# Still doing daily water changes



## logans (Apr 1, 2006)

I have been doing daily water changes for about 10 or 11 days now. Ammonia levels seem to stay consistently at .5 when I check every day. Still no sign of nitates or nitrites. I sure will be glad when I can stop doing the water changes its getting old. I do have a question. Every time I do a water change of about 25 to 30% of the water I add the stuff (Kent First Step) that makes the tap water safe for the fish the stuff that gets rid of chlorine and other "stuff" in the water. I just ran out. Should I go ahead and to the water change anyways even though I wont have more stuff to add until tomorrow since the ammonia levels are at .5 or is it ok to hold off on the water change until tomorrow?

----Mike


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## fishboy (Feb 26, 2005)

well we need to know the size of your tank, the fish, how long it's been setup, and and parameters that you can provide. By the way, my name's logan =)


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

If your tapwater contains chlorine only ( no chloramine ), you don't need any conditioner. Splash the water as you add it to the tank and chlorine will evaporate. 
It is very important to keep up the water changes. Low levels of ammonia are very toxic to your fish.


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## Carl (Jul 7, 2005)

If u hav only just set up the tank, u have to give the filters time to biuld up to be able to balance the system. Don't just keep doing water changes all the time.

If the tank isn't new then we need more info on your fish, filter, foods.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

If he has fish he needs to change water to keep the ammonia down.


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

Water change is VERY important.


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## logans (Apr 1, 2006)

Carl said:


> If u hav only just set up the tank, u have to give the filters time to biuld up to be able to balance the system. Don't just keep doing water changes all the time.
> 
> If the tank isn't new then we need more info on your fish, filter, foods.



I seem to be getting conflicting info. Some tell me I need to do daily water changes to keep the ammonia levels at .5 or lower. Others say not to do it daily. Went back to the pet store today. Employee there who has several tanks of her own both fresh and salt water says she does water changes only once a week when starting a new tank. So far I have been doing them daily for close to 2 weeks. For additional info for those who have not read my other posts in a different thread I have a 29 gallon tank. I set the tank up about 2 weeks ago. The tank has 3 Tetras and 1 Molly. If I would have known what I know now I probaby wouldn't have gotten the Molly. My 7 year old daughter picked that one out. Knowing what I know now that probably wasnt the best choice to go with the Tetras. 

--Mike


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

From the information you are giving us right now, it seems like your tank is going through a cycle. YOu can read up on a cycle if you don't know what that is in some of the sticky posts or do a search on it. But in a nutshell, the extra food and the waste from your fish are decomposing into the ammonia that you are reading in your tank. Bacteria has to build up to break down this ammonia into nitrites, and then again into nitrates. Because you added so many fish (and probably not the hardiest either) the ammonia is spiking up to large amounts because the tank has never seen the fish waste before, and there is nothing to break it down.

So yes, it is necessary to do water changes to keep your ammonia down so that your fish do not die. On the other hand, what Carl was saying is that the only way the bacteria is going to be able to build up is if there is ammonia in the tank to feed on. By doing water changes you are removing this ammonia and slowing the progress of the bacteria. 

To summarize, you are going through a cycle, and by removing the water everyday (while necessary to maintain the health of your fish, unless you move them to another tank, or can get an extra filter pad from an established tank such as from a friend) you are prolonging the cycle process. You're tank will eventually stop reading ammonia and become stable, but how long that will be is not certain. Until then you should remove water so that the ammonia can stay low enough as though it won't kill your fish. I hope this some how helped you, and if you are confused about anything please ask.


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## logans (Apr 1, 2006)

fishn00b said:


> From the information you are giving us right now, it seems like your tank is going through a cycle. YOu can read up on a cycle if you don't know what that is in some of the sticky posts or do a search on it. But in a nutshell, the extra food and the waste from your fish are decomposing into the ammonia that you are reading in your tank. Bacteria has to build up to break down this ammonia into nitrites, and then again into nitrates. Because you added so many fish (and probably not the hardiest either) the ammonia is spiking up to large amounts because the tank has never seen the fish waste before, and there is nothing to break it down.
> 
> So yes, it is necessary to do water changes to keep your ammonia down so that your fish do not die. On the other hand, what Carl was saying is that the only way the bacteria is going to be able to build up is if there is ammonia in the tank to feed on. By doing water changes you are removing this ammonia and slowing the progress of the bacteria.
> 
> To summarize, you are going through a cycle, and by removing the water everyday (while necessary to maintain the health of your fish, unless you move them to another tank, or can get an extra filter pad from an established tank such as from a friend) you are prolonging the cycle process. You're tank will eventually stop reading ammonia and become stable, but how long that will be is not certain. Until then you should remove water so that the ammonia can stay low enough as though it won't kill your fish. I hope this some how helped you, and if you are confused about anything please ask.



No I am not confused. I have read up on cycles and from past posts here feel I have a good understanding of how it all works. I was told that Tetras are very hearty fish and good fish to start a new tank. The tetras seem real happy and healthy. As mentioned before I probably wouldn't have chosen a Molly knowing what I know now.

---Mike


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## Carl (Jul 7, 2005)

Yes Tetras are a good starter fish to get the tank going because they can take some quite extremes in ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels without too much of a problem. I don't think the molly is as much a problem as u have made out though. They are also very hardy little fish. 

So how often are you now going to do water changes and how much? I think little and often would probably be your best bet.


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## logans (Apr 1, 2006)

Carl said:


> Yes Tetras are a good starter fish to get the tank going because they can take some quite extremes in ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels without too much of a problem. I don't think the molly is as much a problem as u have made out though. They are also very hardy little fish.
> 
> So how often are you now going to do water changes and how much? I think little and often would probably be your best bet.



Well every day when I check the water the ammonia is .5 so I do a water change of about 1/3 of the water. I think instead of changing the water just becuase it says .5 I am going to hold off until the next day, if it then shows above .5 I will go ahead and do a water change but maybe more like just 20% of the water. Thus far I have been assuming that if I don't change the water each day it will go above .5 by the next day. But this may not be the case. I didn't change it last night even though it said .5 so it will be interesting to see if it stays at .5 or if it shows even higher when I check it later today. I think the bottom line is that I don't want the ammonia levels to go much above .5 Hopefully I can pull off doing water changes just every other day for a little while.

---Mike


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## mousey (Jan 18, 2005)

well what about using a bit of Ammo-lock or Amquell to render the ammonia non toxic to the fish and to let the bacteria develop And to cut out the water changing so much? And the fish will be more comfortable.
I figure that anyway i can shorten the cycling process is better for the fish.
Are you starting to show any nitrites yet?
You can add a little bit of salt to the water to help the fish thru the nitrite stage.

You will always get some conflicting information as it seems that there are many variables.
When i started out fishkeeping and knew nothing, I cycled my tank on a neon tetra and a platy. 
Then I found out neons are too fragile to cycle with and I should have used black skirt tetras instead or zebra fish.
As the manager says at Big Al's "well maybe but nothing is for sure in fish keeping. Try it!"
I use Ammo Lock all the time to treat my water. I have been told that it is not for use in other than an emergency by my lfs, but I contacted the manufacturer of the product and read their info sheets and have been using it now with water changes for 4 years. I feel a bit more comfortable knowing I have a bit of leeway if the water company messes around with the water supply.
Oh, and did you throw in some fast growing plants like hornwort to eat up the ammonia?
Sorry if you have read this info before or posted about plants--I have forgotten
mousey


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

You will not get correct ammonia test readings while using ammo-lock. It will work as mousey says, but you won't be able to track the progress of your cycle.


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## pokagon55 (Jan 31, 2006)

fishboy said:


> well we need to know the size of your tank, the fish, how long it's been setup, and and parameters that you can provide. By the way, my name's logan =)


logans, you never did answer the question of how big and how long or any other info on your tank. It makes it alot easier to help you if you help us. Need to know this info. about the tank.


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## Carl (Jul 7, 2005)

When you just set up a tank you will always have these peaks in readings of ammonia, nitrate and nitrite. Try not doing them even that often, because i think the readings will lower of the next week or two. Water changes are not absolute in fishkeeping, though most will tell you so. 

As you can see i keep rays, and people say they are the most delicate fish, well thats coz they make it more dificult for themselves by doing changes every week or even day. In the 450l or 119 gallons to you, i do an 8 litre (2.1 gallon) water change a month. Consistancy is often more important than perfection. 

As suggested try using Amquel because that is fantastic stuff.


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## logans (Apr 1, 2006)

pokagon55 said:


> logans, you never did answer the question of how big and how long or any other info on your tank. It makes it alot easier to help you if you help us. Need to know this info. about the tank.


I answered a few posts back you must have missed it. I have a 29 gallon tank. I started the tank about 2 weeks ago. I have 3 Tetras and 1 Molly

---Mike


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

logans said:


> Well every day when I check the water the ammonia is .5 so I do a water change of about 1/3 of the water. I think instead of changing the water just becuase it says .5 I am going to hold off until the next day, if it then shows above .5 I will go ahead and do a water change but maybe more like just 20% of the water. Thus far I have been assuming that if I don't change the water each day it will go above .5 by the next day. But this may not be the case. I didn't change it last night even though it said .5 so it will be interesting to see if it stays at .5 or if it shows even higher when I check it later today. I think the bottom line is that I don't want the ammonia levels to go much above .5 Hopefully I can pull off doing water changes just every other day for a little while.
> 
> ---Mike


Logans, I think you are on track. Stay with this plan.


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## IrishKittenOWar (Mar 19, 2006)

speaking of amonia lock.. they have stuff on the market called AmQuel Plus which removes Amonia, Nitrate, and Nitrite, cholorine and chloramines its safe for both freshwater and saltwater and seems to work very well on my tanks. it helps alot when you are dosing your tank with meds or cycling your tank to keep away the nasty spikes.. i hope it helps

IKOW


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## Carl (Jul 7, 2005)

Someones just mentioned that.


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## pokagon55 (Jan 31, 2006)

logans said:


> I answered a few posts back you must have missed it. I have a 29 gallon tank. I started the tank about 2 weeks ago. I have 3 Tetras and 1 Molly
> 
> ---Mike


Sorry about that Mike, yes I did miss that. A day late and a dollar short! Sorry dude!


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## pokagon55 (Jan 31, 2006)

ron v said:


> Logans, I think you are on track. Stay with this plan.


I do agree with this too. I just wanted to add.....What is the PH reading on the tank? A lower ph reading will render the Ammonia as being less toxic to the fish. I just thought that I would add that just in case it would be helpful which would mean less water changes in order to let the cycle take it's course. I will get Bombed for saying that but oh well.


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

pokagon55 said:


> A lower ph reading will render the Ammonia as being less toxic to the fish.


This is true. However a cycle takes longer with a low PH. The bacteria develops quicker at a high PH and high temperature.


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## pokagon55 (Jan 31, 2006)

ron v said:


> This is true. However a cycle takes longer with a low PH. The bacteria develops quicker at a high PH and high temperature.


Yes that is true also, kind of like a double edge sword


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## logans (Apr 1, 2006)

I just got back from the pet store. I was trying to decide whether I should buy AmQuel or Ammo-lock. Ammo-lock says it detoxifies the ammonia but it does not remove the ammonia. AmQuel says it removes the ammonia. What is better, to actually remove it altogether with AmQuel or to just detoxify the ammonia with Ammo-lock? I decided to get the AmQuel since it also says that it does not interfere with biological filtration or nitirfying bacteria. Im going to add some right now. 

pokagon55 my pH is about 7.6

---Mike


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## pokagon55 (Jan 31, 2006)

logans said:


> I just got back from the pet store. I was trying to decide whether I should buy AmQuel or Ammo-lock. Ammo-lock says it detoxifies the ammonia but it does not remove the ammonia. AmQuel says it removes the ammonia. What is better, to actually remove it altogether with AmQuel or to just detoxify the ammonia with Ammo-lock? I decided to get the AmQuel since it also says that it does not interfere with biological filtration or nitirfying bacteria. Im going to add some right now.
> 
> pokagon55 my pH is about 7.6
> 
> ---Mike


Oh! ok no worries then. I would pick the AmQuel :fun: Sounds like you have everthing under control, Great!


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