# rant: bettas in little plastic cups



## Celeste

what is the problem? yes, pet stores sell bettas in little plastic cups. you know why? because bettas are highly agressive fish towards each other. pet stores have limited space. it would be so incredibly impractical to house 50 bettas EACH in 10, even 5 gallon aquariums. and they can't put them all together in one tank because they'd kill each other in a couple days. they're called siamese fighting fish for a reason.

i'm so sick of all you people harping on pet stores for selling bettas in these little deli cups. do you have a better suggestion?? it's a temporary home, hopefully they will only be in it for a few days at the most before someone buys them.

if you want to rant about any animal being kept in little deli cups, go after walmart selling hermit crabs like that. it's insane. especially because hermit crabs are very social animals and can be housed in very large groups so long as they have enough room. 

some pet stores actually change the water in the betta cups daily, even twice a day. most pet stores feed them too! it's NOT as bad as you make it out to be. 

believe me, i am the first person to go after a pet store if i think there's something that needs improving. i've b*tched out the managers of petsmart for their care of their hermit crabs on a regular basis. i've called their corporate offices and complained to them as well. they're just now finally starting to get the hint.

but this is not something i feel needs improving. if someone can think of a better way to do it, be my guest. but so far, this system works so long as the pet stores keep up with it, cleaning the cups and feeding and everything.

if you can think of a better way to TEMPORARILY house a highly agressive fish like a betta, in quantaties that a pet store has to carry, i'd like to hear it.


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## Damon

1.Well they could set up a barracks system. Not so expensive to house 96 bettas. And it would pay for itself after awhile. But most stores don't want to invest the money for one.

2. An upgrade in size of cup wouldn't cost but 2 pennies more per 100 cups.

3. Regular matainence of the bettas would help. Petstores do pay people money to matain the fish afterall...........

4. Keep them housed in community tanks. What many stores here do. They put them in breeder nets or boxes.

We've all heard the rants, both sides of it. You asked for suggestions. Here they are.


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## flynngriff

The "good" fish stores that I've seen that sell bettas use a barracks system... Basically a long, narrow tank with dividers set up every 5 inches or so... They're usually probably ten or twenty gallons total, and house 20 or so bettas. There's usually only one filter on them... Either that, or they're set up on the multi-tank filter system that the store uses for all their tanks. It works great, it gives the bettas good filtration, and they have 3 or 4 times as much room as the little plastic jars. It's heck of a lot easier to maintain than 20 little jars, too. I don't know why more stores don't use that kind of system. I could build one myself with supplies from any hardware store if I wanted to house 20 bettas.


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## Pac-Man

well, celeste...i hear u talking about how you are sick of us talking about betta cups, but you say hermit crabs need improvement....sounds hypocritical to me...why it any better too keep a betta in a small cup than it is to keep a hermit crab? do hermit crabs necassarily NEED larger tanks...no..would the crabs enjoy them, probably...would the bettas need a larger cup, no, but i wonder how much you would like being stuck in a plastic cup thats not even big enough to allow you to stretch...not to mention a barely filtered (usually, if its not part of a barracks system) cup, that has big temperature fluctuations....i mean, i can see how betta experts like aaa and rc keep them in 32 oz., but rc even changes the water twice evry 24 hours...i really don't think chains do that. there, that was my rant. most pet stores do need to improve their betta care, and if they don't, what makes it any better than keeping a hermit crab in a small tank?


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## Celeste

actually yes, the hermit crabs NEED larger tanks, and they NEED to be socialized, and they NEED 80% humidity to breathe, and they NEED fresh and varied food sources, or they will die. many hermit crabs are so utterly stressed out from being harvested from their native beaches and shipped to pet stores that take horrible care of them that they die soon after being purchased. 

however, bettas are bred and raised in small containers. they are also bred in captivity. hermit crabs are not, they are harvested WILD from their natural habitat as they cannot breed in captivity. 

i agree that it's awful to keep a betta in one of those cups for more than a few days, tops. but for temporary housing, it's not as bad as everyone seems to think. i think you need to look at the pet stores overall care of their animals. if the bettas just sit on a shelf in those cups for a week, no food, no water changes, etc. then yeah, that's pretty awful. but i've heard of pet stores that change the water in the betta cups once, twice a day, and that feed them every day too.


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## Osiris

i prefer to see the betta's in the "intank betta holders" versus the cups, just better system IMO.


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## Pac-Man

ok, celeste i see your point, but you have to understand alot of the stores i go into have bettas in those cups doing very minimal water changes....not to be gross but half the time the bettas are swimming in their own....well you know what i mean.


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## Osiris

i agree with pac-man, 99% of them do it, except one! but they are also known as good fish people as i actually met them on cichlidforum chat, there all the time, and are good breeders, they setup their betta area with automatic water change system! Pretty slick, even their FW tanks are setup for automatic, i notice water changes get done more often with them things lol


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## aaa

i know this is not so related to the topic, but did anyone noticed that now more store charge a certain cents for the cup?


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## thatsfishy

> i wouldn't be surprised if thats were the reason they are so aggresive


 Trust me, bettas been territorial and agressive BEFORE plastic cups were even invented!



> i know this is not so related to the topic, but did anyone noticed that now more store charge a certain cents for the cup?


Buy your bettas from local breeders ... they be happy to throw in the bag for free ... lol


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## Lexus

So is it any better to have those hang on the side ones, in your opinion?


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## Lexus

Baby_Baby said:


> i said the aggressive in a cup thing trying to emphasize the cruelty in all of it. poor little bettas.....all alone......sniff.....sniff.......without a big open tank to thrive in......poor little guys.....


but as said before the cups are temporary.... bettas are bought and sold at a very high rate


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## aaa

thatsfishy said:


> Trust me, bettas been territorial and agressive BEFORE plastic cups were even invented!
> 
> 
> Buy your bettas from local breeders ... they be happy to throw in the bag for free ... lol


don't worry, i never buy from store... those VTs are not for me... i don't keep VTs anymore.


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## Hamm35924

doesnt that upset the bettas seeing another betta though? i read somewhere that it does, so wouldnt the barracks system be worse than the cups. I dont know though really. :?:


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## osteoporoosi

In my local LFS female bettas are in one tank and males are kept in community tanks with peaceful tetras, I think this system beats the deli-cups.
I think that eeping bettas or any other fish in cups isn't bad for a while, but people who buy the cups don't often understand that they are for temporarely housing.


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## maxpayne_lhp

osteoporoosi said:


> In my local LFS female bettas are in one tank and males are kept in community tanks with peaceful tetras, I think this system beats the deli-cups.
> I think that eeping bettas or any other fish in cups isn't bad for a while, but people who buy the cups don't often understand that they are for temporarely housing.


Some local fish stores are not big enough so the cup one seem to be the first one to be considered by the managers... as I can see, there're just about 5~6 tanks that can put male bettas in in a fish store. So that means they can only run a stock of 5~6 male bettas? And the diet, bettas are slow movers so it could be a problem keeping bettas with some other fish (tho peacful) it also prevents the employees to keep track with their bettas.
So, in my opinion, just wider the cups a bit or set up the barrack systems are ideal for keeping bettas in stores.


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## Bettaman

It might be a temporary home if the Pet Stores would not carry so many of them at a time. Sorry but I'm more sick of seeing dead Bettas in these cups at the Pet Stores than you could possibly be of hearing us Betta lovers complain about that.

And it's not just the tiny cups. It's the negligent care of the Bettas as well. I've seen stores stack these Betta cups so deep on shelves that the majority of the Bettas in the tiny cups get no daylight for days and days. Then they keep the lights on in the stores 24 hours and so the Bettas in the front of the shelves get no night time and by the way, Bettas have no eyelids. That is just completely neglectful, irrisponsible, and absolute abusive conduct. And why? All to make a buck. Disgusting!


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## Lexus

At Walmart, when I was in pets I ordered around 100-200 bettas a week and sold them all within that week. They also recieved water changes and food.


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## aaa

osteoporoosi said:


> In my local LFS female bettas are in one tank and males are kept in community tanks with peaceful tetras, I think this system beats the deli-cups.
> I think that eeping bettas or any other fish in cups isn't bad for a while, but people who buy the cups don't often understand that they are for temporarely housing.


i believe that is the owner's responsibility to explain that betta DO need space. the petsmart and petco and even walmart near my house have some paper print out that instruct people to take care of their betta. they said keep them in at least a gallon tank(well, mainly i think because they can make a little more off the tanks), but i never see anyone EVER to read the paper. yes, maybe they know what they are doing, but i don't know ALL of them know what are they doing. if people just take 5 minutes to read, a lots of things will change. the paper is put right in the middle. there is no excuse not to see the paper. it is just people lazy to read and kill their fish later.


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## Bettaman

Lexus said:


> At Walmart, when I was in pets I ordered around 100-200 bettas a week and sold them all within that week. They also recieved water changes and food.



That's scary. I don't think any local area would see a demand from 100 to 200 different customerrs for Bettas per week. Makes me think they people buying them are not taking very good care of them and whenthey die they just come back for more. I could be wrong about the demand as I certainly understand all the wonderful reasons to have a Betta but moving 200 every week sounds a little high. I like that Wal Mart is using the larger cups but hate that they are the place that stacks them in shelves so deep that many never see daylight.


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## Lexus

Ya our town is 70,000 people but we have many many surrounding towns that come to shop. 

I dont stack them deep, I stack them tall. (Also I am trying to get back in Pets since I hate Sporting Goods)


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## osteoporoosi

Can't see why the shopowner couldn't use 5 minutes to explain the customer all the basic info on bettas. I think the responsibility can't be all on the customer, bevause they usually don't know they are doing wrong. But in my opinion it is irresponsible to get any pet before having proper info on it.


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## maxpayne_lhp

Well yeah some, for money, may do bad things ( like give the consumers wrong knowledge) or just dun really pay attention on their costomers..


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## aaa

i believe that is the owner's responsibility to explain that betta DO need space.

i mean the shop owner


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## maxpayne_lhp

> cuz some people are stupid


You're somehow right!


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## goldyfish

Celeste, 
I might be new but I think that flaming is NOT allowed so please don't try to troll along and catch everyone in a giant debate about stupid little plastic cups. I will not be giving my opinion on the topic because I believe that this thread is completely useless and should be locked and deleted form the forum. Thanks for listening.
All due respect,
Goldyfish


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## maxpayne_lhp

Chill goldyfish. I personally think that this is ok and not very useless. It may help aquarists and fish-sellers. It may be a bit tough but come on this is a forum after all.


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## (RC)

The posts in this topic haven't been any problem so if you don't like the topic don't post to it, but don't try to cause a problem over it.


RC


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## aaa

goldyfish said:


> Celeste,
> I might be new but I think that flaming is NOT allowed so please don't try to troll along and catch everyone in a giant debate about stupid little plastic cups. I will not be giving my opinion on the topic because I believe that this thread is completely useless and should be locked and deleted form the forum. Thanks for listening.
> All due respect,
> Goldyfish


i don't see a point of locking this topic. if you think this is a debate over a stupid little plastic cups, then please read the post carefully. this is not about a cup but this is about a betta's living environment. if you think debate about betta's environment, i don't see a point why we should share our opinion about food and how to care for betta because it is only about a stupid little fish that worth only $3 according to your point of locking this post.

everybody's opinion is important. as long as nobody offend another person, i don't see a point of banning a friendly debate.


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## maxpayne_lhp

> everybody's opinion is important. as long as nobody offend another person, i don't see a point of banning a friendly debate.


_Good point! At least there're no arguements over this thread.. it's simply opinion-sharing.


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## Guest

I am sure this is a very old topic but I just joined and have a little something to ad. 
My two cents
I just started with fish about two months ago. I had a couple of goldfish from wal-mart, They got ich and died quikley. I am sure my water was fine. 
Then I got my betta from petco. I put him in a 2 gal with filter and airator.
Aside from jumping into the filter he is fine. I just fixed that prob by putting panty hose over my filter and making sure the water level is always above the top so if he jumps he can still get back to deeper water.

Any way I am glad to see I am not the only one who feels keeping bettas in confined spaces is inhumane. I used to be a cashier at wal-mart and a lot of people bought them to put in a small vase. It angered me but I could not say a thing. 
My betta had crincled fins when I got him so I think they should at least increase the hight of the cup a little. He is happy and swims around a lot. When I am ready to move my 2 female platys he will probably get their 5 gal, the 2 gal will go to quarantine. I think he is just too active for even a 2 gal. up and down side to side all day.

Anyway thanks for showing me that I was not wronge in beleiving he needs space.


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## *GoGoGo Fish!*

okay, everyone settle down again. Its just everyones oppinion. I would say, that the bettas are fine in the cups for a day or two. Some pet stores put the betta into the like 1 gallon tank on the sides, in the back of the aquariums. Some keep them in the plastic cups that are small or even kind of big cups or even glass bowls. They go into the pet store from the ship ment and then are sold. Probably there for two days. Usually all are gone buy then. Bettas really are popular for people who just started keeping fish or good for first fish or pet.


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## lwstinkinsweet

At the meijer near me, they keep bettas in topless tall non-deli cups. I heard bettas are good jumpers but dont know for sure since i only got into fish a few days ago. they said you dont go home with the cup. the bettas there had tails that looked chewed up...i was thinking tail rot. mine definitely had tail rot and fin rot and ich. i got him at the local walmart. mine looked the healthiest. those ones were in little deli cups. the only thing i would think that was good for would be when you need to put them somewhere to clean their tank/bowl. mine was very sick and the ones at meijer with no room were pretty sick looking too. their cups are barely big enough for them to fit in without curling up...i dont like them


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## lwstinkinsweet

I guess it all comes down to if they change the water and such but they still seem pretty cramped in those tiny cups. had i known more about bettas i would not have taken mine back so soon, but i only just joined. i want to get a new one and would love to go through a local breeder but how can i find one of those?


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## lwstinkinsweet

Bettaman said:


> It's the negligent care of the Bettas as well. I've seen stores stack these Betta cups so deep on shelves that the majority of the Bettas in the tiny cups get no daylight for days and days. Then they keep the lights on in the stores 24 hours and so the Bettas in the front of the shelves get no night time and by the way, Bettas have no eyelids. That is just completely neglectful, irrisponsible, and absolute abusive conduct. And why? All to make a buck. Disgusting!



I didnt know bettas had to have a night time and left my tank light on all day and night. could that have had anything to do with it staying so sick? does that stress them out? i know when people dont get enough rest they dont heal very quick. maybe the light was why he hung out under his filter so much


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## AshleytheGreat

I love getting fish at Meijer. No one ever helps you out or comes when u ding-a-ling the bell so you can fish the fish out urself. Not to mention u can wright doen the wrong barcode.


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## mlefev

Well you shouldn't be doing that, but that's pretty funny.


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## Lexus

Used to do that all the time when I worked in pets... we dont make anything off them anyways... saved me some cash


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## lwstinkinsweet

haha that is really funny...our meijer is much better than our walmart as far as having someone help you. but at meijer today i saw a betta (male) with a stub of a tail and it was very obviously eaten or rotted away and i told an employee and she said 'oh no that is how they are supposed to work' like i am about to buy a fish from someone that thinks that is correct. it was seriously bad


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## Lexus

What is "meijer"???


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## lwstinkinsweet

it is a store similar to walmart that is based in grand rapids michigan. i dont know how far reaching the chain is but it has groceries clothes electronics fish etc...a supermarket. its funny how things are so big in one state and not another


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## lwstinkinsweet

Baby_Baby said:


> really? at the wali world here, the water for bettas is like yello green and brown. its really nasty



i think it is hilarious that you call it wali world. :shock: my sister and her friend call it that and got our whole families saying it. anytime we say that to anyone else they look at us like we are from mars "what is wali world?"  they ask. i never knew anyone else called it that. We loooove wali world except for their pet department it pretty much sucks at least around here


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## AshleytheGreat

WHats "wali-world" . Sounds like a cool place to be. LOL


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## lwstinkinsweet

wali world is walmart...just a fun name for it


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## AshleytheGreat

Ahh we dont call it Walmart. We call it "The Cracked out Store on Opdyke"


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## aaa

lwstinkinsweet said:


> it is a store similar to walmart that is based in grand rapids michigan. i dont know how far reaching the chain is but it has groceries clothes electronics fish etc...a supermarket. its funny how things are so big in one state and not another


i don't know there is such a store until you guys talk about it.... it is all wal-mart in texas.


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## Lexus

We call walmart WallyWorld and Target Tarjay (Tarrrr zay)


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## Im totally me

Anybody who is going to side with the PetStores who kill off their Bettas is just plain a heartless person. We are not blabbing when we talk about the cruelty to Bettas. Bettas are different than other fish. Mine so reflect me that it amazes me. The Pet stores don't need that many Bettas. Not that many people buy them. I always see 20-30 Bettas in the back room who don't even need to be there. They aren't being bought, and there ares still 15 of them out front. Whats the point? I have a freind who has rescued 6 bettas from her local PetCo and everyone of them needed a lot of care. I rescued a baby Betta with a bladder problem. He was so tiny and they fed him to much, I cured him in 1 day, yet he would have died if I hadn't taken him home. 

If you want to side with them go ahead, but don't let me hear you, I'm sensitive, and have a hot temper when it comes to Bettas, just cause someone wants to be cruel a cold, doesn't mean everybody else should to. 

_________________________________________________________________________-Treat others the way you want to be treated = Let thyself be treated as thou treat others
-unknown


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## Lexus

Well here I go again.... I worked for Walmart pets for over a year and still have a hand in what they do now. We sell over 150-200 bettas a WEEK at our store. Maybe your store doesnt but we sure do. Now there is no need to fly off your handle. Yes I agree many stores dont properly take care of them, whether it be feeding or water changes.


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## lwstinkinsweet

I just got a new betta at the local petco. I talked to them about their care and they assured me they change the water regularly and ALL of their fish looked very healthy(at least better than the ones at the local supermarket). they check them for diseases and treat them every time they do a water change. and they dont sell those ones until they are better. I think that it probably varies from store to store. I am sure many walmarts take better care of their fish than our wali world does and i am sure many places take worse care than our local petco. I think that everyone everywhere should take better care of the little guys, but i dont necisarrily see a BIG cup being the problem. Yes, the cup contributes to the problem but i think there are many more factors to it because my new betta looks sooooooo much better than the healthiest one in the local wali world (the one i bought who had at least two disease) and meijer did.


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## mlefev

It depends a lot on the store, honestly. If the people that work there keep fish, you'll have healthy fish. If people think fish are just a form of dinner, you're in trouble. A petsmart near my old apartment had a girl that was a fishkeeper/breeder and she was great for info and kept the stock healthy. One guy at the petco near me was great too. Now I'm living 5 miles from the best fish store in the world...all their fish are healthy. It's boasted to be one of the largest fish stores in the country, and they take good care of their fish.


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## mlefev

Lexus said:


> We call walmart WallyWorld and Target Tarjay (Tarrrr zay)


Most us californians call it wallyworld too. it just fits. Oh yeah, and Tarjay too...gotta do that...lol. I havent called either by their proper names in years.


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## lwstinkinsweet

we call target tarGAY because i had a friend who worked there and that is what the employees called it
or maybe it was jsut him. now he works at koegel and calls it ye olde hotdog factory


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## Im totally me

Well, that is fine at your Wal-Mart, as long as they are sold. But here in Santa Fe, they are not sold very often, I have come back a week later and seen the same Betta. They die, I tell a worker, "oh, well, I will talk to the manager about that". Never happens. Maybe where you work they sell them, but your store does not represent the fish places of America. Sorry, but 1 good store does not make all stores good. 

I'm sick of seeing dead Bettas, because they had to spend a week in a tiny cup full of ****. And its just not the cup part, I told them that letting the Bettas live in the cups was OK, as long as they put more water in and kept the water clean. What did the manager say? "Oh, its supposed to be 1/3 full of water, otherwise they don't have enough space below the lid to breath". NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! That may be true, but they could have filled it much fuller. Like 2/3 full. No, the thing is, they get paid per hour, so what the heck do they care how many fish die, they still get paid. You want to know how smart their "experts" are? There is a 60+ year old lady their, who used to have her own PetStore, she put a male Betta in with the females, and sold it to me saying it was a female. I told her, no, this is a male, note the slightly longer fins, and no other female has this, but their are males that have this. "oh no, its a female, I'm sure". Yea right, it wasn't, I got 2 other people that worked there that agreed with me. That is the type of people that work for PetStores. No wonder she doesn't own a PetStore any more!

Once, I bought a female Betta and a Diamond Tetra, to share a tank, they told me they would get along great. They didn't, they hated each other. I went back, talked to the same girl, what does she say? "Oh, no wonder, those fish can't live together". Thanks a lot for telling me they could a month earlier!

Now, maybe your good to the Bettas, if so, will you move here, and work in the fish department??? We need you!!!!


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## Josh

First I got a question
If female bettas are not so aggresive why do they keep those in cups at walmart too?  
I mean its not like the people that buy bettas at walmart are going to breed them lol :???: :???:

And also I like meijer's fish waaaay more then wallyworlds fish too, i mean there just a lot cleaner and a little more variety, at least in my walmart for those people in Michigan, I go to the mt.pleasent area one or traverse city...
I did have one good algea eater that live like 2 years from walmart, but everything else dies within a month lol... 
:help:


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## Lexus

Depends which walmart you are at, we keep our females in a tank together not in cups.


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## lwstinkinsweet

yet again we come back to the point that it depends on the store, not the chain name or anything. it is the specific location


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## LydiaGreen

lwstinkinsweet said:


> yet again we come back to the point that it depends on the store, not the chain name or anything. it is the specific location


Sorry, but I have to disagree with you there. I don't know about American Walmarts, but in Canada, they rotate the staff through the different departments. We might have a GREAT pet department manager for six months and then they rotate the staff and BOOM - we have a SUPREME IDIOT in the pet department who has no clue! That's a corporate policy, meaning that it happens in all of the Canadian Walmarts. And it's ridiculous! If you get someone in pets who is good at it -- leave them there!!! Nope, they rotate the staff and the fishkeeping customers have to start educating the newbie... it's sad for the fish, the inexperienced fishkeepers, and the experienced fishkeepers who have to deal with the incompetence... and it's not the newbie's fault either - it's the corporation.

And, the bettas stay in those small cups WITHOUT water changes at our Walmart. I just bought my third betta this afternoon - how did I choose him? Not by colour - I bought the one in the cup with the most %#*^ in it!!!


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## lwstinkinsweet

well our walmart is similar. no water changes no one to ever help no one knows what they are talking about etc. but Lexus worked in a walmart and took good care of her bettas there. So that shows that there are some stores of walmart and some periods of time where walmart does well with their fish. I bought mine at a petco and it is doing great so far, way better than my first one from walmart. I think that it really depends on the location of the store and the people working in it, whether they know what they are doing or not. i think it is totally wrong how they treat them in many places, but i am just saying you cant say ALL walmarts ALWAYS have sick bettas because they NEVER take care of them because there are exceptions


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## Imbrium

They don't do that rotation thing at the Walmart nearest to me, I don't know about others in the area. My Walmart does take horrible care of it's fish though. Luckily the PetSmart near me is great, and the lfs is incredibly wonderful.


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## Josh

I'm angry again at the walmart n00bs (at least the one in my area)
There were more dead fish in the tanks there today, and what do i see?
The worker just scoops the dead fish out and goes about her business...doesnt do anything at all to the tank, not to mention theres a gold fish tank that has like 40sumthin goldfish in a small 5 gallon, about 15 are dead and floating and no one has done anything about it for the past week, i almost wanted to ask her if i could just clean the tank LOL.
:withstup:


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## Im totally me

Thats how it is at my Wal-Mart. When I talked to the manager, she said that the workers are only allowed to take care of the fish after there other work is done! No wonder they are dying off! Every time I point a dead fish out, they remove and put it in the trash, they don't quick, take care of the other fish or talk to someone about fixing them! When I was 12, I bought 2 fish from them, and put them in a tank with my Goldfish. Withing 1 day they died, and within 3 more days, they killed of all 5 of the fish that had been living in the tank!


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## lwstinkinsweet

The petsupplies plus in my town had a dead fish (i dont know what kind) that was being sucked on by two scum suckers (i hope no one gets offended that i call them that. i dont know their real names as i am new to fish). i told the lady at the counter and she said and i quote "i will see if there is anything i can do about that. i might have to scoop the dead fish out if they dont eat it all up." i work in a daycare and we have a tank (dont know how big) that has a lot of fish in it. we have a little potting cup like decoration tipped on it's side for them to hide in. once a fish died in there so we didnt notice it until the other fish had been in there to eat it enough times that only the skeleton floated to the top once it was knocked out of the cup. i felt so bad. my boss doesnt take good care of the fish tank. i never know if the fish have been fed or not, but she pays me to take care of the kids not the fish she tells me every time i express my concern over their welfare. her husband came in to clean the tank. he said "first of all, you need to have me do this more often. it has been like a year since it's been cleaned. second, your scum sucker is way too big for this tank and your guppies are breeding like crazy and you cannot have this many fish in here." so he took some home to put in one of his tanks. "luckily" one of the kids bought us four fish and four frogs for our tank when f was the letter of the week....they came from...you guessed it...wallyworld. and only one of those ones is still alive. all the others died and they killed off a lot of our guppies. but we stilll have a LOT


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## Im totally me

Oh, thats soooo sad about the fish. I don't know why people don't take there being a dead fish as a warning sign that somthing is wrong. Any time a fish is even so much as lathargic, I get really worried, I don't understand how they can still be so careless when a fish dies!
:withstup:


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## Lexus

Walmart in the US does not rotate department managers, we do however rotate assistant managers every 6 months. The fish tanks are not 5g they are believe it or not 15G. Believe it or not a lot of people dont care about fish. Our Pet Department Manager knows a lot about fish and he takes good care of them, we actually have a lady that comes in to specifically take care of the fish on Wednesday and Sunday. Fish are fed and treated in the morning, that is the first thing to get done. 
Wal-Mart is Wal-Mart, unless the whole world protests they will continue to sell fish, its not the profit we make off of them (because there is none) its the fact that it gets people in the door, makes the kids happy and that its a one stop shop. Fish constantly die in LFS and Wal-Marts because of shipping, ph alteration, diseases and everything else under the sun, its nature you cant stop it. All Wal-Marts are given Melafix and Quick Cure plus Aquarium salt under our 99 Supplies (which is free to us). We also recieve a nasty yellow Fungus cure by Jungle. In my experience of working with the fish there, you can treat and water change til you are water logged and tired and some fish just wont survive. Many of you havnt really thought of where the fish come from and their situations... the supplier. 99% of the time the fish are sick past the point of treatment before they hit the store. If you think about it these fish are in overcrowded huge concrete pools and basically they get fed ect... then the people working the line scoop the desired amount of fish in the bag for shipment. The fish are packed 2 DAYS in advance, so these fish have to endure that on top of it, then the delivery truck is usually too hot or cold, then they arrive. Most LFS policy is to not take sick fish, well at Walmart we would prefer not to too but then half the time the fish guy comes when your not around, puts the fish in the tank and leaves. And boy if you think Walmart Associates are dumb talk to the fish guy, the fish came in mislabeled on the bag, they were honey dwarfs and it said neon dwarf on it, I told the guy that they were mislabeled and he told me that neons can differ in color because of the season. BULL I was mad but its just the people you have to deal with in low end jobs. We at Walmart are paid to stock the product and sell it not really have feelings. You know how many times I get dead fish out of the tank at Walmart? every half hour, most pet departments do not have enough people to do this and when they dont they pile up. Basically when I moved to sporting goods, I asked the assistant manager what about pets ( I left only the manager and fish lady to run it) he said it will be fine, pets doesnt need anyone. Pets is not a priority, it doesnt have a lot of sales. To walmart there are many other places needing covering. Its just life. Not to be mean but I say if your upset with it then you go work at Walmart and fix it yourself. You'll soon realize you dont get paid near enough to really care about your job.


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## 1nemo

For sure... bettas have no eyelids. They need darkness to sleep comfortably. Otherwise, yes, lack of sleep causes a weakened immune system and disease.
Give them darkness at night.


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## lwstinkinsweet

well the point you are trying to make, Lexus, is true but it seems to be exactly the problem everyone is pointing out.


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## Im totally me

Its not the fishes fault that the stupid store owners don't pay the workers enough to care, and its not the fishes fault that the workers aren't working there because they care.
:withstup: 

I have a freind who is 16, shes a genius, she finished high-school last year and is in college. She is the manager at a PetStore, and she raises her own Bettas, they are gorgeous. They sell between $5 and $30. People buy them, the veil tails, who are commonly sold at $4 are more expensive because they are healthy and colorful. She is making the statment that Bettas are easy to keep, true. Hers are, you don't have to buy medicine, or spend hours on the internet figuring out what sickness fishy brought home. She doesn't get paid what shes worth, and unfortunatley, she has to do most of the work herself. People ask for her when they come to buy fish. They want to know things about keeping fish. She knows the RIGHT answers. It makes the other workers mad, but so what, maybe they will learn that healthy fish sell. She has lots of people working way older than her working under her. But thats how it should be if they don't know anything.

Oh yes, and fish, by the way, are not toys. Pet Stores shouldn't sell them so that kids can get a kick out of them. Fish are not ornaments that can be bought cheap, and thrown away when broken. That is not a good excuse. 
:withstup: 

Hey 1nemo, tell everyone about what you have told PetCo and PetsMart. Maybe they will want your info. I have already used it, they are taking a little better care of the fish, not much, but I haven't given up yet!


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## maxpayne_lhp

> I have a freind who is 16, shes a genius, she finished high-school last year and is in college. She is the manager at a PetStore, and she raises her own Bettas, they are gorgeous. They sell between $5 and $30. People buy them, the veil tails, who are commonly sold at $4 are more expensive because they are healthy and colorful. She is making the statment that Bettas are easy to keep, true. Hers are, you don't have to buy medicine, or spend hours on the internet figuring out what sickness fishy brought home. She doesn't get paid what shes worth, and unfortunatley, she has to do most of the work herself. People ask for her when they come to buy fish. They want to know things about keeping fish. She knows the RIGHT answers. It makes the other workers mad, but so what, maybe they will learn that healthy fish sell. She has lots of people working way older than her working under her. But thats how it should be if they don't know anything.


Sounds good! If I am around, I'll stick to such place... Wise beginners will choose a good dealer, who will listen and help. I know some other aquarists' fish stores and they thrive quite well!


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## honmol

I don't know how old this thread is but I'll post anyways. People don't respect bettas. They wouldn't put a dog in a tiny crate. they wouldn't throw a kitten in the trash. They wouldn't make a baby live without diaper changes. Fish can feel pain. They can also feel fear. How would you feel if you grew up in something the size of a bathtub? Humans tend to look at fish as disposable. Especially bettas. :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair: :chair:


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## solar-ton

well, bettas do live in places larger than a cup but even tough they are very aggressive tworad eachother doesnt mean they should be kept there.AND when theyre bought theyre just kept in 1 gallon containers and 90% of them die its the same with oscars theyre just stuck in a 10 and fed feeders til they die in a month

god wheres simpte and kelicom when you need them


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## sollie7

I think you are somewhat wrong. Do you know people buy bettas just because they are in small containers? If bettas are in small containers people buy them more. People buy them more because they feel sorry for them thats how pets stores like Petsmart make money off of bettas. Just yesterday I bought a betta at petsmart for four dollars. you know why I bought it? I bought it because i felt sorry for it. It's not right to put bettas in little containers. when they really should be in one at least 1 gallon.


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## Guest

I worked in a specialty betta store for 2 years. We moved 2-3 thousand bettas a month. 

Ok....where in the heck do you think all these fish should be kept? Look at it from a business stand point.... Why would you take up a large space with 1 gallon jars that could be used for product that brings in WAY more $ per capita than bettas? It's easier fo customers to view the bettas in cups than jars.....it's easier to change the water (and when dealing with 1,500+ bettas thats something you have got to consider). I used to breed bettas as my sole source of income.....when I did it I just kept fish in thier grow out ponds/tanks until a few weeks before I sold them. The fish won't fight if left in the pond they grew up in....maybe a few nips here andthere...but nothing serious. Also, don't get so upset with the way fish are kept in stores. The tanks there are just holding pens....temporary.....the fish aren't idealy supposed to be at the store more than a few weeks. Think about the big picture and put things in perspective before you go on rants.

When all is said and done....realistically the cups are a better choice.


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## Osiris

well guess the ranting must go on. on a side note i have 14" of snow outside


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## Fishfirst

14" thats nothin


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## Fishfirst

try 2.5'! Drifts suck


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