# Red zebra cichlid



## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

Today I was at a lfs and they just got in 2 red zebra cichlids but they had them in a 5g. I told them that tank is too small but they did not care. I decided to get them they are going to hold it for me until next week.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

Stores keep everything in small tanks. They don't care because they expect to sell the fish in a week or two. Most fish can take small tanks for a short time. Although some will jump out or smash the walls or kill other fish in the tank. But here is where misinformation comes in. If you ask a clerk,"what size tank for this fish", often he will say the size the fish is in now. Even if the fish is a peacock bass that can grown to 3x the size of the 10 gallon tanks they are sold out of. This is why you need to research every fish before you bring it home. The clerk is sure a 5 is fine because the fish are in a 5 and they haven't died in a week, so they are likely to live a week in your 5 and get past the guarantee period where its his problem if they die. 

We assume you'll want to keep your fish for several years and suggest tanks sizes that full-grown adult fish can live comfortably and maybe even breed in.


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

They are going in my 29g and will be the only fish in the tank. They are only 2" so they will be fine.


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## OhYesItsMe (Oct 1, 2011)

2 wont cut it unless they are both female, you should get 1 or 2 more females if there is a male and female and at least 4 more females if they are both males, if not one of them is likely to die due to stress of being attacked by the more dominate male


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

I don't know if they are male but I'm guessing they are.


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## kay-bee (Dec 6, 2006)

I definately agree with emc7's last statement.

When viewing thing from the long term perspective (i.e, keeping full grown 4"-6" red zebra's which ideally is what all small 2" red zebra's will become) I wouldn't recommend keeping red zebra's (or nearly any other mbuna species) in any tank with less than 48" of length (which typically means 55gal tanks are the bare minimum).

1. Small tanks will amplify mbuna aggression.

2. Small numbers (mbuna group size less than 6-8 strong) will amplify mbuna aggression.

3. Small numbers of mbuna's in small tank will greatly increase mbuna aggression.

4. On a mbuna scale of aggression ranging from 1 to 5 (1 being mildly aggressive and 5 being extremely aggressive), red zebra's typically rate about a 3.5 (+/- 0.5).

A 29gal will work for small mbuna's for a time until their aggression develops (usually when the hit 3"), and aggressive mbuna behavior isn't limited to only the males. (the sole 'serial killer' mbuna that I have had was a female).


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## lohachata (Jan 27, 2006)

ok...this is where i am going to disagree.....i used to breed lots of mbuna....all of my breeding tanks were 40 longs....each tank help 15-30 adults....
what i learned was that if it is done right you can keep a pretty fair number of fish in a tank..
this is how i kept them....
tank....40 long.....48 x 12 x 16.....
filtration.....undergravel..
substrate....dolomite..(crushed limestone)..
rockwork.....tufa rock...3/4 of the tank was filled with tufa rock...
temps.....80 F...
lighting.....standard shop light..10+ hrs a day for algae growth...
water changes....40% once a week..sometimes twice...75% once a month..

now this is just how i did it...but i was pretty tuned in to what i was doing...never had problems with aggression and anyone getting beaten up...
the rock were covered with algae....algae is an important part of their diet....
this does not mean that it is the only way or the best way to keep mbuna..just my way....but i always say..i am still a novice in this hobby..still learning..
i don't think folks should do as i do or do as i say...i am just offering up another way to do things.....
to me...a 29 gallon tank is plenty for 2 zebras...
remembr....
your money..your time....your home...your tank...your fish.....do what makes you happy.....


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

I don't think there will be much problems with aggression since they will both go in at the same time. I've read that people have done this lots of times but guess we'll see.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

The longer they live, the meaner they get. And individual fish have individual personalities. IME, red zebras are on the mild side for there size (Maylandia/metriaclima species get bigger than psuedotropheus). If you are lucky, you will have a pair and they will spawn at about 1.5-2" and then you will have more than 2 before they hit 4" and get mean. If you have 2 of the same sex, you may or may not be okay. But,IME, if you have 2 males with females in the tank, one male will kill the other (or drive it jump out). My idea of a good mbuna tank is a 55 with a harem (one male, many females). You collect the fry, grow them a bit, sell all the males but one or two and keep all the females. You keep selling the biggest, dominant males. Because they keep getting bigger and meaner. 

I like to recommend a 4' tank for any mbuna, but that isn't perfect. I bred P. Saulosi in a 29 (1 trio) and I've gotten rid of all my M. Lombardoi because a 55 wasn't big enough to suit them. 

It seems like the longer a fish has been in the hobby, the bigger and meaner they get.


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## kay-bee (Dec 6, 2006)

Mbuna's placed in the tank at the same time and grow up with each other typically do not exhibit *immediate* aggressive behavior. It's actually adivised to add all of the intended mbuna population all at once rather than over a long period of time because established mbuna's generally do not take kindly to newly added mbuna's. 

However, being introduced into the tank at the same time as juvies doesn't diminish the potential aggression that can manifest later on, it may just delay it a bit because their 'pecking order' will be worked out fairly early and prior to when they're capable of inflicting great damage on each other. Mbuna's which grow up together can end up killing each other later as full grown specimens if aggression counter-balances aren't in place.

The order of dominance can be challenged years later when both are matured and the subordinate senses it can 'take' the the top spot or the tolerance of the alpha fish towards its tankmate abruptly wanes literally overnight and converts to the tank into a solitary set up. Again, I'm not talking about small immature specimens but full grown adults (which small specimens eventually become).


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

If you keep mbuna, you need to have a QT/hospital tank handy. If you can catch a fish without taking out the rocks, it really needs to come out of the tank. But they are tough fish and will regrow fins that have been totally chewed off in a few months of isolation. The smaller the tank, the less warning you have and the more likely trouble is. But unlike SAs that often kill with no warning, with mbuna you usually have a few days to notice and act.


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## kay-bee (Dec 6, 2006)

lohachata said:


> ...to me...a 29 gallon tank is plenty for 2 zebras...
> ....


A numeric pair of mbuna's places the subordinate one in lots of risk because it will bare 100% of any aggression the alpha dishes out (the single tank mate of a dominant specimen has it a lot rougher than 7 tank mates of a dominant specimen).

Red zebra's of this size (~2.5") will do fine for a while in a 29gal









But for 5.5" full grown specimens such as these, a 29gal will offer no place to hide if the dominant decides to eliminate the other (and with no alternate 'targets' that could literally occur overnight).


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

What other fish can I keep with them? I'm picking them up tomorrow and need to know before I put them in the tank.


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## Cory1990 (Jun 14, 2012)

I'd get yellow labs, I have 7 mix Africans in a 55g with a ton of rocks. I have 0 aggression so don't always believe what others tell you about low numbers.


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

Yellow lab is the same as electric yellow?


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

yes, but it is one fish I wouldn't put with red zebra. They are known to hybridize.


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

Guess I'll keep them by themselves.


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## kay-bee (Dec 6, 2006)

Cory1990 said:


> I'd get yellow labs, I have 7 mix Africans in a 55g with a ton of rocks. I have 0 aggression so don't always believe what others tell you about low numbers.


7 africans (which isn't really a low number) in a 55gal is quite a different scenario than two in a 29gal. 

Yellow labs are less aggressive than most other mbuna species but can still exhibit aggression especially when there are females that multiple males can compete over. The male yellow labs that I have (which were born in my tank in 2006) regularly challenge each other in my 125gal with much more gusto than they did when they were small(er).

Juvenile mbuna's co-exist a lot better than fully matured specimens. A numeric pair of youngster mbuna's would work for 'some time' in a 29gal, but not for the long term. Genuine mbuna aggression doesn't really reach full fruition until they're a few years old.


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

So they'll be fine for a while? I will just keep them both together who knows maybe they might be a pair.


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

Got them in today.


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

How can you tell what sex they are?


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## kay-bee (Dec 6, 2006)

In my opinion, Metriaclima estherae is one easiest mbuna species to sex visually. But first, here's the most recommended method: vent them. You'll need to net the fish and examine their openings. There are probably many web sites online that offer visual examples, here is only one of them:

http://www.malawimayhem.com/articles_venting.shtml

Now, getting back to the visual method, the dimorphic 'wild-type' m. estherae are the easiest to sex because the majority of the "red zebra" males in the wild are born blue-gray and the females are orange. They're like that from birth and unlike most all other dimorphic mbuna species, they don't undergo a color transition. 

Wild-type male metriaclima estherae are superficially similar to cobalt blue zebras (metriaclima callainos); no need to vent these guys at all.









In the hobby, however, the orange-morph m. estherae are most prevalent (though in the wild they're quite rare, less than 1%). While both genders of this m. estherae morph are orange there are still some subtle color differences.

1. Males lighten in color as they mature, becoming closer to pink than orange; females remain carrot orange.

2. The dorsal fins take on a blue hue once these red zebras reach or surpass 2.5", the dorsals of the females remain orange.

Examples:

The two photo's that I posted earlier are all males as are these, note the blue-hued dorsals:

Juvenile male:









Full grown male (note the lighter body coloration, more pinkish now than orange):









Juvenile female: Note the absence of any blue hue in the dorsal fin)









Mouthbrooding Matured female :









These differences may not be apparent with very small specimens (less than 2"), which are also difficult to vent at that size.


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## Coolfish (Apr 30, 2012)

I don't see any blue on them. I'm thinking they are both female but could be wrong.


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