# Sticky  Metal Halide or Power Compact ?



## cheseboy (Aug 5, 2005)

Hi, I am planing out my whole reef tank for when I finally get enough money to make my fish only into a reef. So I am looking at the types of lighting. I want enough lighting to move up when I get more experienced to hard corals but I don't want to pay 500$ to do so. So I can either get a 65x2 PC. That is the biggest size they make for my tank. Or I can get Metal Halide. i would probably DIY it and I can vary on the wattage. I am thinking 175 watts for metal halide. Since it's only a 30 G and I don't want my tank to overheat. What do you think? If there is another lighting option feel free to say so.


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

I would get the metal halide with one actinic bulb of PC or VHO. It shouldn't cost you 500 dollars for the setup... but it'll range in the 200-300 dollar range.


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## Reefneck (Oct 15, 2005)

T5HO all the way! With a 4 bulb Retro kit of T5HO you will have plenty of light for any type of Corals and it's alot less expensive. I can dig up links to some prize winning tanks run on only T5's if you have any doubts. And the retro kits built into a canopy are really inexpensive.


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

I know T5 run a lot less watts too... don't they? Are they suffiecent to keep corals growing?


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## Reefneck (Oct 15, 2005)

They are VERY sufficent! The watts per gallon myth is no longer valid. There have been many Prize winning tanks with nothing but T5HO's. Now I mean "HO"'s not just T5 but T5HO!


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## Fishnewb1 (Mar 24, 2006)

Is there a difference of T-5 to T-5 HO? And if there is what is it?


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## leveldrummer (May 27, 2005)

can some one give a quick explanation of the t-5, vho, pc and the differences in them all. something for us noobs to understand.?


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## Reefneck (Oct 15, 2005)

Fishnewb1 said:


> Is there a difference of T-5 to T-5 HO? And if there is what is it?


A BIG difference in light output. T5's are good. T5 HO's are better.

Difference is like the difference between Normal Florescent & Power Compact Florescent. It's very noticeable in both intensity and the growth produced in Corals. HO=High Output


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## Reefneck (Oct 15, 2005)

leveldrummer said:


> can some one give a quick explanation of the t-5, vho, pc and the differences in them all. something for us noobs to understand.?


Power compacts (PCs) were to be a major improvement on standard fluorescent and they were. But they still could not come close to Metal Halides. They provide more light in a wider area that standard NO bulbs can.

VHO (Very High Output) are widely used and are very good for growing most types of Corals including SPS. The bulbs are larger than T5's and smaller than standard fluorescents. A Good choice for retro kits but still not as good as Metal Halides.

T5 is a smaller tube in diameter. Using the right reflectors they can produce more light than VHO, Take up less space and produce less heat.

Metal Halides stand out from the crowd. Retro kits, Pendants and fixtures are available with a wide variety of bulb types including Mogul sockets (Screw in) SE (Single ended) and DE (Double Ended) HQI's. They are available in 75W, 150W, 250W and now 400W. What wattage to choose would depend on what you plan to keep and the depth of your tank.

As an example, On my 75 gallon. It's 4 feet long by 18 inches wide and 20 inches deep. Due to the fact it's not really deep I went with 2 150W DE HQI's using 2 T5 Actinics as supplements. I only run the HQI's 8 hours a day as any more could burn the corals.

There are many people that have used nothing but T5 HO's and had all the success with SPS as others with Metal Halides. The only thing that Metal Halides can do that no other current product can is the "shimmer" effect. I just love it. Makes it a little hard to take pictures but the effect is incredible. Check out www.garf.org for some pictures of tanks using only T5 HO's.

There are currently several companies working on LED lighting that is purported to rival Metal Halides in both intensity and even produces the famous "Shimmer". None of these are on the market yet. I am currently in discussions with the owner of IceCap regarding Beta testing for them. Hopefully something comes through and I can do a side by side comparison for everyone to benefit from and hopefully providing a new alternative to lighting that is very economical.


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## leveldrummer (May 27, 2005)

hey keri, if the guys from ice cap need another tank to do "studies" on, let him know that there is a young man in georgia that is more than willing to put his lights on my tank. hehe


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## Reefneck (Oct 15, 2005)

leveldrummer said:


> hey keri, if the guys from ice cap need another tank to do "studies" on, let him know that there is a young man in georgia that is more than willing to put his lights on my tank. hehe


Hehehe, As you can imagine he has been flooded with Volunteers. 

May need some in the future for other products but he's covered on the LED's.

More about lighting: 
T5 +: higher par than both vho and mh per watt = greater intensity
last longer and use less electricity = cheaper to run and replace 
less heat produced = less water evaporated which extends the life to your RO/DI unit and less $$ to cool your home
T5 -: currently the actinic bulbs made aren't on par with vhos (although uri i think is coming out with a new line soon)
better for tanks 24" deep or less

MH+: "shimmer lines"...nuff said
great for tanks greater than 24"

MH-: must replace every 6-12 months (depending on bulb and usage)=more $$
require actinic supplementation for daylight/dusk effect (you can use 20k bulbs but only get "on" or "off")
require more wattage=more electricity=more $$
produce more heat = higher water temps = fans/chillers almost required (more so in southern states) = more $$ in one form or another (added electricity, cost of chiller, more evaporation etc.)


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## Osiris (Jan 18, 2005)

20k is too blue for my likings, i squared up two tanks right next to each other before, one with 10k and atnics, other was 14k, the 14k, looked amazingly better, doesn't need atnic supplements either 

I added on streetglow neo-blue's for moonlighting effects, does pretty well


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## leveldrummer (May 27, 2005)

so how do t-5's range in price against mh and pc??


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## Purple-Tang (Oct 21, 2006)

I need some advice, guys. A friend of mine selling his metal halide systems. He has 2 ballasts, each capable of supporting 2 bulbs. One ballast supports 2 bulbs of 250 watts, totalling 500 watts, selling for $225. The other one supports 2 bulbs of 400 watts, totalling 800 watts, selling for $260. I am planning to get the 800 watts ballast. I havent done any research into it yet, just looking to see the range for metal halides from those who have experience in it. Currently using VHO, but those arent so good, at least I thought so, so planning in getting metal halides. Cheeseboy, I am sorry to be asking this in your thread, just thought it might be convenient to ask here, since its a similar thread. Thanks, guys.


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## Damon (Jan 18, 2005)

T5 will run about the same as VHO. The bulbs themselves are cheaper but you require many more bulbs to do the job. Their compact design allows for just this. I'm a huge fan of VHO as they produce less heat than MH and you can still get 8 of them over a 75 gallon tank. Plenty of light for anything you want. URI models also have built in reflectors (soon to be added to the T5 HO hopefully). In short, T5HO, VHO or MH are all ways to go. Depends on personal preference, Canopy style, and corals kept. MH can be too intense for some corals while others (clams come to mind) do much better with them. A T5 HO 48 inch bulb is 54 watts. A 48 (or 46.5) inch VHO is 110 watts. MH run anywhere from 175 and up per bulb.
A lot of planted tank enthusiasts use T5 but due to the color spectrum defficiency (they dont not readily produce the K range we like) they are not used as they could be. The same for VHO but in salt, its not a problem.


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## oddselection (Apr 30, 2007)

Go with t-5 or t-8 much much cheaper. Especially on the small end. I suggest not even getting a ballast setup if you are comfortable with some wiring and making a hood.

Go to Home Depot get three or four of the aquarium lights. (you may have to look around or even order more. They're made by GE and are UL tested for this use. Take the casing off of the lights, and there you are, ballasts to make your tank light! This should cost you <100-150 depending on the tank. 
On a 30gal, two should be enough for mushrooms and most simple soft coral (not leathers). Three to four should be enough to grow LPS coral for much cheaper than the other options.

For SPS, leathers, and clams you need to go halide, probably over 250W, upward of $500.

I should be making a DIY for the light soon. W/ pics.


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## Fishboy93 (Jun 11, 2005)

This thread is a year old. He hasnt been active since January... Also, 250 watt MH lights can be bought on Ebay for less than 125 and work fine. 500 is way out of proportion....


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## oddselection (Apr 30, 2007)

I have not looked at halides in over a year. Plus, I am a small tank guy


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## Fishfirst (Jan 24, 2005)

T-8's??? why in the world would you ever go with T-8's? Unless you don't want to grow anything but mushrooms or star polyps for the rest of your life? T-5's are ONLY good as HO (high output) in my opinion.


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## oddselection (Apr 30, 2007)

I've had success with t8s? I grew candy cane for quite a while then I got rid of it


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## Bear (Jun 8, 2006)

T8s would be fine if over driven. I don't remember where I saw the data, but in a ton of testing of different fluorescents T5HOs had the highest out put, even after overdriving the T8s and 12s.


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## Felicia (Jul 17, 2008)

Here's a helpful chart 

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=16+2151&aid=2707

I would go with Metal halides if I had the chance again.


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## Trout (Mar 16, 2011)

This has been very helpful. Thanks guys! Even though I don't understand some of the terminology. :{ The thing that bothers me most is "What do SPS and LPS mean?"


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## funlad3 (Oct 9, 2010)

Once again an old thread, but because it would be helpful to answer...

LPS = Large Polyp Stony coral. Their base is usually stone with large fleshy polyps. Ie. Euphyllias. (Or something like that.)

SPS = Small Polyp Stony. These are usually all hard coral with very small delicate fleshy polyps.

Today, I'm going to get a Montipora Capricornus (SPS) and try it under my high-power PC setup. We'll see how that goes. I think I can get it to work!


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## kay-bee (Dec 6, 2006)

Here's an example of an SPS coral

Stylophora (with coral polyps less than 2mm in diameter):









Here's an example of an LPS coral

Acanathasrea (with coral polyps about 1.5"+ in width):









SPS and LPS are more hobbyist terms rather than scientific terms. Also some SPS and LPS corals don't live up to the description (an LPS such as leptastrea has fairly small polyps, while an SPS such as hydnophora can have fairly large polyps). Also SPS and LPS corals can significantly differ in appearance from other corals in the same catergory, or even the same genus (such as montipora capricornus and montipora digita).


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