could just put water in buckets and let it sit for several days and the chlorine would evaporate on it's own.

it wasn't my intention to get into a discussion of whether or not to use chemicals in your tank. i was just wondering if anyone had experience with this product and had actually went 6 months without changing their water or even 3 months or 1 month. i was curious to know how dirty their substrate got in the process. i guess noone on here has tried it. that's fine.

alot of people use dirt, live plants, etc. and that helps keep problems out of the tank since the plants feed on stuff like ammonia and nitrites. i don't have any plants in my tanks. i don't like them in my tanks. they just get in the way of cleaning and cause a mess. that's just my opinion. i like a clean, simple tank. all i have in mine is sand or gravel and rocks. that's it. i had some fake plants at one point but i removed them. i guess you can say i'm not going for the natural tank look or anything like that. so a few chemicals will help keep the water in order in my tank. it's not like they are harmful chemicals. they are helping the fish not hurting them. that's just my personal take on it. noone has to agree and that's fine.

by the way i also used fish to cycle both of my tanks. i guess yall would prefer fishless cycling? that's fine. the fish i used are still alive and healthy to this day. like i said there's different approaches to everything in life. we don't all have to do things the exact same way.


----------



## TheOldSalt

Safety net? HA! At the very best, it's just sludge digester, ( which brings its own problems ) but we don't know, since the bottle doesn't say what it actually does or how it's supposed to do it.


----------



## Blackfinshark

i already mentioned what it does. read the thread.

let my type it out for you. this is what's on the bottle:

proprietary formula provides safety net between water changes. as aquariums age their water chemistry changes. easy balance prevents harmful conditions caused by these changes. regular use helps maintain a healthy aquarium.

-regulates ph and alkalinity (kh) at regular levels
-adds the vitamins, minerals, and electrolytes needed for vibrant active fish
-reduces phosphates

ingredients: mineral salts


----------



## emc7

I'm with TOS. I want to know what's in it. I do use "mineral salts" and buffers, but the SeaChem website has the composition of almost everything they sell except Prime. So I use Seachem stuff or make my own. Do fish really get vitamins from the water? Many are oily and not miscible. IMO, it makes more sense to dose your food with vitamins.
I am not going to bash any product I haven't tried myself. Please report what works for you and what doesn't. There are a lot of "black box" products on the shelf and I am leery of spending money I don't have to and of changing water parameter without a good reason to.


----------



## Blackfinshark

prime is basically the same thing as aqua safe, safe start, and easy balance mixed together. it's just a different brand name. they both do the same thing. as far as money the 3 tetra products combined are cheaper than the prime by itself.

the aqua safe removes chlorine, chloramines, heavy metals, and adds protective slime coat.
the easy balance keeps ph and kh in check, removes phosphates, and keeps nitrates low.
the start safe adds beneficial bacteria lowering ammonia and nitrite.

prime does all the same stuff only it doesn't add bacteria i think.


----------



## emc7

Prime is the chlorine/chloramine control + a little EDTA to "detoxify heavy metals". It doesn't mess with kH or pH or add bacteria. Prime only needs 0.5 ml to dechlor a 5 gallon bucket while many water conditioners need 5 ml, so even at 5x $ per ounce, its cheaper than many. You should always do the math. Prime may be cheap here because it comes from GA.


----------



## weedkiller

Yup... prime is defo better vfm, 0.5ml for 5gal.....
Was using stress coat as a declor and I think that uses about 2.5ml for the same, prime is more expensive but not 4 times more.
Dont need bacteria added as I have plenty


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah i know you use less prime. i've heard prime makes your tank stink though so i'm not interested in that. is this true? do any of you use prime?

you are correct. prime doesn't keep the ph and kh in check like easy balance does and doesn't add bacteria like safe start does.

safe start is good to use for a brand new tank. it speeds the cycling process up to a week or so instead of a month or so done the normal way.

either way both product lines reduce ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. both work.


----------



## emc7

Not the tank. Prime stinks like sulfur, so unless you close it up tight the smell is in the room with the bottle. Pretty much all the dechlors do this, but Prime stink is more concentrated because Prime is more concentrated than most.


----------



## weedkiller

nope no smell


----------



## lohachata

i would like to know what the heck they mean by keeping the PH and KH in check..
i don't test my tanks.i keep South American , east and west African , Asain and Australian species.....i control their water requirements as needed but without chemicals...
but what is "in check ??"that could mean almost anything..


----------



## Ice

I'm with loha. Why mess with additives when there's no need for it? Water changes is the key of having clear tanks. Your filtration helps keep it clean. I personally think Tetra brand (additives and food) are purely garbage.

It's quite clear loha knows what works and he sticks to it. I follow the same regiment he does as well. Why fix something that's not broken? I believe in the KISS method - Keep It Simple Stupid.


----------



## emc7

I do use buffers to keep the pH from crashing, but I never needed them until I moved here where the tap water is basically rainwater. Most places have enough carbonate in the ground water that adding any is unnecessary and the time to pH crash is a year or three even without a water change. Fish are tough and will take a lot of neglect. Just because someone has tested a product and kept fish from dying for 6 months does not make it good practice.


----------



## Blackfinshark

ph in check is around 7 i believe. i don't know about kh. i guess it's a safe range whatever that is.

i think that is only useful if you go longer without changing the water. if you change water every week it's not really needed. i guess if you wait 2 weeks to a month the ph can get off so it keeps it stable up to 6 months according to the bottle.


----------



## emc7

But you could do the same with a 1/4 tsp of baking soda. I haven't priced this stuff, but I'm sure its more than plain dechlor.


----------



## Blackfinshark

i didn't know that. i dunno the tricks of the trade. i'm new to fishkeeping other than having a goldfish in a bowl as a kid and my parent's had a goldfish pond. my 2 tanks are my first aquariums. just learning as i go.

the easy balance is not terribly expensive. maybe $5-$7 for a 9oz bottle. it says to add it weekly. i would say one bottle will last me 3-4 months on my tanks. so maybe 3-4 bottles a year.

i may stop using it once the bottle runs out. i still have over half a bottle left. my tanks are only 3 weeks old. i think i'm gonna have to do weekly water changes anyways just so i don't have alot of poop and uneaten food build up in my substrate so really there's no point in using it. i don't plan on going several months without doing water changes. lol it would be nice to only do water changes once every two weeks but not a big deal to do it every week.

i'm using jungle start zyme live bacteria too. i did this in order to speed up the cycling process. it's basically the same thing as tetra safe start although you use 5ml per 10 gallons where as the tetra brand you use 10ml per 10 gallons.

the tetra aqua safe dechlorinator is the same way. it says use twice as much as what is says to use on the jungle brand. the jungle brand is about $1 cheaper than the tetra stuff.


i'll probably keep using the bacteria for a few months just to be sure the cycle is done and i have the bacteria established well in my filter sponge. after that i'll probably stop using it.

so i'll just use dechlorinator and aquarium salt from then on. i use jungle aquarium salt. 1 tablespoon for every 10 gallons. perhaps i will just use the jungle dechlorinator too.

i haven't been using those test kit things. i kindof think it's not needed as long as you do what's necessary to keep your tank water in proper condition. if you establish the bacteria in your tank it's gonna keep the ammonia and nitrite low and if you do water changes it's gonna keep the nitrate low.


----------



## Ice

Blackfinshark said:


> i think that is only useful if you go longer without changing the water. if you change water every week it's not really needed. i guess if you wait 2 weeks to a month the ph can get off so it keeps it stable up to 6 months according to the bottle.


I've gone 2-4 months without a water change and my pH stayed in the normal range. 

Here's a sampling of my water test results from my log:

3/24/13 

pH: 6.6-6.8
High pH:7.4 
Ammonia: 0 
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0

7/22/13 

pH: 7.0
High pH: 7.4
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0

9/25/13

pH: 7.0
High pH: 7.4
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0


----------



## TheJakeM

Before I started researching more about fish, my tanks rarely got water changes (I do 30% weekly now). I believe that my 20 gallon goldfish tank might have gone a year without water changes. None of the goldfish ever died and are still alive in a 29 gallon now. I never used that chemical though. I just fed the correct amount, and changed the filter regularly. The water was crystal clean and smelt fine. The tank was not stocked to maximum though, just 5 1-2 goldfish. I can't tell you how the ph was, cause I never checked. So I guess it all depends on circumstances.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Blackfinshark

actually i've looked into it a bit more. i'm going to keep using this product. just for the phosphate reduction alone makes it worth it to me. i've never seen a hint of green algae growing in my tanks. that alone makes it worth it to me. nothing worse than a tank with green stuff all over the gravel, filter, heater, and decorations. of course they sale other products that just keep algae away but might as well buy this and kill several birds with one stone. keeping the ph and kh stable, nitrates low, phosphates low, vitamins, minerals, electrolytes, etc.

i will still probably do weekly water changes of 10-25%. i'd rather do that than wait a month or so and have to do a 50-75% water change like the bottle says to do. that way the cleanings are quick and you get done rather than spending alot of time on them. i fill my tank up with a 2 1/2 gallon bucket so you get the point. i can do a 5 gallon water change every week and only have to add 2 bucket fulls back in. much better than waiting and having to do 6-8 buckets worth. haha

also i just think the substrate would be too dirty and nasty waiting that long to do water changes. i guess it depends on how many fish you have and what types of fish. the smaller ones don't poop much but i have some that poop alot like the catfish. the tank needs to be cleaned once a week to keep the poop off the sand. i do have a turkey baster i can get the poop up with though. lol

i think i will clean the big tank every week and do the small tank every 2 weeks. the reason is the small tank i can only gravel vacuum half the tank before 50% of the water is gone. so i can only vacuum half the gravel each water change and the water changes are more drastic because the tank is smaller. that way since i'm doing larger water changes in that tank i can wait longer to clean it each time. plus i have less fish in there so less mess overall.


----------



## lohachata

you do know that algae is a sign of a healthy tank ; don't you ?
and the fishes like it..lol
besides.....did you ever see god getting rid of algae because he thought it was ugly


----------



## TheOldSalt

As a guy who has been at this for 41 years and has seen products like this come and go, I'll say this one last thing: you're setting yourself up for trouble. Your tank will become chemically dependent on the stuff, and like all addictions, it will lead to disaster in the end.


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah i know algae is natural but i don't want it in my tank. i feed the fish algae crisps or algae discs for food.

when we had a goldfish pond that thing would be full of algae. it was nasty and horrible to look at. lol we had to remove the fish and clean it out once a year or it would be solid algae and very little water. lol these days they sale tablets you can just drop in the water and clear the algae out. they didn't have those available back then.

really if i stopped using it the only thing that would happen is algae would begin to grow more. i really don't think the ph and alkalinity will get out of balance during 1 week. i dunno does it? 

i do weekly water changes and will continue to do so even if using this product.

i think bad things happen if you use something for awhile then stop then start again and keep going back and forth. i plan to just use it regularly as well as salt, dechlorinator, and bacteria in a bottle once a month everytime i change the filter cartridge. this may not be necessary since i have a sponge bio filter in my filter but it's natural good bacteria so it can't hurt anything. i figure when you change the cartridge you are also throwing away alot of good bacteria that was on the cartridge so replacing it a bit as well as having the good bacteria on the sponge already can only be a good thing.


----------



## Ice

Blackfinshark said:


> yeah i know algae is natural but i don't want it in my tank. i feed the fish algae crisps or algae discs for food.


You're still putting algae in your tank regardless. I see no point in your theory.
I do agree with TOS. You're over analyzing on things too much. Relax and enjoy your tank rather than making your tank dependent on additives.


----------



## Blackfinshark

i putting algae as food in there. they eat it then it's gone a minute later. it's not growing on the glass, filter, heater, gravel, etc. making the tank look terrible and dirty. the tank looks crystal clear and clean. 

that's a huge difference in my opinion.

i'm not one of these guys that has plants growing all in his aquarium and such. i like a clean looking tank. all i have is sand and rocks in there and a few decorations. no plants of any kind.

really it's cheap to buy as well. i found it at the other pet store in my area for $4.99. it's a 9oz bottle. it's not like it's expensive or anything. it's actually the tetra easy balance plus. the kind i have now is just the easy balance. the plus has the nitraban in it to reduce nitrates. the regular doesn't.


----------



## emc7

use the normal. The nitraban is the stuff that I think can actually harm your fish. The rest of the ingredients, buffers and salt and dechlor and bacteria are fairly innocuous, you'd have to mess up big time to make them fatal. The nitraban is the reducing agent that can turn your nitrate back into nitrite or ammonia just long enough to kill all your fish as it "removes" it. In theory, it should work safely as long as your nitrate never creeps too far up and you never miss a dose. But I wouldn't trust my fish to it. 

As for $5 /bottle that treats what, 500 gallons? $20 for a liter of Prime that treats 10000 gallons. So you pay 1 cent / gallon for dechlor, I pay 1 cent for 5 gallons. I think Loha has something cheaper still.

When you only have one tank, you can use whatever you like. It doesn't start to look like real money until you are buying it by the gallon


----------



## Blackfinshark

ok thanks for the tip. that is what you were talking about earlier i guess. i didn't understand what you were saying before but now i get it. i will stick with the regular easy balance without nitraban. doing water changes will keep nitrates low on it's on anyways so really no need for nitraban in the first place.

yeah i just have a 5 gallon tank and a 29 gallon. that's it.

what does prime use? it also removes ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate.

the problem i think i would have with prime is you have to use so little of it that it would make it hard to measure how much to put in the tank. lol


----------



## weedkiller

Blackfinshark said:


> doing water changes will keep nitrates low on it's on anyways so really no need for nitraban in the first place.
> 
> :fish:


now that depends on the source... my tap has approx 50ppm nitrate to start with.... water changes will keep it high unless you find a way to lower it as you change it


----------



## emc7

I buy disposable plastic graduated 1 ml pipettes and reuse them. I think I paid $1.50 for 80, should last me a few years. 

Prime doesn't really get rid of ammonia or nitrite. It "complexes" it into a bigger compound which is far less deadly for fish But, at least in theory, your bacteria can still get at it and convert it to nitrate. So you still need the water changes. I'm a bit fuzzy on the details, because this is the one Proprietary seachem product, so they don't spell out the chemistry. I'm sure Amquel+ and other competitors are very similar.


----------



## Blackfinshark

weedkiller said:


> now that depends on the source... my tap has approx 50ppm nitrate to start with.... water changes will keep it high unless you find a way to lower it as you change it


whoa that would kill your fish. anything over 40ppm nitrate is too much. how do you lower it? 

i don't think the water here has that much. if it did all of my fish would already be dead. haha


----------



## Blackfinshark

emc7 said:


> I buy disposable plastic graduated 1 ml pipettes and reuse them. I think I paid $1.50 for 80, should last me a few years.
> 
> Prime doesn't really get rid of ammonia or nitrite. It "complexes" it into a bigger compound which is far less deadly for fish But, at least in theory, your bacteria can still get at it and convert it to nitrate. So you still need the water changes. I'm a bit fuzzy on the details, because this is the one Proprietary seachem product, so they don't spell out the chemistry. I'm sure Amquel+ and other competitors are very similar.


that's cool. i guess you could find some type of medicine dropper that measured in ml and use that too.


----------



## emc7

Except for a few sensitive wild-caught fish, high nitrate doesn't kill fish outright, at least not quickly. Fish "get used" to it, but at a cost to their health. They generally fail to thrive and breed and eventually catch an illness, anything from fin-rot to bloat and die slowly one by one. Ideally, you wouldn't have any nitrate, but how much is too much will continue to be a subject of debate . Fish that have been abused for generation seem to tolerate nitrate best (we'll selectively bred for tolerance) and fish from high conductivity water, like African lakes, seem to take it better than soft-water fish like discus. The reason for the strict water change schedule advice, is that nitrate just goes up and up. If you don't do frequent water changes, you will have to do bigger ones, maybe even 100%. Bigger wcs are riskier. Thus the market for nitrate-removing products like nitraban and ion exchange resins. But since nitrate isn't the only good reason to change water, regular water changes are likely to be standard practice for the foreseeable future.

There is one way high nitrate can kill suddenly. This is the "pH Crash", "tank crash", "old tank syndrome". Nitrate is acidic in water. When a tank's "buffering" capacity is "used up", the pH can drop quickly and drastically. Everyone know someone who had an aquarium that was fully stocked and never did a water change. Then suddenly, overnight, all the fish are dead and the tank smells bad, like piss and vinegar. The time in the story may be months or it could be years, but you hear it again and again. This is where you ask "do you still have the tank" and buy it cheap out of his garage or basement.


----------



## weedkiller

Nitrate is far less poisonous than the others, I mix 50/50 with r.o water and have seachem matrix in the filter...... copes really well and have an average of 0.5ppm nitrate in the tank last time I checked. 
As long as you can keep the nitrates going too high in the 1st place matrix will lower it down real low, works for me.... and with no chems


----------



## Blackfinshark

well i've been reading around some more on the internet and i've decided to stop using the easy balance. it seems weekly water changes are the key. the ph will not crash on you in that short amount of time. water changes also reduce phosphates that cause algae. 

so it seems using the easy balance really isn't doing anything helpful as long as you are doing weekly water changes.

or if i stop using it will algae begin to grow? there are other products like tetra algae control that i've seen at the store. is that something you use only once you start seeing an algae problem? do weekly water changes prevent algae from growing on the glass and stuff?

i just need to find something to keep algae away since i don't want that in my tank. as of right now there is none but i've been using the easy balance. if i stop will algae start to take over? or will it be ok since i'm doing weekly water changes?

also i've been using jungle start zyme bacteria in a bottle. this was to speed up the cycling process. it worked. it says to use it once a month. i guess everytime you change your filter cartridge which is once a month. i have tetra internal power filters that have a bio sponge and cartridge which is mechanical with carbon inside. the cartridge has to be changed once a month. there will still be good bacteria on the sponge. is that enough? or would adding the start zyme once a month be something i would need to do to help new bacteria form?

i'm just trying to get it all sorted out. trying to figure out what i need to use and what i don't need to use.

a dechlorinator/slime coat and aquarium salt are 2 things i know i need to use.

i'm trying to figure out if i can just not use the other 2 products or what i should do about that.

what do you guys do to keep algae from growing in your tanks?


----------



## lohachata

actually the only product you kinda sorta need is a dechlorinator..the product i use will remove chlorine and chloramines..neutralizes ammonia and detoxifies many of the heavy metals..i also find it to be fairly cost effective..i don't use salt of a slime coat enhancer in any of our tanks..
we only use sponge and undergravel filters..the only power filters i like are the hagen aquaclear.they are much cheaper to operate because they use a foam block that can be cleaned and used over and over again.i have some with the same block for 5 years...
manufacterers do care about your fish..they only care that they get your money..and telling you that you need to replace your cartridge every month is one way to do it...


----------



## Blackfinshark

i use the salt because it's good for the black finned sharks. they live in fresh, brackish, and salt water during their lives. keeping them only in fresh their whole life they won't live as long. so adding aquarium salt is recommended. the salt doesn't hurt the other fish in the tank either and can help keep ich away and other diseases.

the tetra filter i have has a sponge in it as well. you can use it over and over and never have to replace it. you just rinse it out in aquarium water once a month to keep any buildup off of it. it's the same as the aqua clear just not nearly as big. probably 1/3 as thick as the aqua clear sponge.

you have to replace the cartridge on the tetra once a month because the carbon stops working and the cartridge will clog up and water will start going over the top of it bypassing the cartridge. that is how you know when it's time to change it. you could rinse it out and replace the carbon if you wanted to. it's still gonna need to be replaced eventually because it will get too dirty. it's like a cloth/fiber bag with carbon inside of it and a plastic clamp over the top to hold it into a cartridge. i have the tetra 20-40i and tetra 2-10i internal filters. they both work the same way. the cartridges cost about $6-$7 for a pack of 3 that will last 3 months. so roughly $24-$28 a year on cartridges for each filter. 

it's like the 20i filter in this video. this one in the video is the old version. the new version i have replaces the bio scrubber thing with a black sponge.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jB3VQm5Gz-g


i may try not using the easy balance for awhile and see what happens. if algae begins to grow too much i may start using it again. if the algae doesn't get too bad then i'll just not use it anymore.


----------



## Ice

Algae will always find their way into the tank no matter how hard you try to prevent it. There are ways to control algae but not stop it. As loha says, algae is a sign of a healthy tank. Get snails or plecos if you're worried about them. Both do a great job at keeping algae under control - naturally. I should know. I had algae in places I can't get to with a mag cleaner; so I went out and got a snail. Did a wonderful job and cleaned up my tank and glass.

Stop looking for additives to put in your tank. Stick with the basics and you'll do fine.


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah i know some algae will always be in the tank. i just don't want it to get bad and have green or brown stuff all over the glass and decorations and everything.


----------



## lohachata

well..all i can do is give you advice based on my own experiences..you get to be the expert for your own fish and do what you think best for them..


----------



## TheJakeM

I never have to touch the algae in my tanks. I am actually very interested in the different kinds of algae eaters and "clean up crews". They are one of my favorite parts of fish-keeping. Not one of my tanks lacks snails, shrimp, or Otto cats. I just got into Otto cats recently and I think they are some of the best at what they do.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Ice

Blackfinshark said:


> yeah i know some algae will always be in the tank. i just don't want it to get bad and have green or brown stuff all over the glass and decorations and everything.


You won't have to worry about that if you had snails, plecos or other algae eaters fish species. There are other ways to cut down on algae - one is don't overfeed and and the other is limit your lighting photoperiod to 8 hours a day.

I have a LED lighting on my 10 gallon tank. My schedule is usually turn my tank lights on in the morning (or sometimes during my lunch hour), switch over to blue lighting at night and turn it off completely later on at night (usually an hour or 2 before bedtime or before I go to bed). 

I've done days where I don't even turn on my tank lights during the day using natural light from my window with the vertical blinds open slightly (to stimulate a cloudy day). I almost always turn on my blue lighting at night - sometimes I don't to stimulate a moonless night. 

Although my tank is near 2 windows but during the summer months, my blinds are usually kept closed to keep the house cooler. The advantage I have is I don't get the west sun nor the high noon sun through those 2 windows in my den. (One window faces the north and the window my tank is next to faces the east)


----------



## Blackfinshark

i may not get algae. i dunno. these are my first fish tanks. i don't have experience with it. 

generally i only leave the light on for 6-8hrs a day. from about 4 or 6pm until midnight. i leave the lights off all day long. a little light comes into the room from the window but it's not shining on the tank directly. my tank is not in the sunlight next to a window or anything. i turn off the white led lights and turn on the blue for the last 2hrs of the day right before bed. 

it's possible i won't have any problems. i was just wondering before i stopped using the phosphate lowering product if i would or not. i guess i'll just have to try it and see what happens.

i'm not getting a snail of any kind. i'll wake up one morning and have 50 snails in my tank! lol

maybe some of those algae eaters but no snails.

i had some ghost shrimp but they all end up getting eaten by the fish.

i have noticed my heater feel a little slimy around the top of it as well as some decorations already. is that algae causing that? it's clear or slightly white looking not green or red or brown.


----------



## emc7

apple snails take two to tango. One per tank is safe from offspring.


----------



## Blackfinshark

do snails do a better job than algae eaters?


----------



## TheOldSalt

Absolutely!


----------



## Ice

I had a single mystery snail in my tank. Never wanted to get 2 or more for they have the potential to mate and lay eggs. That snail literally plowed through my tank and clean up the algae. So yes they do a better job. Here's another tidbit regarding Mystery snails - they are nice scavengers as well.


----------



## Blackfinshark

hmmm. well i may look into getting a snail for each tank. maybe an algae eater too i dunno. i'll see what the store has for sale.


----------



## weedkiller

algae eaters like pleco's tend to make lots of waste and can grow large so make sure of what you are buying is suitable to your size tank and that your filter will cope


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah i didn't get a pleco. they get huge. 

i got 3 algae eaters and 2 snails. i think the algae eaters are siamese or whatever. i'm not sure. it didn't say at the store. they kindof have cheetah looking spots on them with a black line going down through the middle of them longways. i got black mystery snails. they were 75 cents cheaper than gold mystery snails. not sure what the difference is other than the color.


----------



## Ice

Snails are dime a dozen and cheap. )


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah they were like $1.37 or something. the algae eaters cost a bit more. $3.77 each.


----------



## Blackfinshark

ok i got a question about snails. when you do a water change and they are way up on the glass do you have to take them off and put them down lower in the water or can they breathe air?

one i have now is sorta halfway in the water and halfway out of the water way up at the top of the glass.


----------



## TheJakeM

When snails go up for air it is normally a sign of bad water conditions or aggressive fish, check your water parameters and watch your fish. If you put them back down they'll just go back up again if nothing changes. 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## lohachata

you got chinese algae eaters and unfortunately not the siamese..chinese get 6-7 inches and become mean...
the difference between the black and the gold mystery snails is the color..nothing more..
snails often climb above the water surface..not that big of a deal..just try not to let them sneak out...


----------



## Blackfinshark

it's whatever they sale at walmart. that's the only type of algae eaters they have other than plecos.

i've already had a crab that's climbed out of the tank. lol

found him in the middle of the floor 3 days ago. he looks dead tonight. i dunno if he is or if he's molting. i'll see in the morning i guess.


----------



## Blackfinshark

TheJakeM said:


> When snails go up for air it is normally a sign of bad water conditions or aggressive fish, check your water parameters and watch your fish. If you put them back down they'll just go back up again if nothing changes.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


i do have melafix in the water right now since one of my fish have fin rot. is melafix bad for snails? water should be fine. just did a water change 3 days ago.

i do have aquarium salt in my tanks. i asked the pet store about it. they said it was fine in normal amounts. they always use salt in their aquariums at the store and the snails look fine.


----------



## Blackfinshark

i wish they sold these locally. these algae eaters look cool. check out the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwqMzCR2gb0


----------



## Blackfinshark

update: snail is now going down into the water on the glass in my big tank. he started moving when i first put him in and went around a rock and then up the glass to the top. he stayed up there a few hours then he started downward. maybe he was sleeping or something? lol


the snail in the small tank has been going around from the start. it took him awhile before he started moving but after that he hasn't stopped all night.


----------



## weedkiller

just to note.... not all pleco's get huge, one of mine wont get no bigger than 2 inches but the other gets to about 6, which still isn't big by any means


----------



## Ice

weedkiller is right. If I had a bigger tank and wanted a smallish pleco, I would pick the Zebra Pleco. The downside of owning one is the price - $500 for one. Wow! 

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=830+837+1136&pcatid=1136


----------



## lohachata

L-46 plecos do very little in the way of eating algae..they are primarily carnivores.they can be gotten for under $200 on aquabid.
but there are a great many other plecos and related species that are quite beautiful and will stay under 6"


----------



## Blackfinshark

the plecos they have here get up to 20" or more is what the pet store said. yikes!!!

the snails are doing a good job already. the heater in the small tank was white looking around the top and now it's back to the normal black after the snail cleaned it off.

i think it's good to have the algae eaters too because they can get to places the snails can't like behind the filters or behind the heaters and other crevices.

the crab is still alive. he's just not moving much at all. just sitting there looking up to the top of the tank. he'll move his legs or something every now and then. i bet he's molting or something. i haven't seen him eat for several days now. not sure what's going on.


----------



## lohachata

just remember to not starve the snails and algae eaters..get them some algae wafers and such...


----------



## Blackfinshark

i have some algae disc things. the fish just kind of nibble at them and don't really eat them much. the algae eaters and snails haven't been after them yet though except for the snail in the small tank. he's eaten some leftover fish flakes and some algae disc powder that was leftover.

the problem in my tank is nothing is gonna be left much for the snails. since they are so slow the food would be gone before they got to the bottom. lol

the crab is just kindof twitching every now and then. i guess he's gonna molt. it will be cool to see.


----------



## Blackfinshark

update: crab is dead after a week or so of not eating. maybe he hit his head too hard when he fell off of the tank onto the floor?


----------



## TheJakeM

He could have gotten a crack in his shell and gotten an infection. How long exactly did you have him. From my own knowledge, fiddler crabs need an area out of the water and sand to burrow in. Did your's have these?


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## lohachata

jake...this crab don't fiddle ; it just craws....lol....at earlier i wondered about the molting thing and why a fiddler would molt..then i realized what he was talking about...


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah i had a rock he could climb up to get air. he would usually climb up there at night and stay up there most of the night. i don't think his shell was cracked. maybe the crawfish i got stressed him out or something? i dunno but the crab lasted about a month or so.

i won't get one again. they just climb out of the tank and stuff. lol


----------



## TheJakeM

Ok, you could always set a smaller tank for crabs too, with really low water level. I also have no doubt that the crawfish would bother the crab. I'm surprised he didn't eat him outright.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Blackfinshark

yeah a crab only tank would probably be the best thing to do. 

the thing is anything you have in the tank like a heater, filter, etc. is something the crab can use to crawl out of the tank.


----------



## lohachata

you can get a pad that sits under the tank for heat..


----------



## TheJakeM

Or a small/several small "betta" heaters. A small sponge filter that only needs a couple inches would probably work and is the best option anyway. I've been planning on a tank like this for awhile. I might not get crabs, but something with similar needs.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Blackfinshark

you could get one of those glass lids and just cut tiny holes in the plastic part. just enough for the cables to go through. the crab couldn't fit through it. the lids that came with my tanks have big holes for the filter to sit in so it's like a huge open gate for the crab to get out. lol

a tetra internal filter would do a nice job since you could sit it down on the bottom of the tank in the water. that way only the small cord is coming out of the lid. they don't cost very much. a 2-10i is about $12 at walmart. a 10-30i is about $25.


----------

