# help meeeeeeeeee!!!



## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

sup im a noobie to fresh water fish

first does anyone Know of a good 5-7 fish tank? and what to stock it with? please include temp and water stats
and also dont waste time explaining how to fix the tank water perfect for fish cause i all ready read bout it


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## fish_doc (Jan 31, 2005)

A ten gallon would be good for 5-7 small fish. But if you are looking for bigger fish you would need a bigger tank.
Tell us a bit about what kind of fish you would be intrested in. Big, Small, Active, Colorful, Bottom, mid, top swimmers, do you want to try and breed fish. Once we know a bit more we can give you suggestions on fish that will hold your attention and be more enjoyable to you


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## Damon (Jan 18, 2005)

A budget would be helpful to know also.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

as a budget i have about $120 to go with. im intrested in cory catfish and some active comunity fish and i perfer not to breed them.


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## Guest (Apr 26, 2006)

I think you could set up a 29g tank for about $120. That is a good size tank to start off with. Its not too hard to maintain and it will be more stable than a 5 or 10g tank.

You could have a school of rasboras or tetras (glowlights, von rios, lemons, black neons to name a few), a centerpiece fish (gourami, ram, smaller peaceful cichlid), and some bottom feeding cories. If you wanted you could have two schools of smaller tetras or rasboras.

Thats a lot more than 5-7 fish, but you could stock it slowly and gradually increase the numbers.

Having cories and tetras, you will need more than 5 in a school. You could have about 8 cories and 8 tetras in a school. If you choose smaller tetras and go with one kind, you could have 10-12.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i forgot to say i also have limited space so thats why id like a5-7 tank.

and any good easy to care for plants out there?


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## ron v (Feb 24, 2005)

What is a 5-7 tank?


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## SueM (Jan 23, 2004)

A 10 gal tank with 4 Panda cories, and 6 Choprae Danios
My personal favorites


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

and i also ment $120 for a tanka food, decor, plants ect.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

writing error 5-7 gallon tank and no a in tank


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## Guest (Apr 26, 2006)

The only fish I would put in a 5-7 gallon tank is a male betta. That size range is too small for anything else IMO.

If you go with a 10g tank, you could have a small school of Harlequin Rasboras and a male betta.

I don't put cories in a 10g. I think they are too active and deserve atleast a 20g long tank. The only bottom feeder suitable for a 10g tank IMO is ottos. They eat algae, so you would have to have some algae established first.

10g tanks are 24 inches long...so maybe you can find space for one. You could put more fish in it than a 5-7g tank.


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## SueM (Jan 23, 2004)

Pigmy cories would do great, but not in a 5-7 gal


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## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

What about dwarf puffers? I'm just asking....not suggesting actually.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

any frogs out there for 5 gallon tanks?


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

I think if you have a budget of $120 then you should atleast get a 10 gallon tank. You can get a kit from Walmart with a heater, filter, and lights for 50 dollars. And most likely it will end up costing you less than your 5 gallon tank when it's all said and done.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

thanks fishnoob i will check their web site now


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## bpswim90 (Oct 30, 2005)

As far as fish go for a 5-7gal, maybe some dwarf rasboras and a couple ottos... not sure what else would fit.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i checked and only found 6 gallon tank as the largest.... im thinking they have larger one instore?


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

hey i found i 12 gallon tank for $74 is that good?


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

nero66 said:


> i checked and only found 6 gallon tank as the largest.... im thinking they have larger one instore?


Yeah... in the store (granted your's has a pet's section which I'm sure they all do) they will have their "Aqua Tech" kits. I have bought one for every tank that I have made, and I find they are pretty reliable and cost effective. 

In the store they sell a 10 gallon tank (make sure you get the tropical fish one, called "deluxe." This one comes with a heater and flourescent lights). This runs 50 dollars. They also have a 20 gallon tall tank, which isn't too bad for around 74 dollars, and a 29 gallon tank (what I purchased and I love it) for 95 dollars. Keep in mind you will still have to buy gravel for these tanks and filter pads (they only give you one in the kit). The gravel (at Walmart) will cost you 10 dollars per 25 pound bag, and the filters will general cost about 7 - 10 dollars per 6 cartridges. 

I like the 10 gallon kits, although once you buy it you are going to wish you went bigger to buy more fish and such, but it is your dime, and your space. Just giving a heads up. In one of my 10 gallon tanks I have 6 glowlight tetras and one dwarf fire gourami (only about an inch right now) and that's pretty much as much as I can put in the tank. If you have any other questions let us know.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

thank for the info, i guess i will get a 20 then after i rearange my desk. and just so i know what is the most common smallest cory catfish and what comunity fish go good with it and what other fish will work with it?


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

and what kind of fish food to get & what kind of testing kits


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

I can't really tell you what the smallest cory catfish is. I do know that pretty much every community fish should be able to live with them (ie tetras, dwarf gouramis, swordtails, etc).

For fish food, you would want to get a variety of flake, brine shrimp, and perhaps vegtables from time to time. Look up information on the specific fish that you are getting in your tank and you can find the food that they like. You will probably have happier fish if you switch up their food every day so that they have something different to eat (plus they will have better colors). 

As for the testing kit, here on the forum a lot of people recommend the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Brand (butchered that name) master test kit. In the kit I would imagine you would get liquid tests for pH, high pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, kH, gH, and perhaps something else. Although these kits usually run approximately 25 - 30 dollars and might put you over your budget.


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## Guest (Apr 26, 2006)

> just so i know what is the most common smallest cory catfish and what comunity fish go good with it and what other fish will work with it


It all depends on your area and what's available. In my area none of the smaller cories (pygmy, habrosus, and panda) are readily available. I've been able to locate pandas at a couple places, but not the other two. False Juliis (corydoras trilineatus) are pretty small and are pretty common here.

I think you should go look at your local fish stores and see what kinds they have. Also check out the tetras and rasboras and see what your options are. We could name off fish all day, but if you can't get them, it doesn't help you much.

Most kinds of tetras will work with cories. I will name a few: neons, black neons, glowlights, rummynose, head and tailight, von rios (flames), black phantom, and lemons. That isn't all the different kinds though. Harlequin, lambchop, and scissortail rasboras are also some options.

I would get the 20g (long) if you have room. It has more surface area so it would be better than the high. I would see what kinds of fish are available in your area. For the 20g I would choose one type of schooling fish (tetras or rasboras) and have about 10 of that kind. You can choose your cory type and have 8-10 depending on what type you choose. I would pick some type of centerpiece fish: bolivian ram or some type of gourami.

Once we know what kind of fish you are interested in and can get, then we can tell you what is compatible.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i know this is a weird Q but how does a gravel vacuum works?


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## Sprite42 (Mar 10, 2006)

LOL, it works like a siphon. Use a turkey baster (NOT your mouth) to get the suction going.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

thanks that ceared some stuff up


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

sorryspelling error


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## fish_doc (Jan 31, 2005)

With a gravel vac you push the rigid plastic tube into the gravel and the suction created by the water flow up the tube will pull debris out of the gravel up the tube and out of the tank. Plus it is healthy to loosen the gravel ocasionally. Just be sure to alternate sides of the tank and only vaccum about 1/2 the tank at a time. By only doing part of the gravel during each cleaning you help keep the benefical bacteria in the aquarium while pulling out the bad stuff.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

thanks again


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

JustOneMore20 said:


> I would get the 20g (long) if you have room. It has more surface area so it would be better than the high. I would see what kinds of fish are available in your area. For the 20g I would choose one type of schooling fish (tetras or rasboras) and have about 10 of that kind. You can choose your cory type and have 8-10 depending on what type you choose. I would pick some type of centerpiece fish: bolivian ram or some type of gourami.
> 
> *****what type of gourami would be best?


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## Guest (Apr 27, 2006)

If you go with the 20g, then you could have a dwarf gourami, a honey gourami, chocolate gourami, thick lipped gourami, or sparkling gourami (need a planted tank, with fish of similar size). The sparkling gourami stays really small...that's why it needs to be kept with fish more its size (1.5 in).

I would go with the honey gourami, if it was my tank. It stays small (about 2 inches) and is more peaceful than the dwarf gourami. I would pick only one type though because in an unplanted tank, gouramis can be aggressive towards one another.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

well im going to plant it. any common fast growing plants you know of?


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

You can get some Apongeton bulbs from Walmart... they sprout pretty quickly. I have some Anarchis in the back of my tank and that grows really fast. Also some people have said that Water Wisteria grows like weeds as well. All these are beginner plants and usually don't need CO2 injections or fertilizer. 

Keep in mind though that a 20 gallon long is a lot more expensive then a regular 20 gallon that comes in a kit from Walmart. This is why I didn't suggest it. I'm not positive but I'm pretty sure the 20 gallon long will run you around 50 - 70 dollars for just the tank itself... then you have to buy the hood, filter, heater, and whatever else you need all on your own.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

thanks ill check them out

and the tank kit i guess ill get the normal size 20gal


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## Guest (Apr 28, 2006)

> I'm pretty sure the 20 gallon long will run you around 50 - 70 dollars for just the tank itself


It depends on the fish stores around you.

I got my 29g...just the tank, for $35. I think the 20L tank was about $30 or maybe it was $35. I got mine at PetSmart.

I don't get the kits because I like to choose my own filters, heaters, lighting and other equipment. I don't like the whisper filters that come in the kits. Its really up to you what to get. It all depends on how much you have to spend. To plant a 20g tank with medium light plants, you will need to upgrade the lighting....which will cost more $$. Or you can stick to low light plants like java fern, anubias, and java moss.

Wisteria is a good fast growing plant to start out with. It does like medium light though, so it will grow slower when you have less light. 

When you buy the kit, it is good that it comes with a hood and lights already. But, if its a 20H then the light won't penetrate to the bottom that well, and having less light already, you have to stick to the low light plants.

I'm not trying to scare you away from planting the tank. Live plants look sooo much better than fake ones. It also improves your water quality. I'm just warning you that you will probably want the medium light plants because there are more to choose from and some are prettier than java fern and anubias. It takes more money to plant a tank, most of the time. I know it has me. You have to buy higher watt lights to get the plants you want, especially in a bigger tank.

If you went with the 10g kit, then you could get the one that has incandescent lights (not fluorescent) and change out the bulbs. That is the cheapest tank to get good lighting on. I grow medium and low light plants in my 10g. But then your stocking is more limited.

Its up to you though....decisions, decisions.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i just checked the closest pet shop for corys. only because it was closing it -2 min :mrgreen: 

spotted 2.49
emerald 4.49
pepper 3.49
green 2.49
albino 2.49

I'm going with green because the price and color choice and they were youngest 

i did not get a good look at the other fish  so if you recommend any name like three different types o.k


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

and for the tank kit stuff im o.k with that limited choice. its my first tank come on.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

of plants i mean


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

if the scissortail rasboras are the ones with the split tails im geting those to but, how many?:neutral:


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## bpswim90 (Oct 30, 2005)

Generally for shoaling fish, 6 is good, 10 or more is great. The more the merrier. 

Also, there's an edit button under your post, so if you want to add something to your post or fix an error you can just edit instead of having to keep posting.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

thanks im a noobie as you know


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## Guest (Apr 28, 2006)

After looking at the Scissortail Rasbora's profile, I see they get big for rasboras (about 5 inches). I would choose something else, since these get so big. You could fit 6 in the 20g, I think. I know more is better, but these guys get pretty big.

Harlequin Rasboras are small, and a nice red color, if you can find them. They are usually inexpensive also. You could have a nice school of 10 of them.

For the cories, I think you should get the spotted ones. Most likely, these are False Juliis, or corydoras trilineatus. Are the grayish, with lots of black spots? These guys stay a little smaller than the others (about 2 inches). You want to stick to smaller fish. The emerald, green, peppered, and albino cories get around 3 inches. With limited space, I would stick with the smaller guys.

If you can find them, the smallest cory types are: Salt and Pepper (corydoras habrosus), Pygmy Cories, and Panda Cories. You could have more of these guys, since they stay around 1 inch or so.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i think the ones in the store were tetras.......so who knows ill check them out today cause im getting my tank!!!!!! :fun:


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

nero66 said:


> i think the ones in the store were tetras.......so who knows ill check them out today cause im getting my tank!!!!!! :fun:


Lol I know that feeling. Congratulations.


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## Guest (Apr 28, 2006)

Sometimes scissortail rasboras are called scissortail tetras. There may be some kind of fish that has a scissor like tail though....who knows.

Congrats on getting the tank!


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

just set up the stand today.  

should be up and running in about 3 days. :fun: 
anybody want to give me any tips please do.


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

One thing that I messed up on when I bought my first tank was that I did not let the heater sit in the water for an hour or so before turning it on. That messed up it's internal thermometer and now when I set it to a certain temperature, it doesn't go to it, but a different one. Not really a problem, you just need to know how to adjust it. Other than that, just make sure you just have your tank working (filter, heater, and lights are working for a day) and then you should be able to start cycling your tank. Good luck.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

thanks greatly appreciated:mrgreen:


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

JustOneMore20 said:


> After looking at the Scissortail Rasbora's profile, I see they get big for rasboras (about 5 inches). I would choose something else, since these get so big. You could fit 6 in the 20g, I think. I know more is better, but these guys get pretty big.
> 
> Harlequin Rasboras are small, and a nice red color, if you can find them. They are usually inexpensive also. You could have a nice school of 10 of them.
> 
> ...


*****on the price tag thing it said it full length was 2in with tail? who's right here, you or the tag


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

Do a google search on your Rasboras. Usually the pet store is wrong. People have had problems with this in the past, and had serious problems with overgrown fish in their small tanks. I would go by whatever profiles you can find online. Do a search and compare a whole bunch and take the answer that appears the most. And usually when they measure fish size they do not include the fins.


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## Guest (May 3, 2006)

I searched the web and found everything from 2.5 to 6 inches. Most of the sites I looked at said 5 inches. That is for Rasbora trilineata...or the scissortail rasbora.

Well, you said the store had them labelled as scissortail tetras...but they are actually rasboras, cyprinids...not characins like tetras...so do some research on your own.

If they get anywhere close to 3 or 4 inches...I wouldn't put them in a 20g tank. I would look into a smaller type of schooling fish.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

:-( those fish looked cool


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## toadstoool (Apr 29, 2006)

fishnOObs right I started with a 5 gal it wasn't big enough so i got a 10 then a 29 still not big enough so I got a55 then another 55 and still have them all if my wife would let me I would get another 55. You will find space.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

what about Black Neon Tetras are they o.k:?:


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## Guest (May 4, 2006)

Yes black neons would be perfect. They stay pretty small.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

great they look cool and arn't as well known as the neon


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

what kind of fish foods should i get for the tetras, catfish, and gourami? id like to know some good brands to.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i just did some water tests here they are 

ammonia
.25
Ph
7.2
tap waters Ph
6.2
is the ammonia suppose to be that low (i put the ammonia in in the morning)

are these good for the fish im going to get?


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## Guest (May 10, 2006)

I think when you add ammonia directly, you want it to be about 2-3ppm...I think. I'm not so familiar with fishless cycling. I would think that it should be higher than .25. Usually you want to put in enough to give you 2-3ppm. You should add it daily and check the level until you can add the same amount and get a zero reading. 

pH looks fine for your fish choice.

I use flakes for my tetras. I use OSI flakes. If you can't find that brand, Tetra is a good brand. I use Wardley sinking shrimp pellets for my cories. Most food brands are pretty good. I have tried alot of different brands and my fish like them all.


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

JustOneMore20 said:


> I think when you add ammonia directly, you want it to be about 2-3ppm...I think. I'm not so familiar with fishless cycling. I would think that it should be higher than .25. Usually you want to put in enough to give you 2-3ppm. You should add it daily and check the level until you can add the same amount and get a zero reading.


Keep it at 3 ppm, and when it the ammonia is giving a 0 reading in about a few hours then your done with that stage... you'll know when your done when you aren't getting any nitrites and have about 20ppm of nitrates. Then just do a water change to get rid of that and you should be good to go.

As for the food, you might also want to pick up some brine shrimp for the tetras and the gourami. It's nice to change up their diet so they aren't eating the same thing every day. It's better for their immune system, and will tend to show better colors.


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## Guest (May 10, 2006)

> when it the ammonia is giving a 0 reading in about a few hours


It will take more than a few hours to cycle the tank. More like a few weeks. Keep adding the ammonia daily. Start by adding enough to get the ammonia to around 3ppm. Add the same amount every day, no matter what the reading is. The ammonia will spike and then eventually nitrites will spike. Keep adding the same amount of ammonia until ammonia and nitrite readings go to zero and you have measurable nitrAtes. Then you are done. Do a water change and go get some fish. Keep adding the ammonia until you get the fish. You have to keep feeding the bacteria. Right before you add the fish do the water change.


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

I know the tank is going to take a few weeks to cycle. I'm saying that after you add the 3ppm of ammonia, in a few hours if it reads 0 then it's cycled.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

just tested it before and after adding 12 drops of pure ammonia and these are the results 

before .0 
after .0-.25 not exactly .0 or .25 

any body know a formula to get the right amount of ammonia


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## Guest (May 10, 2006)

Here are some websites on fishless cycling:

Number1
Number 2
Number 3
Number 4  
**Scroll down to the Fishless Cycling part.

That should be enough for now.....so get reading!

From what I gather by skimming over these sites, there is not real formula to get the right about of ammonia to register. You just have to keep adding and testing until you get an ammonia reading between 2ppm and 5ppm. Make sure your ammonia is free of surfactants, scents, and additives. If you shake it and it foams....don't use it. You don't want foam.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

# 1 semd best i put 2 tsp and tested 1 hour later and read 4.0 how great!


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## Guest (May 11, 2006)

Great. I'm glad I could help.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

today i added the same amount and the test read 7! should i add the same tomorrow or let it lower then add more


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## Guest (May 13, 2006)

Keep adding the same. Its going to rise and fall. I've read fishless cycling articles that say add enough to get it up to 8ppm...even though most people don't do that. If it gets super high...like around 10 or more...then I would think about cutting the dose a little...but for now, keep adding the same amount. Since there are no fish in there, its ok for it to be high.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

:help: me this is really freaking me out there was a tiny bug on the glass pane! it was about 0.5cm the body was roundish with a head also round with small antenna the natural thing i did was fish is out with a net and checked the tank for more was this the right thing to do and what was that!


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i was just reading through a fish book and it said new plants some times bring baby snails so i guess i messed up right? (I'm doing fish-less cycle)......

:rip: little snail i never knew


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## fishn00b (Jun 10, 2005)

Snails are pretty hard to keep out of your tank when you are buying live plants. Usually they are Malasian Trumpet Snails (MTS), but there are other hitchhikers that come along for the ride. I wouldn't worry too much about the snails when you are doing a fishless cycle. I don't think it affects it too much. Just keep up with your cycling and you should be fine.


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## Guest (May 15, 2006)

Yeah I wouldn't worry about the snail. I have learned that with live plants, its almost certain they will bring in snails. Don't worry about removing it either. I am a snail killer myself. Once you have a couple in there and they start reproducing like mad, you will want to get rid of them. I have snails in all 4 of my tanks (the hospital tank too) and I never wanted any of them. Once one batch of live plants brings them in and you move plants to different tanks, you will have them in all.


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## Guest (May 15, 2006)

You could also have Guppies.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

TessaAndFishies said:


> You could also have Guppies.


*****i think i was a snail hence no fins.........

so i guess I'm getting:
spotted Cory catfish
neon black tetras
and bolivian rams or dwarf gouramis (if thereout or stock)

but....
how many? fyi i have a 20gal high

:fish: :fish: :fish::-D:fish: :fish: :fish:


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## Guest (May 15, 2006)

I would go with:

8-10 black neons
6 cories
1 bolivian ram or dwarf gourami

I would keep a pair of gouramis for sure. I also don't think I would keep a pair of rams. You would have to make sure you got a male/female pair. I am not sure how aggressive they are if they breed. Some cichlids are pretty aggressive when they breed and may hurt your cories.

If you heavily plant the tank, then I would suggest a pair of rams....but only then.

Do you know the scientific name of the cories you want? There are alot of spotted cories and some get bigger than others. If the type you want is a smaller type, you could have 8 instead of 6.

Corydoras trilineatus, Corydoras sodalis, Corydoras julii (rare) are a few of the spotted types.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

so i can have have anywhere between 15 and 20 fish with those choices.....

 kewl fishy:fish: fishy:fish: fishy:fish: fish


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## Guest (May 16, 2006)

Um... I was talking about in your tank. You must have move up from a 5-7g tank, right?


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

*turtle feed*

:evil: yes i stated that in my last post o.k:evil:

:evil: and no thank u very much i hate guppys and see them only good as feeder fish:evil:


  evil side sorry


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## Guest (May 16, 2006)

> so i can have have anywhere between 15 and 20 fish with those choices.....


Yes, but the number of cories depends on the type you want and how big they get. I would stick to the smaller types, if you can find them. They are Pygmy cories, Salt and Pepper (or Habrosus) cories, Panda cories, and false Julii cories (trilineatus). 

I don't think a 20 high is very long, is it? Isn't it like 24 inches? That's not alot of surface area....so sticking to the smaller cory types would be best.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i checked ammonia at off the charts ,nitrites today at .50 and nitrate at 5 :razz: .......

so what do i do now?


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## Guest (May 19, 2006)

Keep doing the same things. Ammonia should be coming down soon. Having 5 nitrAtes is a good sign. Things are moving along nicely.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

heres a question if the water evaporates filling it with plain tap water o.k


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

what bout pearl gouramis one 2 be exact


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## Guest (May 22, 2006)

> heres a question if the water evaporates filling it with plain tap water o.k


Make sure you add some dechlorinator at the same time. Just a little bit though.

I think Pearls will get too big for a 20g. I would stick to a dwarf or honey gourami.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

could i get a sub-species of the dwarf?


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## Guest (May 22, 2006)

Sure, just make sure it stays pretty small (like under 3 inches).


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

these are my readings can i get fish now?
ph=6.4
nitrite=2.0
ammonia=1.0
i cant measure the nitrate cause i put in plant food....

if not can i just get BIO-SPIRA and do it that way instead?


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i got my fish like two weeks ago when my tank was finished cycling 
8 Cory catfish
9 black neon tetras
1 gourami
and the question is about the tetras. they always stay at the bottom of the tank they never go up for food they just wait for the fiter to blow it down. i have considered it ether the heat from the light or there is no way to be safe or covered please help


and i lost one tetra to over stress:rip:


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## tonkstoy2003 (Jun 12, 2006)

I picked up my 10 gallon starter kit at wal-mart *in-store* It was $50.00 and did have the filter, heater, hood and light etc.. they have up to a 55 gallon in store. Hope you find what you're looking for..


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## Guest (Jun 13, 2006)

As long as the fish are eating, its fine. Some fish like to hang out near the bottom. My neons do. They come to the top sometimes though. Maybe they just need to get used to the tank. Do you have any decorations or plants to make them feel secure?


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i have a stump thing that goes half way up the tank a melon sword plant that also goes half way 3 dwarf hair grass plants and one water lily bulb....

also they go around the entire tank when the lights are off


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

:rip: :rip: :rip: :rip: :rip: :rip: 
six six i lost six catfish why god why did you make me dump all that algae killer why

what can i replace them with from the brasil region 

and come on the only one that doesn't die gets a bent tail


:fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish: :fish:


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## Guest (Jun 22, 2006)

I would go with some smaller cories, like Pygmy or Habrosus...but those tend to be more sensitive to water conditions.


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## book_em_danio (Jun 12, 2006)

nero66 said:


> :rip: :rip: :rip: :rip: :rip: :rip:
> six six i lost six catfish why god why did you make me dump all that algae killer why
> 
> what can i replace them with from the brasil region
> ...


I have not read the entire thread... but let me get this straight... you had Ammonia @ 1 ppm and considered the tank cycled? You dumped over 20" of fish into a 10 gallon tank and these were delicate fish like black neon tetras? 
Once everything is settled down (died), restart with something else, like white clouds. They are *hard* to kill. 6 would be appropriate for a 10 gallon tank. I'd be more than happy to guide you to success with something basic.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

no the next day it came down to 0 i just forgot to tell


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## book_em_danio (Jun 12, 2006)

If you have a vacuum, I'd suggest a water change this weekend, about 25%. If you don't have a vacuum, get one. 
Let's try to save what's in there. Let's also try to do it with less chemicals. First, I'd add 1-2 rounded tablespoons of aquarium salt after the water change. I'd add one tablespoon and wait a day before adding a second, if I were to add a second at all. I'd add a tablespoon after every 2nd or 3rd water change, after at least 5 gallons came out. I keep a notebook for every tank so that I don't forget what I've done and when I did it.
This may finish the catfish, as cory's don't tolerate salt well, but most fish benefit from some salt. I'd say it's more important to save others. What the salt will do is stimulate slime coat growth. Slime coat is natural and will help protect them from ammonia and nasties in there. Whatever you do, don't add more fish! 1 rounded tablespoon per 5 gallons is a good amount to maintain.
You can find Aquarium Pharm brand salt in a pint milk carton size at Wal-Mart for about $1.50 it will last you for many years, as a little goes a long way.
I wouldn't worry about algae or anything else. I'd just get into a regimen of good housekeeping and let these fish survive a while. That means a 25% water change every 7-10 days. Use dechlorinator like Wardley Chlor Out or even better, use API Stress Coat to eliminate chlorine and also improve slime coat. 
After 3-6 weeks when the fish are thriving, we can address other issues. You can't cause great changes in the fish's environment rapidly. Imagine you are toasty warm inside in the winter. Somebody strips you naked and tosses you in the snow. What's going to happen? Most likely you will die. Same idea with fish. What if someone forced inappropriate medications down your throat in excess? Death is a real possiblilty. Same things with toxins like ammonia. I think of fish as these fragile naked beings, because let's face it, they are! Then they are forced to live outside their natural environment. This is hard enough. For them, you are God. You have absolute power over life and death for them. While good intentions say fix everything at once, that is impractical. Take it easy on them. This is the only way they will survive. Good luck.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

why no more fish i lost 7 fish i should be able to replace the same amount thats not in use right(in the future not now) and also the first thing i did after the spill was take out 50% the the water and replace it with dechlorinated water and i do change the water every week


and save what in there you suggested a method that you said would kill :|


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## msdolittle (Mar 4, 2006)

Awwwwwwwww, I'm sorry you lost your fishies..........


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

i lost the gourami


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## book_em_danio (Jun 12, 2006)

nero66 said:


> why no more fish i lost 7 fish i should be able to replace the same amount thats not in use right(in the future not now) and also the first thing i did after the spill was take out 50% the the water and replace it with dechlorinated water and i do change the water every week
> 
> 
> and save what in there you suggested a method that you said would kill :|


When talking about small fish like these, you should have no more than 1" of body per gallon of water. Fully grown, a black neon tetra has about 1.5" of body. Right now you have 9 surviving, 9x1.5" = 14.5" you are then very close to maximum. I thought you had a 10 gallon, but I see in your sig, it's a 20. Reading what I've read, I'd believe the lone surviving Cory is going to die soon. Not a high chance of survival. They don't take salt well. That will lower his chance to near 0, but at least 9 neons get to live. Sorry if that sounds cruel.
Once things are stable, you can add to the maximum 20". I'd hold off for now. I'd also consider no more cory's. They are delicate. They grow to 2.5-3". You couldn't sustain more than 2 more. I'd consider a pair of gouramis before cory's. That should bring you to 20" of fish assuming all the black neons survive.


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## nero66 (Apr 26, 2006)

but the thing is i cant find female gouramis anywhere and i cant get two males because they would fight over territory


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## book_em_danio (Jun 12, 2006)

No female gouramis? I'd look elsewhere. So all there is now are the 9 black neons. Maintain the tank. Let things settle down for a while. Perhaps some other fish easily available catches your eye? Harlequin Rasbora is a nice fish. You could school 4-5 of those and the 9 black neons.


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