# cycling a bettah tank



## Shadow (Mar 14, 2005)

Hello,
I planning on getting some betta (2-3) from Faith on Betta Talk( these are going to be expensive fish, I might spend up to $50 of each fish, thus I don't want any of them to die). I have a 20H gallon divided tank ( and I have no other established tank) I'm planning on putting them in. I have just about everything I need except I haven't cycled. I had planned on doing a fishless cycle with pure ammonia. I've been all over the net and everthing about fishless cycling is contradicting. On thing says use plants to speed up the process another says plants will only slow it down. One says put some ammonia in a wait a week then add more another says add it every day , and so on and so forth. Can anyone explain the process to me very clearly? But do I even have to cycle? Two betta in a 20 gallon doesn't seem like they'd make much waste and I've been told I might not have to. The breeder I'm getting them from says she has never cycled a tank and never had a problem. What should I do? I'm so confused. 
Thanks in advance.


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## mousey (Jan 18, 2005)

plants in a cycling tank is actually a contradiction in some senses. Yes it does speed up the process and no it doesn't. You have to use very fast growing plants like hornwort and wisteria in large quantities to soak up the ammonia produced by the fish.Therefore the bacteria you need in your tank cannot reproduce as fast a they need to to keep up with a LOT of ammonia. That said, if you have to cycle a tank real fast( if your old tank leaks and you have a full load of fish you have to move) Plants are a big help to keeping the water parameters lower and thus protect the fish. When you want to put in better plants IE rooted ones , You gradually put in the better plants and slowly remove the fast growing over a number of weeks. For example, I have discovered that the hornwort grows very rapidly as it sucks up the ammonia, but the java fern seems to prefer later stages of the cycling process and sucks up the nitrates. Then the hornwort slows down growing.
I like to cycle all my tanks, and yes the bettas need the tank cycled. They actually are good little poop machines, I have never actually seen them pooping yet but there is always plenty in their containers every couple of days.
Despite what the breeder says, she must have some way of keeping the water parameters safe for the fish. Perhaps she has a good circulating filtration system where the water is always being changed, or perhaps she has well water or what ever. 
most of us in cities get tap water and it has been treated with chloramines( chlorine and ammonia compound) The water conditioner you put into the tank or water splits the chloramine into chlorine and ammonia. The chlorine dissipates into the air leaving you with ammonia. If your water is hard the ammonia remaining will be toxic to the fish. If it is soft water it is ammonium which is not toxic. So much depends on PH, hardness and what comes out of the tap.
you need to find these things out. If you have hard water use something like Amquel, Ammolock or Prime and you can bypass all those other chemicals. A regular water conditioner does not neutralize ammonia. Your fish do not need aloe in the water!The important thing is to make it as safe as possible for the fish.
Here is the formula for fishless cycling
20 -24 drops of pure ammonia ( some has perfumes in it and therefor is not pure)daily until you get nitrites.
Then reduce the ammonia to 12-16 drops daily until you have no ammonia and nitrites 2 hours after adding daily dose.
To speed up the process raise the temp. of the water to the high 80's and add old tank media( contains bacteria). Then drop the temp to the desired setting. Do a large water change. next day add a few fish. Add fish slowly over the next few weeks to allow the bacteria to keep pace with the new load of ammonia the fish create.
Good luck
MOUSE


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## Damon (Jan 18, 2005)

Incorrect. (I guess that is strike 5) Plants CANNOT outcompete bacteria for Nh3 or No2 or even No3. Bacteria will always win out. The plants will utilize whatever the bacteria cannot use during the cycle. So in actualit, they will not speed up your cycle but will keep ammonia out of your tank (or at least limit it depending on the plants in your tank) until the bacterial colony is established. Only one way to speed up a cycle. Add more bacteria. Note products like cycle do not work. To my knowledge, bio-spira is the only additive that works. Planting heavy is the way to go. This will also help keep algae at bay. Aponogeton, Wisteria, Watersprite, Asia Ambulia, Ludwigia as well as most stem plants will use more excess ammonia than others will but ANY plant will help.


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## MyraVan (Jan 19, 2005)

> Plants CANNOT outcompete bacteria for Nh3 or No2 or even No3. Bacteria will always win out. The plants will utilize whatever the bacteria cannot use during the cycle.


This is useful to know. I've just finished cycling a heavily planted tank in my office. During the cycling, the ammonia and nitrite never got over 0.5 ppm, which is pretty good for a cycling tank. I had worried that I didn't have a full complement of bacteria because the hornwort had used it all up. It's reassuring to know that the bacteria got it first, and so I have as much bacteria now as if I had done a cycle without any plants. Hornwort has proved its usefulness to this tank! Now I'm planting more attractive plants and slowly throwing the hornwort away.

BTW, the mousey's message seems to confuse the issue of chlorine/chloramine and cycling. The two issues are completely separate. To deal with chlorine/chloramine you use a water conditioner. I use Tetra aqua-safe, which neutralizes chlorine/chloramine completely, including the ammonia resulting from breaking up the chloramine. (but it won't neutralize all the ammonia in a cycling tank). You should use a water conditioner whether or not your tank is cycled.

This is completly different from cycling a tank. During cycling of a tank, you get alot of ammonia in the water because fish waste contains it, and the bacteria that consume it haven't had a chance to grow enough yet. During cycling you will get much high concentrations of ammonia than you get from chloramine in your tap water.

And mousey's "20 -24 drops of pure ammonia" per day is not a reliable guide, since different ammonia products have different concentrations of amminia. See
http://www.tropicalfishcentre.co.uk/Fishlesscycle.htm
for more info.


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## Damon (Jan 18, 2005)

Well put Myra and a nice link to boot!


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## mousey (Jan 18, 2005)

I took a lot of my info about the ammonia drops from a planted tank forum.
I agree with what you say about the ammonia in the tap water being different than the ammonia from the fish, but sometimes after a water change we get a reading of ammonia despite using conditioner.Depends on the water hardness. The fact remains I think, that the tank should be cycled even for the bettas, and the other info is something that needs one to be aware of in fish keeping.
I was also told that having a planted tank means there is no such event as "cycling" a tank.
Mouse


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## Damon (Jan 18, 2005)

I'm not sure who told you planted tanks don't cycle, but they are seriously mistaken.  All aquariums cycle.  They all have nitrifying bacteria in them and thus always win out over plants.  There are 2 forms of ammonia in tap water.  Ammonia and ammonium, which is a bonded form of ammonia and hydrogen just like chlorine and chloramines (chlorine and ammonia).  A lot depends on the ph of your tank also.  I don't get ammonia readings after a water change either.


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## garfieldnfish (Jan 18, 2005)

Am I missing something here? A 20 gal with 3 small betas should never be a problem to cycle, considering the small bowls the betas are keep in in the stores. A 20 gal even during the cycling phase has to have better water quality then a few ounces of water in a cup. I would not worry and toss all three into the 20 gal at the same time. They can cycle the tank just fine, since they breath air at the surface anyway. 
Please correct me if I'm wrong, I have no betas but it just seem logical to me. And plants are alway beneficicial.


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