# Tropical Strays



## Guest

in late summer and fall here in new england, currents bring juvenile tropical fish from the gulf of mexico up here. i take this opportunity to snorkel and catch what i can with a hand net. i have a 40 gallon specifically set up for this purpose. last thursday, i had a great day of collecting. this is what i have collected so far:

1 short bigeye
2 boxfish
1 spotfin butterfly fish
2 snowy groupers
1 golden jack
1 unknown species of filefish
3 unknown fish, which kind of look like banded pilotfish. except for the fact that they are yellowish...not white

now i have had problems feeding the tropical fish i have caught before...and this time is no different. for some of them. most fish are eating brineshrimp and blackworms, but here are the fish that are not eating:

butterflyfish
boxfish
golden jack

i tried the brineshrimp and blackworms for these guys and i also tried baby brine shrimp, but they didnt take any of it. however, the butterfly has been pecking at some orange sponge.

does anyone have any ideas as to what i could try to get these 3 fish to eat what i give them?

Thanks,
Katie


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## wrasser

Try mysis shrimp, frozen is ok, just hold the cube in front of the in let of the tank and it will thaw out and dispurce the shrimp through out the tank


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## TheOldSalt

Chopped up Aiptasia anemones make great Butterfly chow, along with blackworms.
The boxfish should eat anything in sight.
The jack should be a problem until it figures out what fishfood is, and they are a bit sensitive to being moved anyway.

A picture would of course make ID'ing your mystery fish much easier.


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## Guest

the boxfish are ow eating brineshrimp! i moved them into a breeder net because i think the other fish were not letting them eat. they ate after i moved them. 
i think i found out that "mystery" fish are banded rudderfish but i will post pics ASAP.


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## TheOldSalt

Rudderfish were what I suspected they were from your prior description, so if you think so too, that's probably it.


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## Guest

finally took some pics. im hoping some people can me identify some of them. 

sorry for this blurry pic. my camera sucks. i think it is a juvenile cube boxfish but im not positive. it has little black spots, which you cant tell from the pic.









golden jack maybe?









snowy grouper.










short bigeye.









anyone have any idea what kind of filefish this is?









rudderfish maybe? and a spotfin butterflyfish









rudderfish again.









-Katie


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## Guest

by the way, everything is now eating except the butterflyfish. i tried aiptasia anemones and blackworms, along with the adult and baby brineshrimp. the only thing it is eating is an orange sponge we put in the tank for decor. it's constantly pecking at it, but it wont take anything else. i did not try mysis shrimp yet. hafta take a trip to the lfs.


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## TheOldSalt

I'm pretty sure those are juvenile Rudderfish alright, but I can't tell which Jack you have.
The filefish is _Aluterus schoepfi._
The boxfish is _Lactophrys bicaudalis._ Hang onto it, for it'll be a spectacular adult.
The Butterfly should figure out how to eat eventually. If it doesn't, consider letting it go. A freshwater dip serves as an appetite stimulant sometimes.


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## euRasian32

WOW.

Katie: I admire your fascination and dedication. I have to say I'm a little jealous. I really should get certified, opposed to waiting until I retire or when my residual income is 24/7. I'm all out of excuses.


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## Guest

thanks eurasian. i love collecting and i love the success of keeping them healthy even more. 

TheOldSalt: thanks very much for identifying thosefish!  and, what is a freshwater dip? sorry, i didnt understand what you meant by this. also, i have another boxfish with the exact same shape, but it is brown, and may have tiny little white spots. is this the same species with a different color pattern, or something else?

Thanks,

-Katie


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## Guest

oh, and theoldsalt: the tropicals are here to stay and die over winter, which is why i cant let anything go. ill try the mysis shrimp and "freshwater dip" (once i find out what that is, lol) and maybe if i find another butterflyfish or create a small group, i will have better results. i will also add a small piece of live rock and maybe it will peck at this.


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## TheOldSalt

Did you chop up the Aiptasia anemone for the butterfly? Mincing it into itty bitty bits makes them very appealing as a butterfly snack.

A freshwater dip is a procedure in which the fish is dumped into a bucket of fresh water of the same pH & temp which is fully aerated. This is primarily used to destroy gill/external parasites, but a side effect is appetite stimulation. Different fish have different tolerances for freshwater dips, but three minutes is as long enough. Openwater smoothskinned fish like jacks are not good at surviving dips, but a butterfly would have no problems.

The boxfish is probably another Lactophrys, but there are so many of these guys in the brown color as juveniles that I couldn't guess which one you have. All the Lactophrys tend to look pretty cool as adults. By the way, they are cowfishes, not boxes, but when that young they certainly pass for boxes.


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## Guest

okay, thanks.

i tried my best to chop up the anemone...i think ill probably try it again. 
also, one more question on the dip. do you mean fresh saltwater, or actual freshwater? if you mean actual freshwater...that would scare me a bit to do that... how long do i dip it?


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## Fishfirst

what about clams/scallops halves? I hear they stimilate feeding in butterflyfishes.


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## TheOldSalt

Actual fresh water. The fish themselves like to take freshwater baths in the wild whenever they find a supply of fresh water. It hydrates them and makes their parasites either burst or at least swell up so much that they can't stay attached.
2-3 minutes is plenty, actually close to the safe limit for many fish.
NOTE: do not use water which has been dechlorinated with chemicals. These chemicals cause very rapid slime production in the fish, and this slime defeats the purpose of the dip by shielding the skin & the parasites from the fresh water.

Split open bivalves sometimes work, sure, and they're certainly worth a try, but I've personally had much better luck with a glob of ground up blackworms & anemones, preferably with some sort of frozen food ( fully thawed ). Such a presentation evokes a feeding frenzy among the fishes in the tank, and the butterflies eventually join in the fun. I should mention that this only goes for Atlantic butterflies, and that those obligate corallivores of the pacific won't touch this stuff.


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## redpaulhus

I just found this... i was gonna mention cut open fresh live clams (quahogs, mahogony clams, etc) but somebody beat me to it.

I second Oldsalts suggestion of worms and anemones. I've also had decent luck taking a blender, adding some shrimp, squid, and clams, and blending into a thick "goop" - not too runny, keep it fairly chunky. I then press this stuff into pieces of coral, or shells, or even tuffa rock - something with enough texture to hold it a bit, not too smooth. I then freeze it for a little while (so it holds together when I put it in the tank) and drop in the tank. (sometimes I have to loop an elastic around it, or mesh from an onion bag, but if I get the consitancy right it doesn't start floating away till its getting nibbled on)...

How little are all these guys ? they look small in the pics... less than 3" ?


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## Guest

the butterfly fish is dime sized. ive had some losses...probably from the tank being overcrowded... i lost the bigeye (very upset about this one), a rudderfish, and the jack. i did a partial water change, maybe 25%.
ill try that idea. sounds good! thanks.

-Katie


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## I catch my own

You are all lucky to be living in an area where that phenomenon occurs every year. Here in southern CA pretty much all the fish species are drab, uninteresting, or too difficult to properly care for, the exception being that here there are several species of sharks and rays that start life small (between 6 and 8 inches) and are perfectly suited to live in a tank as small as 60 gallons, for a few months anyway, at that point you can safely release them since these species live in the area year round, and just catch some more replacements, pretty easy to do by fishing in the surf with small hooks in the summer. I just moved, so my tank isn't set up yet, but I hope to post some photos soon.


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## TheOldSalt

Look again. There are many quite interesting species in SoCal's waters. Ignore the big ones and look for the tiny ones.


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## I catch my own

What I meant to say is my tank isn't set BACK up yet..before I moved it was up and running for about 11 years, using nothing but locally collected seawater and native fish and invert species, I don't scuba dive so all the stuff was caught either by hook and line(using barbless hooks of course) or by going out to tidepools and collecting "live rock", in this case usually chunks of granite(not limestone like the "real" live rock)covered in small anemones, tubeworms, e.t.c. The tidepools I use are artificial,(an old harbor breakwater knocked down by storms)so I am not putting any pressure on natural tidepools, which is illegal anyway. As for species, I have had several newborn leopard sharks, all around 6 inches or so over the years, a baby round stingray about 4 inches across, and 2 young 4 inch barracudas, that I was able to train to eat strips of mackerel by impaling it on a feeding stick I made out of clear plastic and gently wiggling it in the tank. I got them started on live mosquito fish, which seem to be able to do well in pure seawater. I have also had over the years several other species, like surfperches, small croakers, e.t.c., all released when they outgrew my 65 gallon tank. Anyway, getting back to the tropical strays, wouldn't they be able to migrate south during the fall if released?, especially after having had a head start and growing in an aquarium for awhile. Lots of fish migrate north in spring and back south in fall.


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## TheOldSalt

I'd reckon the probably could, sure.


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