# What could be killing my females?



## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

Ok today I lost both my female mollies I don't know what is happening, they were fine when I looked in on them. One died while I was sleeping and now the only female left died while I was cleaning up the apartment, I find it strange that it's attacking only the females. What could it be? Any help would be appricieated.


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## Feathers (Dec 2, 2007)

Oh no... sorry for your losses...

I know that sometimes female mollies (when kept with males) can get stressed out and just die suddenly from that? I'm not totally sure though. Could you post your water information and stuff? Size tank, PH, Ammonia readings, Nitrates, Nitrites... that kind of stuff? Usually fish death has to do with water stuff. Also, once you let us know how your water is, were there any marks/growths on the fish you lost? Wounds or anything like that?


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*don't have the strips to do that*

I have a ten gallon tank that I have my fish in, not too many as I was told only a certain amount. Though the males and females appeared to be getting along, would not leave each others sides. I recently did a partial change, and did normally what I do. Though my heater doesn't seem to kick on when it goes below a certain level, so I got it to where it will stay on. But means I have to get up early cause it takes up to 82 or so. I didn't find any wounds on the mollies at all. Though right now i'm not sure if the dalmation one the one I just lost was the female. Had a slightly longer tail then the other. Though small and very thin, the other I don't know maybe it got too cold considering it's getting cold out. Should I move the tank?


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## Feathers (Dec 2, 2007)

Well, I also have my mollies in a 10 gal, so...hm!

I don't think that 82 is necessarily a _bad_ temperature, but if the heater only kicks in when the temperature is low and then jumps up to 82, that could potentially be a problem, as sudden temperature changes aren't good for the fishies.

Though, knowing more about what's going on with the water of your tank would be very helpful. How many fish do you have in there? Do you have a water test kit? Can you check the ammonia, PH, nitrates, and nitrite levels in your tank? If you don't have a test kit, definitely invest in one.

Also, how long has this tank been running? Is it a newer tank, or fairly established?


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

It could be water quality. The biggest fish often die first when water quality is poor (high ammonia, high nitrite) because they need more oxygen than smaller fish. In mollies the females are usually bigger. Did you change water after the first fish death? In a small tank like a 10g, one death from any cause (such as birthing problems) will cause an ammonia and nitrite surge that can kill other fish. The other possibility is disease, any disease that affects the gills can kill the big fish first for the same reason. Do your fish have any symptoms? Wait several weeks after the death of any fish before replacing it to give any disease time to manifest in your "healthy" fish.


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*Reply to both*

I will invest into a water test package when I get my cheque, though now one of my cory catfishes died as well, the mollies that died were infact smaller then the other two, that look bloated to me. So I don't know if it was infact my females that were killed first. I have five fish left altogether I had seven, two of the creamsicle mollies. And two dalmation mollies, two blood fins. And one red Platy that I was having problems with, though he/she made it through what it had. ANd is now eating and swimming again, though the heater now has the temp at 82 cause I had to turn up the heater cause of my room being a little cold dropped the water temp to 72 and dropping so I let it go through the night, it was a gradual increase. So that shouldn't have killed my cory. Maybe I need to do a partial change? I was told for a ten gallon tank not to for about a month, as I also have an oto in there.


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

> I was told for a ten gallon tank not to for about a month


This was bad advice. Esp. for a new tank. 10-30% weekly is good depending on fish load and your original fish count was on the heavy side. Because you have dead fish, I suggest 50% daily for 3 days and then go to 20% weekly. Make sure the incoming water is the same temp. or slightly warmer than the tank water and has dechlor added (unless you have a well). If you've added salt to the tank, add salt to new water. If the tank is new, don't gravel wash or replace filter media for a month. After than, use a gravel washer for your weekly water changes. 

IMO a dead fish is sign to change water because: 1)dead fish create ammonia 2)if fish dies of toxins in the water,a water change will dilute them, 3) if fish died of disease organisms in the water, a water change will dilute them, 4) if fish was killed by other fish, water change will dilute pheromones and disrupt aggressive behavior temporarily, esp. if accompanied by "rearranging the furniture".

If you are religious about water changes and feed lightly, you can skip the test kits. I'm gonna get flamed for this, but if you assume you have ammonia and nitrite, you don't have to measure it to get rid of it. Just keep changing water. 
Don't start treatment for disease until you know your water is clean.


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*Reply*

Well my ten gallon is a couple months old and all that, it was a petstore in the fish department that told me the water change, i'm taking my water in. So for now i'm merely putting the rest in with my little guppy he wont be eaten he's to big for that, though it will only be a few days before they get transfered back. SO for now they will stay in my smaller one until I am able to get it tested, then when i'm told what's wrong i'll do about a half change to quarter change of the water, I was doing it once a week for the longest time. And had no problems, indeed they were my females that died, along with a cory catfish.


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## Guest (Dec 10, 2007)

I believe you were overstocked to begin with. I can only guess that the water quality isn't very good because you had alot of fish to begin with. I would do water changes twice weekly for a couple weeks if you can't get your water tested soon, or find out ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates and then do water changes if you have any of the first 2.

Having your own test kit really helps when things are going wrong because you can check your water more often and do water changes as needed until the water gets back to where its supposed to be (0 ammonia and 0 nitrItes).

What size tank are you moving the fish to? I wouldn't advise moving the fish unless its a bigger tank. Maybe I misunderstood though.....

Do a 50% water change now and if you are going to get your water tested soon, go ahead and get a sample out before you change the water.

EMC gave you good advice and info. 

You may want start feeding every other day or so to reduce the waste in the tank which can also lead to ammonia.

What is your stock now?


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*Water tested*

Water was tested only thing that was effecting them was a high ph level, that could explain the killing of my three fish. Though they are in a slightly smaller tank, but they are doing fine in there. They replaced two of the fish that died, so I did a half change I distill my water before putting it in. Also got Ph decreaser to put in as well. No nitrates or anything in the water, so doing a half change now. Letting the boiled water cool before putting into the tank. Told to let it cycle with the ph decreaser for about 48 hours, they said the tank I have them in is fine. That it will only be a couple days max, if not a day. Though my female dalmation will be kept in the smaller tank, as she is extremely pregnant.

Stock:
Mollies: 4, 2 Dalmation, one female one male. 2 Creamsicle mollies, one male one female.
Red Platy: 1
Cory catfish: 2
Ghost shrimp: 5
Snails: 5
Blood fins: 2 one male one female.
Guppy: One male, though he's usually in a seperate tank. He's going to my nephew.


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## Guest (Dec 12, 2007)

Don't put in a pH decreaser! pH being "too high" doesn't kill fish......pH swings do. By adding a pH decreaser you are dropping the pH. It won't stay down and when you do water changes without adding more chemical, your pH will swing. 

Take my word for it.......the pH didn't kill your fish.

You are very overstocked IMO. Mollies get too large for a 10g. The cories, platy, bloodfins (which should be in a school) and guppy would stock the tank (shrimp and snails don't add much...). 

You should think about getting rid of some fish or getting another tank.

Your other tank is probably not cycled either.......did you have anything in it before now?

Its hard to believe you had no nitrates with that many fish in the tank. Did you change water before you took out a sample to test?


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## emc7 (Jul 23, 2005)

I second JOM. Do your research. Mollies like high pH. 7.5 - 8.5 is recommended but I'm sure they wouldn't mind 9.5. High pH doesn't kill mollies. Something else did. Its nice that the LFS replaced your dead fish, but I wouldn't trust anything they tell you.


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*ok*

the other tank they are in now has been used in the past, I had a couple fish when I was just starting. So I had that one, Ph balance was apparently too high for the fish to handle, they weren't stressed by the males. They swam together, the blood fins swim together, they are two of my original fish. Same with my platy, thing is they have a lot of room to swim around in the ten gallon. Which some will be going back into, minus one. My pregnant molly, she's being seperated for the fact that she looks like she's due any day.


Though one of the cory's is going to my nephew as is the guppy.


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## trashion (Aug 24, 2007)

keep in mind that solitary cories don't do well at all. i had a cory a couple of years ago, and he became less and less active and died. they're shoaling fish and should really be in a groups of at least three.


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*Cories*

Well I shall keep the two I Have, and purchase a few more, though the tank I Have for my nephew is only about a gallon or two in size, so I don't know if the two cories would be a good idea as he's only getting my guppy. I lost one of my cories which I didn't bother replacing yesterday as I still have two, along with an oto algae eater.


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## trashion (Aug 24, 2007)

keep the cory in your tank.


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*Cories*

Alright shall keep the cories, i'll buy a younger one for my nephew. Though when my female that is pregnant is by herself I need to split them up for a little while.


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## trashion (Aug 24, 2007)

why not just give him the guppy? any age cory will still grow too big for that tank.


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*reply*

Might just give him either my algae eater or a couple of my shrimp.


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## Guest (Dec 12, 2007)

A 1 or 2 gallon tank is not big enough for much more than some shrimp. I would setup a larger tank than that for your nephew if you are giving him any fish. A 10g would be the smallest I'd put cories in and really most of them need much bigger than that. Depending on the species you have, they could get 2.5 to 3" in size and thats too large for a 10g IMO. 

What size tank are the fish in now? I wouldn't keep any of them in a tank 5g or smaller, unless its around 5g in size and that would be for just your pregnant female. Everything else needs to go to the 10g or another tank (of adequate size).

I wouldn't listen to anything your LFS is saying to you, as it seems they've led you down the wrong path with alot of your fish choices and tank size. Also, their info about cycling the tank isn't correct and they are most likely the reason for alot of the fish deaths.

Here's an article on cycling a tank: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/cycling.php.

It would really benefit you to have your own test kit.

Do some water changes in the 10g and move the fish back over. Don't add anything except dechlorinator. Do regular water changes (atleast weekly) of 40-50% until you can get rid of some fish.

If you can't get a tank of atleast 20g for your current fish, you'll need to give some of them away to the LFS or someone who has atleast a 10g tank. You have fish that will outgrow a 10g and fish that prefer a larger group than what you are keeping them in. The Cories and Bloodfins would be much happier with a proper school.


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## trashion (Aug 24, 2007)

i want to add, don't boil the water before using it in your tank. while yes, that does get rid of the chlorine, it also gets rid of other important gases-like OXYGEN!! that definitely could be a reason as to why your fish aren't doing so great.


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## tikotaz (Nov 20, 2007)

*mkay*

Well I am not sure, the boiling of the water seems to be helping them as of late, it was before I did it that I had a lot of problems. Though they are doing fine, except for my platy, I found out I need to get a second one, this way the one will come out of hiding. Planning on getting one as well as another tank and stuff plus the water testing ones. The six in one that they use, it's what they used to find out what was wrong with the water. I was surprised as well, though I use this aqua safe tank conditioner. It seems to work really well in keeping the nitrates down, the decreaser actually helped. They aren't dying on me now. Though I only have to put it in every once in awhile when the ph is way too high. Though yes I find it odd that with that many fish in the tank there were no nitrates and all that. But they have alot of room to swim in the tank, don't think that I need to get a bigger tank just yet. The male mollies have gotten as big as they can get. The females are smaller then them, the cories are still growing a little, they are the spotted cory catfishes. They apparently only get to a certain size. Tough for when I get one of my fish that is pregnant again, i'll make sure to have a 5 gallon or so with lots of plants and hiding spots. With the air filter pump that blows bubbles from the bottom. The one I have doesn't really, pump oxygen into the smaller tank I was using. Though I plan on getting one with a better way of putting in oxygen, and as for boiling the water. I get oxygen put in with the filter pump that I have in the tank, it's like a water fall but you can see the oxygen bubbles that go into the water and oxygenate it again.


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## Guest (Dec 15, 2007)

Its best to save up for a liquid test kit. The strips are not very accurate. There was someone on this site lately who had been using strips and registered no ammonia.......they switched to a liquid kit and found out they did indeed have some ammonia in the tank. The strips are no good.

Nitrates don't kill fish........unless they are super high. Nitrates can get well over 40ppm and fish will live. Ammonia and nitrItes kill fish.

Just because the fish can swim around in the tank doesn't mean they have enough. Cories really need more room than a 10g can provide them. Mollies get pretty large as well and would enjoy more room, especially if you ever have any aggression.

Most of the spotted cories get around 2.5"....some get around 3" depending on the species. Thats too large IMO to have a proper school and space in a 10g.


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