# Weird noises from my tank, fish or filter?



## Plecostomus (Jul 31, 2006)

I'm fairly new to fish, so I don't know a lot about them. I have a 10 gallon Tank, with 2 Danios, 3 Tiger barbs, 2 Chineese algea eaters, 1 plecostomus, and a kuhli loach. Yes, I recently found out that this is a horrible combinaation of fish. Do any of these fish make noise? Or is it the filter? It's a Topfin Power filter 10.:help:


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## MaryPa (Jan 25, 2006)

It`s the filter, None of your fish make noises.


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## joe kool (Jan 24, 2005)

If it's a steady noise it's probably the filter. If it's every now and again (once or twice a day at the most) it very well could be the danios or kuli loach trying to swim "up-stream" in your HOB filter. 

I know you've probably been told but I'd lose the chinese algae eaters (if you like the style and coloration try a "simease algae eater" very similar looking but not nearly as aggressive and a string algae devistator to boot) as well as you pleco (providing it's the common pleco availabe at most LFS) at best in a 10 gal get a brushynose pleco and supplement with wafers and zuccini. Your common pleco will most likely already be too big for a 10 gal (if not will be in a very few months)


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

Both an SAE and a Bushnosed Pleco will get too big for your tank. Your only option for a 10gallon, really, are oto cats. Cute algae eaters .

You sound like you a fish change may already be underway, though, so I'll just suggest that you get rid of the barbs, the CAEs, and the pleco. You can increase the danios and the kuhli loaches and if you like barbs, get cherry barbs, apparently they are less nippy than other barbs.

I also think your noise is probably the filter. What kind of noise is it, though?


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## Puffer Pita (Jun 16, 2006)

Rubbernose and pitbull plecos are also a good option for 10g tanks, although somewhat less commonly available in many parts.


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## joe kool (Jan 24, 2005)

Zoe said:


> Both an SAE and a Bushnosed Pleco will get too big for your tank. Your only option for a 10gallon, really, are oto cats. Cute algae eaters .


Oto's will starve in a 10 gal unless you supplement them almost daily. They have veracious appetites! I suggested the brushy nose as then max out at 6" instead of FEET long like the common and if they get a female it's more like 3-4" normal. They are great tank cleaners and fairly adaptable. As long as their supplemented once a week or so they will do well. I can say with a degree of certainty that oto's won't do well in a tank of that size unless they have a very astute and observant caregiver that is strictly in tune with their needs and willing to cater to them. (I know I know ... you know so and so that has 40 of them in a 10 gal and their all doing great ... it's by and large the exception .. not the rule with oto's ... not so with he brushy nose) set folk up for success not failure


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## joe kool (Jan 24, 2005)

Boxermom said:


> Rubbernose and pitbull plecos are also a good option for 10g tanks, although somewhat less commonly available in many parts.



True ... they don't get quite as big as the brushy nose even  they can be a little choosier on water conditions, at least rubber nose in my experience anyway but if you can find them they would be a better choice than an oto. 

if you decide with brushy nose try and find one with really small "bristles" females have barely noticeable bristles until full adult and they are significantly less predominant that the male "trees" that sprout out of their noses LOL


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

> Oto's will starve in a 10 gal unless you supplement them almost daily. They have veracious appetites!


Well, naturally, one has to feed their fish...



> I suggested the brushy nose as then max out at 6" instead of FEET long like the common and if they get a female it's more like 3-4" normal


A bushy-nosed pleco is better than a foot-long pleco, of course, but 4"-6" is still really too big for a 10gal, (also considering the amount of waste a pleco produces). It would be okay for a while, but realistically, a 4" pleco is not an appropriate size for a well-stocked 10 gallon tank.



> (I know I know ... you know so and so that has 40 of them in a 10 gal and their all doing great ... it's by and large the exception .. not the rule with oto's ... not so with he brushy nose)


What's with the attitude? I was merely suggesting a fish that is a appropriate and can live just fine in a 10gallon. I would expect someone dedicated enough to be on fishforums.com to at least look into a fish before buying it and then decide whether they want one in their tank.

A fish that is too big for a certain-sized tank is not necessarily a better option just because it is easier to keep alive and needs to be fed less often.


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## locojay (May 22, 2006)

Before I moved I had 2 ottos in my 10g with 1 marble molly and 7 neon tetras for a little more than a year and they did great. I fed them each 1/4 of an algae wafer daily and did regular weekly water changes. When I moved a couple months ago it took me a little bit too long to get my tanks up and running so I lost 1 otto and a few of the other fish. If not for the move I'm sure they would still be doing fine.

If you decide to go with ottos I would go with 2. My otto just isn't the same without his buddy. He hides alot. The only way I get to see him these days if I drop in his algae wafer, turn off the lights in the room and sit accross from the tank for a little while, he'll come out to eat. When it was 2 of them they used to spend a lot more time out in the open. I'm going to go in search of a buddy for him again this weekend. I found some at a lps a couple weeks ago but there was too many dead fish in the tank for my liking so I didn't get any.


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## joe kool (Jan 24, 2005)

Zoe said:


> Well, naturally, one has to feed their fish...


My attitude??? 



Zoe said:


> A bushy-nosed pleco is better than a foot-long pleco, of course, but 4"-6" is still really too big for a 10gal


http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/species.php?species_id=48 although the Ancistrus species has MANY variaties the cheaper most commonly available variaty rarely exceeds 5" for an adult male. Big for a 10 gal yes but a better choice than the group of oto's (the prefer groups anyway ... brushy nose like it alone of with 1 of the oppisite sex at the most definately not reccomented for a 10 gal unless you are just breeding them and have no other fish ... still get a bigger tank  ) 


Zoe said:


> What's with the attitude? I was merely suggesting a fish that is a appropriate and can live just fine in a 10gallon. I would expect someone dedicated enough to be on fishforums.com to at least look into a fish before buying it and then decide whether they want one in their tank.


I mearly suggested a less needy alternate that would work just as well. and be more than happy as a single entity cleaning the tank. Single oto's aren't the most active thriving critters much like clown loaches. The latter part of my statement was simply becouse there's alway the exception to a rule ( we learned that in English right ) and theres' always someone some where thet it works for somehow. I simply addressed that and aknowledged it by saying it's doesn't work for everyone


Zoe said:


> A fish that is too big for a certain-sized tank is not necessarily a better option just because it is easier to keep alive and needs to be fed less often.


neither is a fish not reccomended for begginers and that should be kept in groups to shoal
http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/species.php?species_id=106
http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/species.php?species_id=105
http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/species.php?species_id=107

out side of that it's a great "sized" fish for a 10 gal unless you try and have a group of 5 or 6 and then you might as well have the bristle nose. 

Plecostomus,
There are MANY alternatives. Most of which aren't going to be a good fit in a 10gal tank honestly. Research is the best option but I believe it will lead you back to no real good fits. You can "make do" but your best bet would be to house a few tetras or a few dwarf cichlids and leave the algae cleaning to your glass scraper and what the fish eat. I'm not saying DON'T get an oto, but DO realize the needs they have especially being admittedly new to "fish" in general. That's why I recommended the brushy nose in the first place  I try to set folks up for success.


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## joe kool (Jan 24, 2005)

locojay said:


> Before I moved I had 2 ottos in my 10g with 1 marble molly and 7 neon tetras for a little more than a year and they did great. I fed them each 1/4 of an algae wafer daily and did regular weekly water changes. When I moved a couple months ago it took me a little bit too long to get my tanks up and running so I lost 1 otto and a few of the other fish. If not for the move I'm sure they would still be doing fine.
> 
> If you decide to go with ottos I would go with 2. My otto just isn't the same without his buddy. He hides alot. The only way I get to see him these days if I drop in his algae wafer, turn off the lights in the room and sit accross from the tank for a little while, he'll come out to eat. When it was 2 of them they used to spend a lot more time out in the open. I'm going to go in search of a buddy for him again this weekend. I found some at a lps a couple weeks ago but there was too many dead fish in the tank for my liking so I didn't get any.



I rest my case ... ALWAYS someone that has or is doing it  

He doesn't seem the same becouse they are shoaling (schooling) fish and like groups of 4-6 or more. kind of like your Neons or clown loaches. I never said it wouldnt' work ... just it wasn't the best choice for such limited tank space. Your empty 55 would be a great home for him and 4 or 5 new buddies 


Plecostomus,
in the end it IS your tank ... get what you want just know what you get may or may not like the conditions you provide by researching their needs


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

I never said that otos were a perfect choice for each and every one out there, just that it was a plausible option for a 10gallon. If you have something to add, then please do, but the attitude is not necessary, nor is the complete disregard other peoples' experiences or comments. It's as though you are resentful of someone who has success with otos. Perhaps it's not "exceptions" with someone keeping 40 in a 10 gallon tank, but rather, just proper fishkeeping.

Perhaps otos are one of those fish who always should have an asterisk. But frankly, they are better suited to a 10 gallon than an SAE. Or a 6" pleco. They may be more delicate, but what's wrong with that, if the keeper is prepared to be dedicated to their fishies? I would rather encourage proper fish care with an appropriate sized fish, than encourage someone to get fish that was obviously too large for their aquariums, just because that fish is easy to care for and forgiving of husbandry mistakes.


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## jasno999 (Oct 16, 2006)

I have see first hand a chineese algae eater make loads of noise. They typically come out more whne the lights are off and one night it sounded like a rat ws in the wall scratching at somehting. Every time I woudl turn the lights on it would stop. After I while I figured maybe it was the filter or somehting. SO I took a flash light into bed and shined it on the tank when I herd the noise.

Came to see that the algae eater was coming out of the water and suckign algae off the HOB filter where the water cascades into the tank. As he moved around and sucked on the filter it made a scratching noise. It was pretty loud too. So they can make noise it is jsut sort of indrectly created.


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

Hehe Jasno that's kind of funny! That would scare me, at first, not knowing what it was


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## locojay (May 22, 2006)

joe kool said:


> I rest my case ... ALWAYS someone that has or is doing it
> 
> He doesn't seem the same becouse they are shoaling (schooling) fish and like groups of 4-6 or more. kind of like your Neons or clown loaches. I never said it wouldnt' work ... just it wasn't the best choice for such limited tank space. Your empty 55 would be a great home for him and 4 or 5 new buddies
> 
> ...



OK, I'll be "ALWAYS" guy. I merely chimed in to say that not only is it possible but they don't add much work at all IMO. But yes they do require some dedication. With the pleco you might get away with skipping a water change once in a while but I wouldn't do that with the ottos.

I don't want to jack the post by getting into my 55g so let it suffice to say that I don't think the ottos will fit in with the stocking list I'm working on. I'll be posting a thread after doing some more of my own research.

Plecostomus,
I'd recommend that you just use an brush to scrape your glass for now, and take all your algae eaters back. Wait a few months. Hang out here on fishforums and do plenty of reading. Then you can make the right choice for you. You might even decide you want to go with a bigger tank that will open up your options a little bit. One general rule I've found to be true for success is: "Take your time, don't rush it."


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## joe kool (Jan 24, 2005)

I've seen teh CAE's actually swim all the way up into the HOB filters as well as smaller plecos getting into some of the bigger HOB like the aquaclear series. I wasn't trying to cause such a stir as i've said in other posts body language and voice tone and inflection are hard to "read" in the typed word. I'm really an easy going guy  but I'm not a colorful writer. I'm usually straight and to the point and that's constred as angry and opinioniated instead of an informed opinion. 

Zoe,
Although being on here is WAY more than most beginner fish keepers ever invest time wise in there fish so Plecostomus is already leaps and bounds beyond the average new fish keeper. It still rings true that most are doomed to less than a year and the tank will be taken down and sold at a yardsale after sitting in a garage or attic for many years empty or be this green square or rectangle in a corner that only has 1 fish left in it that gets fed once or twice a week and the only water change ever done is adding evaporated water back to the tank. 

I guess I tend to be overly conservitive when it comes to new folks and lead them to easier to keep with minimal input fish. 

Loco ... no offense man ... it just happened it was you this time


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

Of course. But you can't limit the information you give to people just because of what they may or may not do. By that logic, we should just stop selling every fish that needs to be fed every day and needs regular water changes and that has tank-size needs that must be respected.

You can't control all the people, all the time, by limiting information. All you can do is give them as much accurate information as possible and hope they do the right thing with it.


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## joe kool (Jan 24, 2005)

Zoe said:


> By that logic, we should just stop selling every fish that needs to be fed every day and needs regular water changes and that has tank-size needs that must be respected.



I agree 100% with this statement! I think you should have to prove you have a pond or 300+ gal tank (still too small really) to be able to buy a red-bellied pacu. I think that you should have to buy neon tetras by the 10's not in singles, along with many other shoaling fishes. I think that a care sheet should be given (or bought) with every different species sold unless you can pass a quiz about the needs of that fish (petco and several other chain stores sorta do this with reptiles and small animals already or at least has 1 or 2 page care sheets available for free) I think there should be a "beginner fish keeping class" given to all new tank buyers and you could "CLEP" the class if you are an experienced keeper. AND, I DANG sure think all employees that handle, care for, and sell aquatic critters should have mandatory classes and education educating them on the different critters, equipment, and products they are selling!

But, I've been told I'm a hard @$$ and expect too much of people :lol:


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## locojay (May 22, 2006)

joe kool said:


> Loco ... no offense man ... it just happened it was you this time


It's cool, none taken, just sharing opinions.


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## jasno999 (Oct 16, 2006)

locojay - I sort of agree and disagree with you at the same time. I hear what you are saying but it is a bit harsh. There are stupid people out there and they are going to be stupid no matter what we do. You could teach classes and give out fact sheets and these people would still do everything wrong. So why waste the time. Yeah it might help a few people out and it might save some fish and other pets. But at the same time it is sort of a freedom thing and allowing people to do what they want.

It is sort of like driving a car. You have to take tests to prove you can drive before they give you your license. At the same time people still get behind the wheel even when they don't have a license and there is no way to stop them unless you put them behind bars or follow them around all day to make sure they don't drive. We take that freedom away because people that can't drive can cause other humans injury and death. When it comes to pets society just does not put them on the same plane so rules like that do not exist.

However I have another two cents to throw on top of all of that. I think in many cases people in the hobby get too caught up in the so called "RULES" of the hobby. People tend to forget that life is variable and that rules are just something there as guidance in many cases. For example when it comes to corals we really don't know a whole lot about how they work. We have come to learn what is good and bad but we have only begun to scratch the surface. The same goes for a lot of other areas of the hobby. 

If people never tried new things and experimented "Broke the Rules" then we would never have gotten to where we are now. So sometimes I believe it is ok to not follow every rule. They are there to help and are great guidance but you don't always have to follow them to the T.


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## joe kool (Jan 24, 2005)

dood ... me thinks you may have been referring to my post so I'll comment. 

there are "stupid" people out there yes but I think as a whole they want to do what's best their just never told OR worse yet told wrong by some high school / college summer job teenager or retired guy that never has a tank in his life and trying to sound like an expert. Remember most of these LFS and almost all the chain stores pay these folks minimum wage ... maybe a tad more after a while or if they have certain experience BUT not much more so it's not worth it for folks like a lot of us. Just about every time I'm in my non-chain LFS store the younger workers that know me send customers to me or ask me questions the customers are asking. I'd work there part time but there’s no benefit really and I have other things I need to do with my time for what their offering. 10 or 15% off purchases and min wage or a dollar over I can't remember what he last offer was but I basically told'em I get cost and $X to XX an hour or I'll just keep being a part time customer 

There are always exceptions and also people that are "pioneering" different ways to do things. That's all and good but I don't want to be the guy trying to come up with a tank raised variety of discus that can handle tap water in Omaha Nebraska. Not only will you be killing a boat load of discus unless you are going to try a raise your own to breeding size you are going to waste a ton of $$ on breeder fish (for those of you that don't know the tap water out there usually hits in the 9's PH and is hard as a brick! mid range test kit is deep emerald blue and high range it the deepest purple I've ever seen :lol: That's where I got introduced to africans ... go figure) So you're right but to what cost, and as long as you can afford it AND live with what you know you're doing then it's on you ... I just think people should be more educated from the beginning so it IS on them to do the right thing and they at least have that choice.


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

I'm divided to. I mean, on the one hand, you don't want pacus and bala sharks to be available in petstores, especially if the clerks don't know anything and are going to allow anyone who thinks they are "cute" to buy them.
On the other hand, if someone wants to set up a 3000 gallon Pacu enclosure, then who am I to stop them?

You want to a limit on how badly people can mess up when it comes to other peoples' lives, or animals, or nature, whatever. Hence, airbags, speed limits, fences by cliffs, sidewalks, etc etc. But you cannot encapsulate people, either.


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## locojay (May 22, 2006)

jasno999 said:


> locojay - I sort of agree and disagree with you at the same time.



I think you're refering to joe kool. 

As far as educating people and limiting purchasing I doubt we'll see much happen in this area. What I would like to see happen is for any store that sells fish to be forced to supply CORRECT information on the fish they sell. We'll never be able to control what people do with the information but as it stands right now most people don't get the chance to make the right decision because they are misinformed. I think it should be illegal for LPS to list a 30g tank requirement for a bala shark. Yes there will be those who will still put that bala shark in a 10g but we would elliminate alot of it if there was at least the correct info.


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

This is true, locojay. I've met a lot of people who want to take good care of their fish, but they ended up with an angelfish in a 10 gallon because the petstore told them it was okay. Much of the time these people have an "well, it's done now, there's nothing I can do about" attitude - which is a bummer, but if they were properly educated in the first place, that would never have happened.
I would expect that most people, if told "this fish will grow 12" long and require a 90gallon tank, or it will die," would deter many people. After all, who wants to buy a fish that will die from improper husbandry?

I think it would be lovely if large chain petstores stopped carrying any fish that require particular care or a tank over 40gallons. So, no, you can't buy an oscar at walmart. You can't buy a bala shark at petsmart. You can't buy a common pleco at petco. But you can buy one from a breeder, or a licensed LFS, or a licensed on-line website. Maybe you can place a special order at Petsmart. It need not be impossible to buy a 'special' fish, just not quite as easy to make that mistake as it is right now.


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## locojay (May 22, 2006)

Zoe said:


> I would expect that most people, if told "this fish will grow 12" long and require a 90gallon tank, or it will die," would deter many people. After all, who wants to buy a fish that will die from improper husbandry?


My thoughts exactly. When you buy a car no one tells you, you only have to change the oil whenever you feel like it as long as it's every 50,000 miles. That's absurd, you're car would fail long before it gets to 50,000 miles. We do get the correct information to maintain our vehicles when we buy them. I don't think it's too much to ask for to get the correct information to maintain my fish when I buy them. A listing that reads: "Common Pleco, Max length 18", Min tank size 20g" is equally absurd. That fish will die long before it sees 18"


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## Zoe (Feb 26, 2006)

This is true. Even if all the clerks on the floor aren't necessarily the most educated, at least there will be little ID cards for the fish. Currently they have some at Petsmart I believe but they aren't accurate (Bala shark = 30gallon??).

Charge me 10 cents more per fish if you want, just bloody helI, have the correct info.


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