# Sticky  Substrate choice



## fishstix

What kinds of substrate are best for growing plants in?


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## pokefan

I hear Eco-Complete thrown around alot here.

I'm in on this thread too, I've been redoing my tank and planned on just going with pool sand but the thought has crossed my mind to use two layers to get a little more nutrients in the substrate.


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## fishstix

I've got a pebble/gravel layer going on right now, and i wanted to replace it with sand just because i like the way it looks better (i might just put sand on top of it if two layers helps). They have some cool pictures of well done tanks in the aquarium and fish pics forum;and i think i want to do something like that as well.


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## Ricker

Ya eco-complete is real good. I have 100% in my tank and my plants are starting to grow in 3 dats of course lights help that to. I also hear Flourite is good but more $$$ then eco. As far as using two layers Pokefan I heard not to do it cause it will just get mixed up then you have a weird looking color.


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## pokefan

I could see two different colors of sand getting mixed together if you dig in it too much but isn't EC more like small gravel as far as size? If that's the case I don't see how it would mix?

Found this interesting, Taken from HERE



> If you're planning a planted tank substrate should be layered, with a bottom layer of finer substrates first, like laterite, kitty litter, flourite mixed with a handful of peat moss works really well. Topped with a layer of gravel or larger sand will make a great planting substrate.


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## trashion

I've also got eco-complete. It's not bad, but I got one of the bad batches that continuously belches tiny particles into the water. At least, I'm pretty sure it's the Eco-Complete, as I've read similar accounts.


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## Ricker

Eco-complete is like a dirt? Really hard to explain. But you are correct they are the size of small pebbles the finner ones sink to bottom and and the larger pieces stay on top it looks real good at first you won't see it happing then over night it will.. But cat litter when it gets wet its weight doubles cause it soaks in water and is real messy I wouldn't put that in my tank. But


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## Ricker

> I've also got eco-complete. It's not bad, but I got one of the bad batches that continuously belches tiny particles into the water. At least, I'm pretty sure it's the Eco-Complete, as I've read similar accounts.


what do you mean by it belches tiny particles into the water? here is a link so you can conform it is eco. When you added water did it get cloudy? With mine I had no cloudy crystal clear water when I filled mine up.

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produ...ubref=AA&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=0012989000000


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## Good Wolf

I use pool sand. I too thought about putting a layer on top of my gravel but Kristin talked me out of it. Through time it will seep through into the gravel and you'll end up with a mess.

I changed to sand to prevent my Cories from injuring their barbs and I'm glad I did. It looks a lot better, and most of my plants will stay in it without floating. I was even able to get my Java Fern roots to stay in without having to tie them down to anything. 

I haven't had my plants long enough to say how well they are growing but they are looking great.


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## trashion

I'm positive it was Eco-Complete, I sought it out and bought a bag that said "Eco-Complete" on it. There are bad batches on occasion that will cloud your water. It's hit or miss.


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## Ricker

Oh I though you meant you weren't sure if it was eco-complete. Mine was a good I guess cause I had no cloudy.


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## Guest

Nutrient rich substrates are best for growing plants. There are many choices for planted substrates if you want something with nutrients.

One of the more popular choices is Eco Complete. Its dark, nutrient rich, and is various sizes ranging from a larger sand to small pebbles. Eventually the large pebbles will reach the top of it, but most of it is more sandy like. I like Eco, but its not my favorite anymore.

Flourite is another choice, but the regular Flourite is full of dust and needs to be rinsed many many times. It ranges about the same price as Eco...the bags are a bit smaller and its cheaper, but it evens out to be the same. There is a new Flourite black out that comes in the regular size (probably fine gravel-like) and also in a sand. I've yet to try these, but I want to whenever I can find it for a good price locally.

Another option is Aquasoil from here. It lowers the pH and is by far my favorite, but probably the most expensive out of the ones I've listed so far. I wouldn't suggest this to a beginner though, since it leaches ammonia in the beginning and you need to use it in a new tank without fish or have alot of plant mass when you switch over.

Another popular choice that isn't nutrient rich is Turface Pro. It is used to dry up water on baseball fields and is made out of a type of clay. It is very absorbant and will hold in nutrients, making it a popular choice. Its much like Kitty Litter, but I think its a better choice, since you can buy the wrong kind of cat litter and kill your fish. Another option was Soilmaster Select, which is just like Turface, but I believe they are going to stop making it (or already have stopped). Turface is cheap too, if you can find it...about 50lb for $15 or less. Look at that link and there should be "find a supplier" or something like that on there.

If you have a large-ish tank to put substrate in and you want to save money, you are better off looking for Turface IMO. Check the suppliers on that site and see what you can find in your area.

Regular gravel and sand work, but they have no nutrients. These are fine for low light plants though. Once you move into medium and high light, its really worth it to have a nutrient rich substrate since alot of high light plants are picky about what they'll thrive in.




I <3 Fish said:


> I use pool sand. I too thought about putting a layer on top of my gravel but Kristin talked me out of it. Through time it will seep through into the gravel and you'll end up with a mess.


He's right....if you put sand on top of your gravel, the sand will eventually seep down to the bottom and you'll be left with a layer of gravel. Also, the sand layer on the bottom may compact and hold anaerobic bacteria pockets which can kill your fish if released.


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## pokefan

Whew, You scared me a bit til I got here:



JustOneMore20 said:


> Regular gravel and sand work, but they have no nutrients. These are fine for low light plants though. Once you move into medium and high light, its really worth it to have a nutrient rich substrate since alot of high light plants are picky about what they'll thrive in.


I just picked up a $17 bag of pool sand and thought I had a useless sand bag for a second. All low tech here!


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## fishstix

What if i put eco complete on the bottom and then sand on top? would the same thing happen?


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## Ricker

Ya cause eco complete is bigger so more gaps and the sand would most likely do the same thing. How many gallons is your tank? if it is a 10gallon All you really need is a bag of eco complete for a good bed.


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## Good Wolf

pokefan said:


> Whew, You scared me a bit til I got here:
> 
> 
> 
> I just picked up a $17 bag of pool sand and thought I had a useless sand bag for a second. All low tech here!


I got my bag for $2.54 from Home Depot. It was ripped so I got it at half price. I'll most likely get a higher end substrate later on.

Make sure to rinse your sand before adding it. Either way expect the water to cloud up for a couple of days but don't worry it will be crystal clear in no time. Don't make the same mistake I did and rinse the sand off the filters with tap water. I created another mini-cycle in the tank by doing that and removing the gravel that had bacteria on it. 

Let us know how it goes. It is a tedious process but the end result is worth it.


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## Guest

fishstix said:


> What if i put eco complete on the bottom and then sand on top? would the same thing happen?


Same thing will happen. Like Ricker said, the Eco Complete has larger grains than sand, so the sand will sink to the bottom.

I have half Eco Complete and half pool sand in my 55g planted (side by side....not on top of each other...if that makes sense)...and I have areas where they mixed. I knew they would, but didn't know how easily they'd mix together.


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## pokefan

I <3 Fish said:


> I got my bag for $2.54


I hate you! 



I <3 Fish said:


> Let us know how it goes. It is a tedious process but the end result is worth it.


I will for sure, it will all be in the journal. It will probably be another week or two I want to get all the plants in first so I don't have to keep messing with things and it will be easier to plant when the water is low!


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## fishstix

how about flourite? What would happen if i put flourite on the bottom and the gravel on top? Same thing because of the grain size? I just am thinking of different combos


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## Ricker

I think that would work but why not just go 100% flourite or 100% eco complete is well worth the money.


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## fcastro16

wasn't this thread suppost to be a sticky?


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## Guest

It was, yes, and now it is!


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## Mecc

Does anyone have any experiance with this stuff?

http://www.aquariumplants.com/Freshwater_Aquarium_Plant_Substrate_p/ss.htm


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## Miketag

fishstix said:


> I've got a pebble/gravel layer going on right now, and i wanted to replace it with sand just because i like the way it looks better (i might just put sand on top of it if two layers helps). They have some cool pictures of well done tanks in the aquarium and fish pics forum;and i think i want to do something like that as well.[/QUGravity will push the sand to the bottom, everything will eventually stack up in size order, smallest (sand) being on the bottom.


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## Brontegirl

I just use regular gravel, fertilizer tabs, lighting just over 3.5 watts per gallon and a homemade soda bottle co2 "system," and a bubble counter. The only plant I couldn't grow is moneywort. I have a lot of luck with the plants that are supposed to be hard to grow. I'm an avid gardener and the aquatic plants are a lot of fun for me. Now if only that would translate to my fish keeping skills.


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## Danio king

The only thing to worry about is you cant clean any open spaces of eco complete with a gravel siphon because it will suck up all the smaller particles so just keep that in mind if you dont plan to plant the entire aquarium bed.


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## cossie

this is an oldddddddddddd thread guys lol


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## gillman

If i were you I would dirt your tank.


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## johnmcleren

*Reply*

Substrate materials for planted aquariums are abundant now, with two of my favorites being EcoComplete, and Fluorite Brown. EcoComplete is probably my best pick between the two. I have seen a pronounced effect on the plants using this substrate. Growth is lush, good and appears to be completing in terms of what the plants requirement. It does seem that there is a breaking period for the EcoComplete in terms of plant growth.

Thank you


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