# Brand New To All Aquarium Life



## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Well I guess it starts with a hello! I have always been interested in Aquariums and all that. Now I finally got the opportunity to start one. Now I may have gotten ahead of myself, but I was antsy and couldnt help myself. I bought a starter kit type of setup. Its a 20gal tank, its got a heater, and a hanging filter, and UV light. Now I am not sure what is good to go and what needs to be tossed and have something of a higher quality. I was reading through the stickies about light, skimmers, filters, live rock/sand. Just an awful lot to take in right now, so I thought I would turn to the boards to get some guidance. My goal is to get a few good beginner fish that I know I wont end up hurting or even kill, I was told mollies are quite easy to care for, and clown fish can be as well if you are attentive to the environment. So for this noob/starter setup what could I use to get me off on the right track.

Sorry for the long post, but I hope to be here often! :fish:


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## Georgia Peach (Sep 23, 2005)

welcome to the Fish Forums. Acutally a starter kit is a great way to begin in my opnion. You should get your tank set up and running and while it's cycling you can research and decide what fish you will keep..


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## Lydia (Feb 6, 2005)

:hi: to FishForums!

Since you are a beginner, a 20 gallon is probably not a good idea. I hate to be pessimistic, but saltwater tanks are very difficult in small tanks like that. I'm sure someone who knows more about SW explain better.

-Lydia


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## manda (Feb 9, 2006)

welcome to the forum. lots of helpful people here!


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## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

I think that the very first thing you should buy next is a good book on the subject. Yes, a good book can be pricey, but it will help you save a fortune in the long & not-so-long runs. We can teach you all sorts of stuff, but reading a book will help it all make a lot more sense to you.

I'd recommend "The New Marine Aquarium" by Mike Paletta. It's a good book that's not too expensive and easy to understand while still being chock full of useful info.
Robert Fenner's ' The Conscientious Marine Aquarist" is another very good book, possibly the best, but a lot more expensive.


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

So would it be a consensus that a 20gal + a noob + SW = bad idea haha?? It does not bother me, I would rather get used to everything and get the hang of things then try to jump in and hope I am doing it right.


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## Georgia Peach (Sep 23, 2005)

Lydia said:


> :hi: to FishForums!
> 
> Since you are a beginner, a 20 gallon is probably not a good idea. I hate to be pessimistic, but saltwater tanks are very difficult in small tanks like that. I'm sure someone who knows more about SW explain better.
> 
> -Lydia


oh, I didnt notice he wanted to have Saltwater..


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

Welcome to fishforums. Yes a 20 gallon tank is pretty small for starting out in saltwater. It can be done, but might have a few more bumps in the road. However, if this is your FIRST tank ever, Id buy the book the old salt suggested, and read up while you start a freshwater tank first. After you've kept that for say, nine months, to a year, you may either get a bigger tank for saltwater, or convert your 20 gallon. (although I'd go with a bigger tank for saltwater myself, opens up a lot of options if you do), Right of the bat, I'd go and check out ron v's post on the "nitrogen cycle"... I'll be right back with that link.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

here you go.
http://www.fishforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7125


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## leveldrummer (May 27, 2005)

you mentioned mollies, thats a fresh water fish, i agree with fish first, that you should start a nice simple freshwater tank first. everything with salt is more money and more time, im currently doing the research for my first salt tank, and i can tell you from experience, its WAY more involved... not to scare you. read the topic above, thats gonna be one of the most important steps. post a few more topics about what kinds of fish you would like to keep, and we can help you from there... just a hint, with a 20 gal, choose fish no larger than 4 or 5 inches max... you can put more fish in if you choose smaller fish... and good luck, hope it all goes great for you.


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Well what we were looking at and were told from a local marine/fish store is clowns, and a lot of smaller community fish, even a few damsels could work. So far as of now we have our salt level at the 1.021ppm and its sitting at a cozy 78*, live sand, and 2 medium sized live rock.


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## TheOldSalt (Jan 28, 2005)

Get the salt up to 1.023, carefully and slowly, if you want your live rock to stay very lively.
Those fish you mentioned will work. Damsels are especially tough and hard to kill, but they're a scrappy bunch that don't play well with others. They make good beginner fish, though, on account of their hardiness. They can survive your mistakes.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

well since you are going ahead with plans of a salt tank, I'd definately read the post I sent you earlier (it happen to saltwater tanks too and you can cycle the tank with liverock) Also read my post about what fish/invert/coral to get... its a very informative post about what fish do well, and what fish not to get. 

My personal favorites for small tanks like this are the "clown gobies" "neon gobies" "firefish" "royal grammas" and "clownfish" however, you need to pick and choose because not all of these fish can fit in there. When you are done cycling I would highly recommend getting one fish, wait two weeks, get another fish, wait two weeks, and then possibly get one more fish. 

I would also take a look at my post on setting up a saltwater tank.

Five things to watch out for/do:
1) doing things too fast
2) overstocking
3) compatebility
4) quarentine everything
5) never believe what the LFS tells you, check the info out yourself, make sure they aren't just trying to get a buck out of you
http://www.fishforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5216
http://www.fishforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5426


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Well I looked on our local craigslist and found a 30 gal for around $30 all glass. I got it (he was moving to college dorm).

Either way, its being added with the salt and the live rock, live sand. When first testing before any fish are in, should there be any ammonia in there at all. on the 20gal i took an ammonia reading and it was at 0.5ppm. The instructions were not too clear on whether this is normal for new or this is very very bad.

I got the Red Seal Marine Lab to do the testing.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

Its normal, yet deadly to fish/inverts. Again, I'd read Ron v's post on the nitrogen cycle since this is what you are about to experience.


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Well just got back from getting some stuff for the tank. We got enough live sand to cover the bottom about 1/2" and only about 8lbs of live rock. The place we got it from says its cured as they have to go in the back and take it from a HUGE tank of warm water flowing over it. My question is what does dying live rock look like?? Parts of our rock is like a light brown color and others are a more extremely light tan even grey. 

Salinity is up to 1.023 like TOS suggested. Umm ammonia is 0.5ppm, and nitrate is 2.5ppm, PH is 8.2, water is at 78*-79*, I am trying to think if I am forgetting anything in here. Oh if you use a live fish cycling say 1 or 2 small damels what is the life expectancy of them?? I ask because I have yet to see a spike in ammonia or nitrite (i think thats the one). I have the nitrogen cycle printed out and taped up on my wall haha.


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## leveldrummer (May 27, 2005)

when the tank is done cycling the ammonia and nitrite will be 0. your getting ammonia and nitrite from die off on the live rock and sand. just wait that out. dont put fish in till ammonia hits zero again. shouldnt be too long.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

yep, unlike our freshwater buddies, we can cycle with liverock and livesand. You probably are already starting the process as you can see your ammonia and nitrites are showing up. Once those settle back down to zero, get your first two or so fish. Then maybe one more after two weeks, then possibly another after another two weeks. I think 3-5 fish is a good range for you right now depending on what you get. Any thoughts on what you want?


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

oh I forgot about the dying liverock, usually bad liverock looks gray, brown, tanish color without any signs of life on it usually stinks. Good liverock looks pink purple green white ect, has many hitchhikers like I described in baddogs thread.


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Well we are looking at some clown fish (the gf loves nemo haha). Some damsels and after we care for these for a good long while and get used to the cycles and periodic water changes we are going to look into a much bigger tank (55gal) and then look at maybe butterflies. Either way the rock that we were given looks like a tan to grey. Is there a way to rescue it? Or in the bad possibility it should die is there a way to bring it back so to speak. There looks like there is some growth on it but if it was already there I do not know.


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Well here is 6 of the 15lbs I have, I dont know if the coloration is decent or if its bad or not, in one of the pictures you can see some growth.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

It will recover... its definately cured rock thats for sure. 
here is some rock that I had recently purchased when the photo was taken... notice the pink/purple stuff, thats what you want in good rock.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

I'll get current pictures and you can see how things progressed from there almost 6 months ago.


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## leveldrummer (May 27, 2005)

yes please... im very interested in this myself.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

Here is some really mature rock, if you can get even a quarter of that coraline algae, you're doing well.


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Okay, I am going through the cycling right now. The ammonia is at a steady 2.5ppm, will this start to go down?? 

Nitrate has started to appear as well, if I am looking at this color chart correctly the tank is at 5.0ppm REAAAAALY high I think.

Alkalinity is right on the normal to low mark. How do I change this??

Nitrite is .05-.1ppm

PH at 8.2

Salinity rose a bit to between 1.023-1.024


How am I doing?? This has been cycling for a week with a single shrimp and 6lbs of LR and 1" of LS.

If I were to add 7-10lbs more of live rock would I need to re-cycle or just go ahead and add some fish??


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

Ammonia should start going down soon, and then nitrite should spike. Your nitrates are fine, at least for now, most inverts can handle nitrates up to 20 ppm.
Alkalinity can be increased with the introduction of a bicarbonate such as baking soda. Adding a bit over a period of a few days will increase it to where you want it. I'd try a teaspoon per five gallons to start... 
If you add more rock you may experience another mini-cycle, which can be controlled by water changes and monitoring your levels of ammonia and nitrite.
Specific gravity is fine
pH is fine


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## leveldrummer (May 27, 2005)

ff, im just asking so i know, and maybe help this person out too, isnt the specific gravity going up because of evaporation? the best way to fix that would be to top of the tank with fresh water right?


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Well the live rock is starting to become "alive" again. Its beginning to become a more purple color. However, on some parts there are dark to light splotches of green algae. Is this a good or bad thing and if bad how do I get rid of it.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

leveldrummer, the salinity or specific gravity is fine because its within normal conditions.

the green algae is normal at this point. Keep calcium levels up (by supplimentation) so coraline has a chance to take over.


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## xjrrrdx (Mar 2, 2006)

Well here is my rock, its coming along nicely I think. I was worried about the green algae but I was told its normal.


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