# Dragon Betta at Petco!!



## Cichlid Dude!

I finally got a betta! I named him Smaug because he's a dragon betta. He was labeled as a delta tail, but his fins look to be a little too short. However, they are just a little too long to be plakat fins. He has what looks to be a deep split in his caudal fin, but it is actually a lack of coloring on those rays. He is very healthy- he was eating hungrily about twenty minutes after I introduced him to my 6.6. I have no furniture or decor in the tank, but plan to add some rocks and plants soon. He has been swimming around the tank actively ever since I put him in, I think he likes the extra swimming space. I plan to order him a girlfriend off of petco's website soon, but if anyone is able to INEXPENSIVELY ship to California, then I may be able to work something out. Check out the album "Smaug the Dragon Betta" for a pic. He is a real beauty. Also, I have a question especially for the betta experts out there, do you think that my betta has show potential? I think he might do decently, being a Dragon and all. Thanks for your replies!


----------



## Chard56

He looks to be a young Halfmoon and will probably grow his fins out a lot more. From that picture I couldn't say much for being show quality without him being fully developed and seeing him in full flare.


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Actually, he is about the same size as an adult betta, I checked. I'm pretty sure that he is a fully developed delta (but I would be delighted if he turned out to be a halfmoon).
He doesn't really flare, just stares at the mirror for awhile and then swims away. Also, does anyone know how to prepare peas for bettas to eat? And do bettas have any other unusual food preferences?


----------



## Betta man

He's a beauty!


----------



## Chard56

Cichlid Dude! said:


> Actually, he is about the same size as an adult betta, I checked. I'm pretty sure that he is a fully developed delta (but I would be delighted if he turned out to be a halfmoon).
> He doesn't really flare, just stares at the mirror for awhile and then swims away. Also, does anyone know how to prepare peas for bettas to eat? And do bettas have any other unusual food preferences?


I have some males that are still growing out their fins at 6 to 8 months even though their body is full sized. Give him another month or two to see if he's done growing. I take a frozen pea and put it in a cup of hot water to thaw and then take the skin off. Break it or smash it into bite size pieces to feed to your Betta when he's constipated or like other Betta owners do, feed him some pea once a week.


----------



## Betta man

I tried feeding my bettas a pea. It didn't work well. My male doesn't eat tubifex worm either.


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

I have seen his caudal fin flared, once when he was resting. He is NOT a halfmoon. Not now anyway. Is it possible that he will develop a halfmoon tail still? Oh, and one other thing, can you describe the process of how betta fins grow back? From my observations, after a fin is torn/split/damaged, when it grows back, it is colorless, but soon regains its color. Please correct me if I'm wrong. If this is so, then it's possible that the clear streak could actually be a split that is healed but hasn't gotten its color back. I'm not sure if it was obvious in the photo, but Smaug (the betta) has black edging around his dorsal, caudal, and anal fins. I think he MAY be a butterfly. What is the definition of a butterfly betta? Does it matter how thick the butterfly edging is? And does the edging have to be white? I really apreciate your help.


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Also, what's the best way to get a male betta to build a bubble nest?


----------



## Bettawhisperer

First off sorry to say this but he is in very bad condition ( Looks all torn up)and would not show. Secondly IBC does not have a class for Dragons. The only way you could show him if he was in better condition is if you found a small town show someplace that will except all breeds. The IBC only excepts
HM ST male
HM ST female
HM DT male
HM DT Female
Crowntail Male
Crowntail Female
Shortfin Male
Shortfin Female

Your fish is fine as a pet. Also They will continue to grow there whole life. If you have ever seen a really old male you will see that his fins a huge and very heavy. This is a picture of a very old one I had. Notice how very heavy his fins are. He can hardly stay upright. The body may not grow after about a year but the fins keep growing.








Oh by the way. That dorsal is torn from breeding.


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Is there any way to add a class to IBC's classes? And why don't they have delta tails available in their classes? One other thing, he may look really torn up in the photo, but there is really only one split fin on his entire body, and that is on his caudal. He is just really short finned, but I hope that changes soon. Is it possible that he will ever develop a halfmoon tail? And one other thing, do you think his fins are short enough that he might be eligible for the short-fin class? And even if he isn't show quality, do you think his offspring might? Also, could you clarify me on the definition of a butterfly betta? (see my third message)


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

I read somewhere that putting a peice of wax paper on the surface of the water will help the male betta build a bubble nest, what's your take on that?


----------



## Bettawhisperer

The committee members would have to change it and right now I don't see that happening. He may be a HM plaket. Very hard to tell from the photo. If he was a Delta or Hm his fins should be way longer by now. Even two month old Hm's will show a 180 caudal. Here is a picture of a Butterfly HM. They are usually trimmed in white.









This one although very pretty is not up to show standards. The caudal has to be an even 50% 50% which he has but the 50 50 has to go all the way around symmetrically which his doesn't. Also his anal fin is to long. The fins have to be symmetrically all the way around also. So he got sold instead of shown. Look at my avatar fish. He took 1st and Best of Show for his class.


----------



## Betta man

my halfmoon is trimmed with white.


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

He's gorgeous, that's a great fish. I took a close look at my fish and found pure black "trimming" around his caudal, anal, and dorsal fins. There is definately an obvious boundary between the red and black, so does this qualify him as a butterfly betta? One other thing, I agree w/ you about him not being a delta, but unless he is really old, aren't his fins too long to be a plakat? He is not a halfmoon. I have heard that it is against the rules to enter a fish that you have purchased in a betta show, and also that it is against the rules to enter a fish that has mated before. Is this information accurate?


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

I just googled "Black-trimmed butterfly betta" and up popped a black trimmed butterfly betta! Does the butterfly trimming have to be a certain thickness? Also, do you think he is short finned enough to enter in the IBC "short finned" class?


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Also, is anyone here a "Bettas Friends" member? I have not joined, but it looks interesting.


----------



## Bettawhisperer

They are usaually called Black lace when trimmed with black. This is a Black lace MG.









Yes it is true that you can't enter a fish that you are not the breeder of. You can not buy a fish and then show it. And a fish can not have been bred yet. If you want to breed a fish that you are showing you have to wait until you retire him/her from showing.


----------



## Chard56

*.Butterfly or Devil*



Cichlid Dude! said:


> I have seen his caudal fin flared, once when he was resting. He is NOT a halfmoon. Not now anyway. Is it possible that he will develop a halfmoon tail still? Oh, and one other thing, can you describe the process of how betta fins grow back? From my observations, after a fin is torn/split/damaged, when it grows back, it is colorless, but soon regains its color. Please correct me if I'm wrong. If this is so, then it's possible that the clear streak could actually be a split that is healed but hasn't gotten its color back. I'm not sure if it was obvious in the photo, but Smaug (the betta) has black edging around his dorsal, caudal, and anal fins. I think he MAY be a butterfly. What is the definition of a butterfly betta? Does it matter how thick the butterfly edging is? And does the edging have to be white? I really apreciate your help.


 Butterflies do not have to be White: 














Preferably the two colors would be half and half on the fins taking up 50% by each color. A Black edging can be considered a Devil when edged on Red like these Blue Devils:














Lace refers to the barred markings in the fins not the edging. Like these Blue Lace HM's.














You can show a Betta that does not belong to you if you show it under the other persons name and Who is going to know if you bred your Betta before showing it?


----------



## Bettawhisperer

WOW Chard you never cease to amaze me.


----------



## Chard56

Back at you.


----------



## Bettawhisperer

I think I said Butterfly is usually white but not all are. As far as your so called lace one goes there is no class for his coloration so you can call it what ever you like. Also as far as being the breeder of the fish that is going to show. Yes a person can be a liar, a cheat, and deceitful if they want to be but the rules are that a fish has to be shown by the breeder. Your right in that a person can show a fish they didn't breed and no one would know if they want to be a cheat and a liar. If they are found out though they will never be able to show again and I for one would not want to take that chance.


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Great point betta whisperer. I agree with both of you about the "amazing each other" part.
Also, about my betta's fin type... I am certain that his caudal is too short to be DeT, but I have yet to see a plakat with such straight caudal fin edging. He cannot be a halfmoon plakat, since he has no halfmoon, and I cannot think of any other fin categories that he can possibly be grouped into. Could this possibly be some new type of fin style? Does anyone know of a betta with similar caudal fin shape? Any help would be great. I have so far gathered that my betta is (correct me if I am wrong) An unknown fin type dragon red devil betta. Is this correct? Also (again correct me if I'm wrong), I have done a little research, and from my very limited understanding, armadillo bettas are, aside from genetics, hybridization, etc., basically dragon bettas with blue tints to the dragon scales. I have noticed that my betta has a blue tint to his scales, so is it fair for me to think that he is an armadillo? This, in my opinion, would explain his lack of flaring when presented with a mirror, as according to my research armadillos are supposed to be hybrids of betta splendens and betta imbellis, the latter of which (again according to my research) has little or none of betta splendens' aggression. Does this sound like decent logic to you two betta experts?


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

I know that in the "Smaug the Dragon Betta" photograph, you can't see any blue on the dragon scales, but I'm pretty sure that that is the camera's fault. I just recently checked, and there is definitely an obvious blue tint to the reflective scales.


----------



## Chard56

I never said any thing about cheating. You can show someone elses Betta for them by showing it under their name. Just because you think you know what lace is but you don't and I happen to know for a fact what the definition is does not mean you have to be an ass and I am offended by your implication that I was implying you could cheat by showing a Betta you didn't breed. I said you could show a Betta that you had Bred as in spawned previously to counter your rediculus comment about having to wait until you retire a Betta from the show curcuit before you can breed it. By who's to know that you bred it was my meaning that by breeding a Betta and then showing it, who was to know. If you'd spend a little more time reading my post instead of reading something in to it and actually researching before you answer with something you made up or guessed at I wouldn't have to follow behind you to straighten out your wrong answers.


----------



## Bettawhisperer

Well contrary to what you may think I do know what I'm talking about and I do much research. I also have a very dear friend and mentor named Karen MacAuley who I check with before I answer any questions I'm not sure about.


----------



## Betta man

Please settle this dispute acting like civilized people who love bettas! Am I wrong???!!! 
Or you could have CIVILIZED DISCUSSIONS on PM!!!! Remember! CIVILIZED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now that I'm done with my everlasting talk about civilized discussing!!! Remember civilized!!!!!!!! Now I'm done with my everlasting monologue the point is... Is dude's Betta young old or annoying like fights are!!!!??? I think that dude's!! betta is a delta. Also, guys, what would a guest think if they saw you squabbling like crazy. That might scare a new member away???! Our language needs to be clean to! Now I'm sounding like a mod lol!


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Thank you, betta man, as I was saying, is it possible that my fish may have some imbellis in it somewhere down the line? I know that there isn't a whole lot of visible blue tint on Smaugs dragon scales in the pic, but I definately see some blue in him. And wouldn't my theory also explain his strange lack of mirror-flaring? Thank you for behaving civilly.


----------



## Betta man

do butterflys have to be 50 percent one color and 50 percent another color?


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

That is the ideal betterfly betta pattern.


----------



## Betta man

Mine isn't 50 50.


----------



## Chard56

I'm trying to help here not argue and if you don't want me to correct someone then you can take the chance of getting all the BS and wrong advice that you'd like. You poor innocents have to put up with someone elses B.S.


----------



## Bettawhisperer

I conferred with Karen MacAuley on the information I gave on this thread. So your saying that the top breeder in this country doesn't know as much as you do and that she's a liar? You have more nerve then I thought you did to say she doesn't know as much as you. I'm sure she'll be happy to hear this.


----------



## humdedum

Betta man said:


> Mine isn't 50 50.





Cichlid Dude! said:


> That is the ideal betterfly betta pattern.



Ideal.  Kind of like in dog shows, the "breed standard" might be a curling tail, but many dogs may have a straight tail. 

Some butterflies, if I get this right, will end up not perfectly 50/50. In a perfect world, all butterflies would be 50/50. Just like some red bettas have little specks of white that breeders are trying to eliminate. The ideal "standard" is pure red.


----------



## Bettawhisperer

hum you're right. A show Butterfly must be a perfect 50%-50% not only on the caudal but symmetrically all the way around. Very rare. if you ever get one like that send it off to a show. LOL


----------



## Betta man

*hmmmm...*



Chard56 said:


> I'm trying to help here not argue and if you don't want me to correct someone then you can take the chance of getting all the BS and wrong advice that you'd like. You poor innocents have to put up with someone elses B.S.


You both have plenty of betta spawns under your belts so you both must be right?


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Chard and Bettawhisp, I would appreciate it if you would gently and calmly correct each other instead of using abbreviations of questionable language. If you decide to continue this argument, then I politely suggest that you use private messaging. I do not mean to drive you away, you BOTH have great advice to give. This all started with a misunderstanding, as many arguments do. I would like it if you would simply let this all go,forgive and forget, let sleeping dogs lie, however you want to say it. The last thing I want you to do is become enemies. Anyway, I am wondering if black lace bettas can be show quality, or do they have to be half and half like butterflies? Please, when you answer this, kindly don't correct each other, just answer me ONLY FOR THIS MESSAGE. Thank you very much and I trust you will work this out.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My mom is a therapist


----------



## egoreise

Agreed! And for the record, you both breed some absolutely stunning bettas. I mean, seriously jaw dropping honey-come-look-at-the-computer-screen-quick! bettas!


----------



## Betta man

Now!!!!! Is dude's betta a delta?


----------



## Bettawhisperer

Cichlid Dude. No a Black lace does not have to be 50-50 like the Butterfly. Here is a black lace that I have been showing for two months now and I just shipped him and three others this morning to a show in Florida. He took 3rd place, another one took second place, and another one took first place in there classes. That was last month. Hoping for more ribbons from them this week end in Florida.
He is a Black Lace MG.


----------



## lohachata

what i see here seems to be differing opinions...unfortunately people have been killing each other over differing opinions for eons..it's okay to disagree with someone..heck ; nobody agrees with me....well ; almost nobody..my granddaughters do...because i give them treats..
personally ; i think the IBC is a bunch of the most uppity snobbish dipwads around...just like the folks at AKA and some of the other elitist groups..they think that they are the only ones that know anything about the fish they keep..
MUSTARD GAS ?????.......who is the idiot that came up with that color ?
this is mustard gas...maybe they would like some of that..
http://www.google.com/search?q=must...NLIKXtweB8d3ODw&ved=0CEMQsAQ&biw=1372&bih=684

bettawhisperer....chard.....you fellas have differing opinions..and it seems that each of you seems to think that you are the only one that is right...i used to breed bettas too..
some i thought were quite beautiful ; others downright ugly..i was told by a few folks that i should have shown them..but since i never felt the need to be superior to others ; i never bothered..just bred them and sold them.. the most i ever got was $50 for a really nice male... but most were just beautiful betta splendens that were sold in a pet shop....just like the bettas you guys breed..

now you gents may not like this post..but i really don't care..i am not the one bickering...get your acts together and be "civil" as was suggested...all this squabbling is upsetting others..

yes....i am the meanest crankiest old geezer on this forum...


----------



## hXcChic22

lohachata said:


> personally ; i think the IBC is a bunch of the most uppity snobbish dipwads around...just like the folks at AKA and some of the other elitist groups..they think that they are the only ones that know anything about the fish they keep..
> 
> now you gents may not like this post..but i really don't care..i am not the one bickering...get your acts together and be "civil" as was suggested...all this squabbling is upsetting others..
> 
> yes....i am the meanest crankiest old geezer on this forum...


:lol: You crack me up, John.


----------



## Betta man

I saw a mustard gas that was beautiful! It was at petco!


----------



## funlad3

"yes....i am the meanest crankiest old geezer on this forum... "

Even if that were true, you've got three things going for you.


1. You're funny

2. You're helpful

3. You, at least, can work a computer. :fun:


I think everyone on this site is great, and if we were to listen to each other more, nothing would really change. (Like that anti-climax thing?) We are, as others have put it, like a family, (A tight knit group of friendly people at least) so we will always argue. Still, it doesn't hurt to try!


----------



## lohachata

sorry funlad...not so good with the computer...lucky i can turn it on...

bettawhisperer...if you ever come up with another one like that blue HM butterfly ; let me know..i would like to get one for my fiance...


----------



## Betta man

Lol! My grandma doesn't know how to search youtube!


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Lohachata, you ROCK.  Thanks for the Mod Power


----------



## berniesmom

I'm sorry. I'm kind of new here. How do you get to the Album to see the picture of Smaug?

Also, where are there competitions to show your Bettas? I wonder how my Bernie would do? Is it just a matter of posting a picture somewhere?


----------



## Betta man

click on community up at the top of the screen and click on pictures and albums. Look for the album you want.


----------



## lohachata

ok...i went and looked at smaug...personally i think he's ugly....but there is plenty of room in this world for everybody's preferences....


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

I take no offense Lohachata, but do want to say that that isn't a very good photo of him. He is much prettier in full light and when he is flaring. Also, I have been giving him special treatment and he seems to have improved in coloration. Thank you for your opinion.


----------



## Mr. fish

Bettawhisperer said:


> The committee members would have to change it and right now I don't see that happening. He may be a HM plaket. Very hard to tell from the photo. If he was a Delta or Hm his fins should be way longer by now. Even two month old Hm's will show a 180 caudal. Here is a picture of a Butterfly HM. They are usually trimmed in white.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This one although very pretty is not up to show standards. The caudal has to be an even 50% 50% which he has but the 50 50 has to go all the way around symmetrically which his doesn't. Also his anal fin is to long. The fins have to be symmetrically all the way around also. So he got sold instead of shown. Look at my avatar fish. He took 1st and Best of Show for his class.


No disrespect, but that blue/white butterfly is WAY better looking than the one in your avatar. I would of bought him from you if he wasn't so expensive. Hes a stunner!


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Hey, one other thing, I am planning on getting Smaug a girfriend soon, but I'm not sure where to look. I want to buy from a place that offers refunds if the female dies, I want to buy from a place that offers halfmoon females, and I REALLY REALLY need the price to be low. I was thinking on buying online from petco, but then I don't get to hand pick my female. I would love to buy on aquabid, but I don't think they offer refunds. I have seen plenty of online betta shops with GORGEOUS fish for sale, but none meet my monetary requirements. I understand that being an aquarist is a VERY expensive hobby, but twenty dollars for a female betta is a little too pricey by my standards, even if she is absolutely a knockout. If I find the most beautiful female I've ever seen, I would probably be willing to buy her for twenty bucks, but what if she dies? I would simply lose twenty bucks. Please tell me about a place where I can buy a high quality female betta cheap. Thank you !


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

Hello? Anyone?


----------



## mousey

how much are they selling dragon bettas for whereever you all are?
I am in Canada just north 0f the capital city of the province of Ontario and they are selling dragons for 20 bucks.
They are nice enough but to me a betta is a betta. There are some very nice betta splendens that will make just as nice pets.


----------



## Cichlid Dude!

I got my betta at petco for about eight bucks. It wasn't labeled as a dragon, just as a delta tail. Try Going to a store that sells bettas and simply looking at the fish. You never know what you're going to find.


----------



## Betta man

I got my betta shazam, who died at petco for 8 bucks. (he's in the album in memory of my dead bettas). The petstores have some great bettas sometimes...


----------



## humdedum

Hmm. You could buy a not-so-gorgeous female, and maybe one of her kids will be pretty enough. Aren't some nice bettas only $12 (not show quality, but from show lines)?


----------



## Betta man

I think he died...


----------



## FishieLuv

Oh no! R.I.P little betta....


----------



## Betta man

he was pretty...


----------

